DIY Ammonia dosing for low nitrate systems

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So I started too low? Right now I’m nitrates deleted. So where would I be if I want to bring up my nitrates up to around 10 ppm

The goal of ammonia dosing is to not have corals need nitrate at all, but if nitrification is fast, it may be hard to attain that.

If you are concerned about taking to long to get nitrate up while slowly ramping up ammonia (so as to not overdose) you could always boost nitrate directly to 10 ppm, then continue to dose ammonia.

How much it will take to boost nitrate is impossible to say since it is not known how much ammonia your organisms will take up.

 

[.AcroKiller.]

The goal of ammonia dosing is to not have corals need nitrate at all, but if nitrification is fast, it may be hard to attain that.

If you are concerned about taking to long to get nitrate up while slowly ramping up ammonia (so as to not overdose) you could always boost nitrate directly to 10 ppm, then continue to dose ammonia.

How much it will take to boost nitrate is impossible to say since it is not known how much ammonia your organisms will take up.

Ok that makes sense.

 

[jazzman7838]

Anyone carbon dosing and using ammonia at the same time ?

Yes, I’m dosing ammonia and phosphate and carbon dosing.

Carbon is in the form of formate since I use Tropic Marin All For Reef, and also in the form of alginate and various organic acids since I dose a pretty heavy amount of Reef Nutrition “feast” type refrigerated foods to my tank via auto feeder every day.

It took me a while to figure out that adding more Phytofeast and Oysterfeast to my tank every day was resulting in LESS dissolved nitrate and phosphate in the water. A bit counterintuitive until you understand how powerful carbon dosing and a good skimmer can be.

 

[East1]

The goal of ammonia dosing is to not have corals need nitrate at all, but if nitrification is fast, it may be hard to attain that.

If you are concerned about taking to long to get nitrate up while slowly ramping up ammonia (so as to not overdose) you could always boost nitrate directly to 10 ppm, then continue to dose ammonia.

How much it will take to boost nitrate is impossible to say since it is not known how much ammonia your organisms will take up.

There's also the possibility to add a nitrate salt into the ammonium which can give good results.

I actually wanted to ask for your guidance on this, as chemistry is not a strong suit.

previously I was dosing the following:

500ml water
2g KNO3
10.36g of (NH4)HCO3

This gave me the ability to raise my NO3 to around 15-20 while dosing ammonium, theory was that this would assist the filamentous algaes in growing well in the tank to feed fish, I've since experimented with reducing this to:

500ml water
1g KNO3
10.36g of (NH4)HCO3

The questions I've got are:
How would I go about calculating the net change in amount of N, in some units, considering I've altered the formula?
How would I also calculate the amount (NH4)HCO3 needed to make up this shortfall?
How would I calculate the amount of N, or NO3 equivalent, this total solution were to add to 100 litres of water?

they're likely basic questions but I wanted to get the foundations explained properly because I feel this is useful for mixing up dosing solutions in the future

Yes, I’m dosing ammonia and phosphate and carbon dosing.

Carbon is in the form of formate since I use Tropic Marin All For Reef, and also in the form of alginate and various organic acids since I dose a pretty heavy amount of Reef Nutrition “feast” type refrigerated foods to my tank via auto feeder every day.

It took me a while to figure out that adding more Phytofeast and Oysterfeast to my tank every day was resulting in LESS dissolved nitrate and phosphate in the water. A bit counterintuitive until you understand how powerful carbon dosing and a good skimmer can be.

something like this was also noted by people using EasySPS by EasyReef, in an old thread on here.
it's a pump-dosable sps feed. There were anecdotal records of people having reductions in N and P despite feeding more to the tank, perhaps from increased coral metabolism?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I would not assuming that adding N in different firms is interchangeable with respect to demand.

I also do not recommend potassium nitrate at all, unless you are closely monitoring potassium. It will rise a lot. Sodium or calcium nitrate are better choices. If mixing with ammonium bicarbonate, use sodium as the calcium may precipitate calcium carbonate.

In terms of calculation, you want a relative potency of the two solutions in terms of comparable N?

 

[.AcroKiller.]

I dosed magnesium nitrate yesterday up to 10pmm nitrates and it has been holding steady today with 10ml of ammonia dosing per day.

 

[East1]

I would not assuming that adding N in different firms is interchangeable with respect to demand.

I also do not recommend potassium nitrate at all, unless you are closely monitoring potassium. It will rise a lot. Sodium or calcium nitrate are better choices. If mixing with ammonium bicarbonate, use sodium as the calcium may precipitate calcium carbonate.

