Looking for feedback on my ICP Results

SaltwaterScoop

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Tank Specs - 230ish gallons (2x 40 gallon breeders plumbed into a Waterbox 180.5)
I am mostly keeping LPS, but I might start dabbling into some SPS soon. It has been running for about a year.

I just got back my ICP test results back from ATI. I'm wanting to start dosing major/minor elements and do an ICP test every 2-3 months to monitor. The only thing I'm dosing is soda ash daily for maintaining alkalinity. My Calcium and Magnesium have always been in range without dosing. After receiving my results, I plan to dose Iodine, Potassium, Molybdenum, Zinc, Manganese, and I might try Rubidium to experiment.

Is there anything else I am not thinking about and should address? :face-with-monocle:

SymbolValueCalculated reference valueDifference
Base elements
Salinity34.61 PSU35.00 PSU-0.39 PSU
Carbonate hardness8.78 °dKH7.50 °dKH+1.28 °dKH
Major elements
Chloride19663 mg/l19362 mg/l+301.2 mg/l
Sodium10589 mg/l10757 mg/l-167.3 mg/l
Magnesium1493 mg/l1286 mg/l+206.6 mg/l
Sulfur896.9 mg/l899.6 mg/l-2.79 mg/l
Calcium475.4 mg/l411.7 mg/l+63.74 mg/l
Potassium397.8 mg/l399.0 mg/l-1.18 mg/l
Bromine98.33 mg/l65.52 mg/l+32.81 mg/l
Strontium10.93 mg/l7.82 mg/l+3.11 mg/l
Boron5.88 mg/l4.30 mg/l+1.58 mg/l
Fluorine1.26 mg/l1.27 mg/l-0.01 mg/l
Minor elements
Lithium432.3 µg/l166.2 µg/l+266.0 µg/l
Silicon162.1 µg/l97.79 µg/l+64.30 µg/l
Iodine23.61 µg/l63.56 µg/l-39.95 µg/l
Barium34.34 µg/l9.78 µg/l+24.56 µg/l
Molybdenum3.41 µg/l11.73 µg/l-8.32 µg/l
Nickelu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
Manganeseu.0.98 µg/l-0.98 µg/l
Arsenicu.1.47 µg/l-1.47 µg/l
Berylliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Chromeu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
Cobaltu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Ironu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
Copper1.29 µg/l0.49 µg/l+0.80 µg/l
Seleniumu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
Silveru.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Vanadium1.23 µg/l1.47 µg/l-0.23 µg/l
Zincu.1.96 µg/l-1.96 µg/l
Tin38.97 µg/l0.49 µg/l+38.48 µg/l
Nutrients
Nitrate7.29 mg/l2.00 mg/l+5.29 mg/l
Phosphorus11.71 µg/l14.67 µg/l-2.96 µg/l
Phosphate0.04 mg/l0.04 mg/l-0.01 mg/l
Pollutants
Aluminium7.46 µg/l0.10 µg/l+7.37 µg/l
Antimonyu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Bismuthu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Leadu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Cadmiumu.0.20 µg/l-0.20 µg/l
Lanthanumu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
Thalliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Titaniumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Tungstenu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
Mercuryu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l

Thanks!
 

Randy Holmes-Farley

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Tin is high. Are corals seemingly OK? Tin can sometimes apparently come from plastics.

You might benefit from a trace element supplement. (or not).

Otherwise, nothing jumps out at me.
 
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SaltwaterScoop

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Tin is high. Are corals seemingly OK? Tin can sometimes apparently come from plastics.

You might benefit from a trace element supplement. (or not).

Otherwise, nothing jumps out at me.
Thanks for the input! They seem ok for the most part.

I did have a yellow torch detach it's polyps randomly a few months back.

The other torch corals are not extending as far as I'd like but Zoas seem fine, frogspawn/hammers are good, and a rainbow monti frag I just got is still looking ok. The only questionable plastic I can think of is the hydromaxx plumbing I used for the 40 gallons or maybe the braided vinyl tubing from my return pump. Is this something I should try to eliminate/lower with water changes or carbon?

DSC_1210.jpg


What do you think of individually dosing the lower elements to bring them up and then starting like 14 ml/day of Seachem Reef Trace Elements to maintain the trace elements (I have a spare 1.1 ml/day peristaltic pump)?
 
