HOBBY GRADE TEST KITS CAN OUTPERFORM ICP MEASUREMENTS…REALLY??

[Pod_01]

Collect your sample water at least 48 hrs “after” a water change. Or before any dosing for that day.

Dosing I do understand. The water change is interesting. So you think 2 days, hmmm……

 

[rtparty]

The problem with that assumption is that the average reefer isn’t Jason Fox, Steve Tyree, or a whole who’s been in the game for years like ORA.

None of them (from what I could find) were ever ICP testing and trying to dose every trace under the sun.

Jason Fox even talks about how simple he keeps everything. Water changes is all he has mentioned from what I recall. Yet, he is pulling colors most could only ever hope for under any method. He isn’t ICP testing and dosing 38 elements

 

[rtparty]

No this implies that I had the ESV tank. It works, but keeping the whole chemistry in check works better.

ESV doesn’t claim to replace and replenish all trace elements

 

[Reefahholic]

Yes, that’s the way to do it. This gives me a dark, conspiracy-like theory. So, with no data, my conjecture is

“companies do not want to generate scientific data and share it with customers”

The thinking behind this thought is that data generated from a well controlled competition could end up sowing doubt about company claims and shake consumer confidence. Of course, a less controlled competition that keeps the company claims secure would have the reefing community down on their necks from the start.

Someone needs to win a lottery and invest it aquarium research.

Or you can talk to a guy like Polo Reef who has the lottery in his pockets right now. I wonder what method he’s using and if there’s been progression of growth and color in his tank. Haha. Check into that. ;-)

 

[Reefahholic]

ESV doesn’t claim to replace and replenish all trace elements

Exactly, and that’s why it can’t outperform.

 

[Reefahholic]

None of them (from what I could find) were ever ICP testing and trying to dose every trace under the sun.

Jason Fox even talks about how simple he keeps everything. Water changes is all he has mentioned from what I recall. Yet, he is pulling colors most could only ever hope for under any method. He isn’t ICP testing and dosing 38 elements

Yeah, but you’re talking about old school pros and veterans of our hobby. The average reefer doesn’t have that kinda of skill. It takes years of trial and error with feeding, lighting, stability, flow, etc…to master their abilities. The average hobbyist will have way better success using ICP to correct their chemistry as long as they have a good place to get solid dosing advice.

 

[rtparty]

Or you can talk to a guy like Polo Reef who has the lottery in his pockets right now. I wonder what method he’s using and if there’s been progression of growth and color in his tank. Haha. Check into that. ;-)

Did they ever correct their UV video or just keep talking about something they had no idea about?

 

[rtparty]

Yeah, but you’re talking about old school pros and veterans of our hobby. The average reefer doesn’t have that kinda of skill. It takes years of trial and error with feeding, lighting, stability, flow, etc…to master their abilities. The average hobbyist will have way better success using ICP to correct their chemistry as long as they have a good place to get solid dosing advice.

But explain how they got the colors they did without all the testing and dosing of trace elements?

They’re so pro they just get good colors with “poor” chemistry?

 

[Reefahholic]

It’s funny how 1/8 the hobby is trying to go backwards. Here we are in 2023 and the argument has become “don’t use ICP” and correct depleted elements. Lol.

That’s like saying…don’t get an oil change on your car, don’t change windshield wipers, tires, or put water in the radiator. It will be fine!

 

[jason2459]

It seems like in this decade it's all about spending more money. I was shocked to see prices right now.

 

[areefer01]

Or you can talk to a guy like Polo Reef who has the lottery in his pockets right now. I wonder what method he’s using and if there’s been progression of growth and color in his tank. Haha. Check into that. ;-)

A small public aquarium in ones house also isn't relevant to the discussion here as he had 6 or so hired staff.

 

[rtparty]

It’s funny how 1/8 the hobby is trying to go backwards. Here we are in 2023 and the argument has become “don’t use ICP” and correct depleted elements. Lol.

That’s like saying…don’t get an oil change on your car, don’t change windshield wipers, tires, or put water in the radiator. It will be fine!

Who has said “don’t do ICP tests and don’t dose”?

And I would guarantee that 7/8 of the hobby has no clue what ICP testing is

 

[Reefahholic]

But explain how they got the colors they did without all the testing and dosing of trace elements?

They’re so pro they just get good colors with “poor” chemistry?

Some pros can pull some pretty amazing colors. What I’ve noticed buying coral from some of the top sellers is that when I put the coral in my tank it looks much different that what was advertised. For sure there are some photo enhancement “masters” out there.

 

[Reefahholic]

A small public aquarium in ones house also isn't relevant to the discussion here as he had 6 or so hired staff.

Yeah, but did you see how vivid his colors got after he started the method. His growth blew up too. You can go back and look at earlier videos and compare. Staff or not, it was working.

 

[rtparty]

Some pros can pull some pretty amazing colors. What I’ve noticed buying coral from some of the top sellers is that when I put the coral in my tank it looks much different that what was advertised. For sure there are some photo enhancement “masters” out there.

Okay so they can pull amazing colors without trace elements because they’re pros at photoshop. Got it

 

[Reefahholic]

Who has said “don’t do ICP tests and don’t dose”?

And I would guarantee that 7/8 of the hobby has no clue what ICP testing is

Ok, so let’s get on the same team and grow some acros. I’ll answer any question I can.

 

[Reefahholic]

Okay so they can pull amazing colors without trace elements because they’re pros at photoshop. Got it

Yes. Many people selling corals are absolute pros using different programs for color enhancements and backgrounds. The corals will probably look much different than when you receive them. You just now finding this out bro?

 

[Thales]

Sometimes, but usually not that extreme or as often. I don’t see that much on the forums.

The forums are not the entirety of the reefing world.

 

[Thales]

Correct, it never surprises me when somebody uses good ICP-MS data with the appropriate calculator to fix all the low or missing elements that things perk up. They just need that initial help and directions from the right place.

I mean sailing in any methodologies direction, not just ICP

 

[Thales]

It’s funny how 1/8 the hobby is trying to go backwards. Here we are in 2023 and the argument has become “don’t use ICP” and correct depleted elements. Lol.

That’s like saying…don’t get an oil change on your car, don’t change windshield wipers, tires, or put water in the radiator. It will be fine!

But no one is really saying that. Some are trying to reduce a nuanced discussion into that, but no one is saying that. That was one of the reactions of the ICP article we did in 2015, and we weren't saying it then either.