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Randy Holmes-Farley

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Hey Randy!
Do you have the source of it?
Thanks!

Some folks have fingered certain types of tubing, but I do not recall which brands. I'm not sure we have a good handle on the types. Tin is used as a heat stabilizer in some types of plastics.
 
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I plumbed in the 40s back in March with all new flexible PVC and new PVC fittings so I'm leaning towards that being the culprit. I'm planning to do some water changes and maybe running Continuum Aquatics Power Cleanse HM.

If it's plumbing related, the leeching should subside with time...right? :grimacing-face:
 
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SaltwaterScoop

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I ordered another ICP test. I have been soaking some pieces of the flex PVC plumbing I used on the 40s in RO/DI water and plan to send that in as my RO sample to see if I can find the source of the leeching tin.

I've done 2x 15% water changes, and I've been running carbon and polyfilter since my results came back so maybe my tin levels have dropped some.

I have also been daily dosing trace elements after doing some slight corrective doses.

I plan to send in my water samples this Friday. Anything else I should consider?
 
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Found this on one of the 40's MP10 wetside...
PXL_20230808_024430624.jpg

Do y'all think it could've caused anything? I ordered 2 new wetsides to replace them because I got them used. I'm still leaning towards the flex plumbing though.
 
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SaltwaterScoop

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New ICP came back and I'm at a loss. Tin is still elevated and came back higher than before at 46.21 µg/l vs 38.97 µg/l.
My RO sample with the flex PVC came back with 0 Tin after soaking in RO water for 2 weeks.

That was after 2 decent sized 50g water changes over 2 weeks and running Polyfilter. I have since replaced those 2 MP10 wet sides but that amount of rust couldn't have been it, right?

What should I be looking for next?
 

Randy Holmes-Farley

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Ro water may be different in extracting whatever tin form is present than is seawater, but it also may be coming from somewhere else. The change you note may also be random testing error and it is not still rising.

Are there other plastic parts such as pvc present?
 
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SaltwaterScoop

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Ro water may be different in extracting whatever tin form is present than is seawater, but it also may be coming from somewhere else. The change you note may also be random testing error and it is not still rising.

Are there other plastic parts such as pvc present?
Thanks for the info! That is good to know.

I have a a lot of PVC in the sump area:
1692304866157.png

1692305200908.png

My auto feeder came with a black piece of PVC to direct the food into the water column. It was too short so I added that white piece of PVC to reach the sump water. I used the shorter black piece to angle the return pump towards the auto feeder output. I also have a Schedule 80 elbow to redirect the skimmer output downwards into the sump.

Do you think it's worth removing any of those?

I also used several PVC fittings when I plumbed in my 40 gallon breeders back in April:
1692304898745.png

I also regularly use these when working in the tank:
1692305679877.png
 
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Found this on one of the 40's MP10 wetside...
PXL_20230808_024430624.jpg

Do y'all think it could've caused anything? I ordered 2 new wetsides to replace them because I got them used. I'm still leaning towards the flex plumbing though.
Not seen exactly the same but the wetsides on my MP40's have come apart before and the magnets were rusting. Ecotech recommends cleaning with vinegar but IMO worst thing you can do with plastics. Stick to cleaning with citric acid. Not had a problem since I switched to citric acid.
 
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SaltwaterScoop

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Here are the results of the latest ICP:
SymbolValueCalculated reference valueDifference
Base elements
Salinity35.88 PSU35.00 PSU+0.88 PSU
Carbonate hardness8.19 °dKH7.50 °dKH+0.69 °dKH
Major elements
Chloride20411 mg/l20101 mg/l+310.7 mg/l
Sodium10994 mg/l11167 mg/l-172.6 mg/l
Magnesium1488 mg/l1335 mg/l+152.8 mg/l
Sulfur949.0 mg/l934.0 mg/l+15.05 mg/l
Calcium474.2 mg/l427.4 mg/l+46.78 mg/l
Potassium413.2 mg/l414.2 mg/l-0.96 mg/l
Bromine100.3 mg/l68.02 mg/l+32.33 mg/l
Strontium11.19 mg/l8.12 mg/l+3.07 mg/l
Boron5.97 mg/l4.47 mg/l+1.51 mg/l
Fluorine1.20 mg/l1.32 mg/l-0.12 mg/l
Minor elements
Lithium432.6 µg/l172.6 µg/l+260.0 µg/l
Silicon107.2 µg/l101.5 µg/l+5.67 µg/l
Iodine37.16 µg/l65.99 µg/l-28.82 µg/l
Barium35.31 µg/l10.15 µg/l+25.16 µg/l
Molybdenum14.09 µg/l12.18 µg/l+1.91 µg/l
Nickelu.0.51 µg/l-0.51 µg/l
Manganeseu.1.02 µg/l-1.02 µg/l
Arsenicu.1.52 µg/l-1.52 µg/l
Berylliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Chromeu.0.51 µg/l-0.51 µg/l
Cobaltu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Ironu.0.51 µg/l-0.51 µg/l
Copperu.0.51 µg/l-0.51 µg/l
Seleniumu.0.51 µg/l-0.51 µg/l
Silveru.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Vanadium1.43 µg/l1.52 µg/l-0.09 µg/l
Zinc2.93 µg/l2.03 µg/l+0.90 µg/l
Tin46.21 µg/l0.51 µg/l+45.70 µg/l
Nutrients
Nitrate4.42 mg/l2.00 mg/l+2.42 mg/l
Phosphorus15.87 µg/l15.23 µg/l+0.64 µg/l
Phosphate0.05 mg/l0.05 mg/l+0 mg/l
Pollutants
Aluminium13.00 µg/l0.10 µg/l+12.90 µg/l
Antimonyu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Bismuthu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Leadu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Cadmiumu.0.20 µg/l-0.20 µg/l
Lanthanumu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
Thalliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Titaniumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
Tungstenu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
Mercuryu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
 

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I would worry about Chinese Plastics like pumps in addition to the plumbing adding Tin, if you have any. Full disclose: I have just heard about this and don't have any firsthand experience, though.

Some salt mixes used to have high levels of Tin, but I do not think that they are all that popular anymore.

Some frozen foods can add tin, like clams and brine shrimp - I have no idea how much.
 
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SaltwaterScoop

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I would worry about Chinese Plastics like pumps in addition to the plumbing adding Tin, if you have any. Full disclose: I have just heard about this and don't have any firsthand experience, though.

Some salt mixes used to have high levels of Tin, but I do not think that they are all that popular anymore.

Some frozen foods can add tin, like clams and brine shrimp - I have no idea how much.
Definitely something to consider...

I feed 2 cubes of Hikari frozen mysis / spirulina everyday :(

I have only used Reef Crystals on this tank so far.

I know my auto feeder uses a SICCE Syncra Nano mixing pump, and I also use a SICCE Voyager Nano in the return chamber to mix any food that doesn't go immediately into the return pump. I'm not sure where SICCE sources their parts. My other pumps are all Ecotech (Vortechs and Vectra). Not sure about the Reef Octopus skimmer.
 

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If everything looks fine, I would not worry about this too much. Have you seen high Tin from a different ICP test place?

If the Tin was residue from plastic, or even glass, then it should be in the water now and coming down with water changes, or even skimming if tin binds to organics (I don't know if Tin does bind to organics, but lots of metal do). I would verify the test from another company before I dug in too much more.
 
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SaltwaterScoop

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If everything looks fine, I would not worry about this too much. Have you seen high Tin from a different ICP test place?

If the Tin was residue from plastic, or even glass, then it should be in the water now and coming down with water changes, or even skimming if tin binds to organics (I don't know if Tin does bind to organics, but lots of metal do). I would verify the test from another company before I dug in too much more.
I had a torch and a hammer randomly drop their polyps and growth seems to be stalled in the other corals for the last couple of months. That's why I decided to do the initial ICP. Maybe I'll try another company for my next one. I have only used ATI so far. Maybe I should try Triton next?

I guess it could still be tin leeching from all the new plumbing I added for the 40 gallons in April. I started weekly 15% water changes since the first ICP but before that I had only done 1 water change since adding the 40s since my nutrients were so low from the increased water volume.

Everything definitely seems to be doing better with the water changes and trace element dosing.
 
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