In terms of calculation, you want a relative potency of the two solutions in terms of comparable N?

noted re: kno3, will experiment with alternatives

yes, so I can dose the same amount of N considering there's a small reduction from the change in the non-ammonium compound.

 

[Dibi]

So let's say that I have a 80g tank. Nitrates zero. How much should I add daily ? Start with 0.01ppm every day? And monitor the nitrates from that? This is a good start?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So let's say that I have a 80g tank. Nitrates zero. How much should I add daily ? Start with 0.01ppm every day? And monitor the nitrates from that? This is a good start?

I’d start with 0.1 ppm twice a day.

 

[.AcroKiller.]

Ok update on second day.
Started ammonia dosing the morning of 19 aug at 10ml per day spread out in 24 doses. Also added 10pm worth of magnessium nitrate mid day.
20 Aug: nitrates steady at 10ppm.
21 Aug: nitrates dropped to 5 ppm

I’m thinking about leaving it until Friday the 23rd to see if they go back down to 0.

What you think Randy? Or should I bump it back up to 10 and bump up the ammonia to 10.5 ml per day.

 

[jazzman7838]

something like this was also noted by people using EasySPS by EasyReef, in an old thread on here.
it's a pump-dosable sps feed. There were anecdotal records of people having reductions in N and P despite feeding more to the tank, perhaps from increased coral metabolism?

The idea is that the labile organic carbon fuels bacterial growth, and as the bacteria reproduce they incorporate N and P into their cells. Then they are removed via protein skimming.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Ok update on second day.
Started ammonia dosing the morning of 19 aug at 10ml per day spread out in 24 doses. Also added 10pm worth of magnessium nitrate mid day.
20 Aug: nitrates steady at 10ppm.
21 Aug: nitrates dropped to 5 ppm

I’m thinking about leaving it until Friday the 23rd to see if they go back down to 0.

What you think Randy? Or should I bump it back up to 10 and bump up the ammonia to 10.5 ml per day.

I’d bump up the ammonia, then boost nitrate again if needed before bumping ammonia again.

 

[Dibi]

I’d start with 0.1 ppm twice a day.

Thank you Randy!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thank you Randy!

You’re welcome.

Let us know what happens!

 

[.AcroKiller.]

I’d bump up the ammonia, then boost nitrate again if needed before bumping ammonia again.

Thank you Randy

 

[hers0109]

Hello - after watching reef bum episode last night they talked about ammonia dosing. They recommended not doing it unless you are heavily stocked with corals.

My tank has been up for a year and have a good amount of corals - from frags to small colonies but I wouldn’t say I am heavily stocked at this point. However, my nitrates continue to drift towards zero so I dose neonitro. Is it appropriate to start ammonia dosing or should I remain on nitrate dosing for a while longer?

 

[Dread Pirate Dave]

Hello - after watching reef bum episode last night they talked about ammonia dosing. They recommended not doing it unless you are heavily stocked with corals.

My tank has been up for a year and have a good amount of corals - from frags to small colonies but I wouldn’t say I am heavily stocked at this point. However, my nitrates continue to drift towards zero so I dose neonitro. Is it appropriate to start ammonia dosing or should I remain on nitrate dosing for a while longer?

I am by no means heavily stocked but have had zero nitrates for many months. It wasn't until I started dosing ammonium bi-carbonate that I began detecting any nitrates. I'm at .6 now and may just try to keep it around 1 going forward. I see the difference it is making for the corals I do have. (duncans, blastos and candy canes)

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Hello - after watching reef bum episode last night they talked about ammonia dosing. They recommended not doing it unless you are heavily stocked with corals.

My tank has been up for a year and have a good amount of corals - from frags to small colonies but I wouldn’t say I am heavily stocked at this point. However, my nitrates continue to drift towards zero so I dose neonitro. Is it appropriate to start ammonia dosing or should I remain on nitrate dosing for a while longer?

I don’t think the benefit of dosing ammonia only applies when there are lots of corals. It seems to me it can apply to just one.

 

[StevePhx]

Yeah. I wonder if there’s more people doing. I actually dosing np bacto balance and my nitrates stay undetectable but my phosphates settled at .26 so I’m wondering if I add ammonia to bring nitrates up while keeping the same dose of np bacto to would see a decrease in phosphate.

I'm doing exactly this. I dose 50mL of ammonia daily and 15mL of NP Bacto. This allows me to dose more ammonia without pushing my nitrates over 8.

I've been very happy with the results so far, without Bacto I was maxing out at 40 mL of ammonia before I started to see a rise in nitrate.

I believe Sanjay stated he was doing vinegar and ammonia intp his tank as well.

 

[areefer01]

Hello - after watching reef bum episode last night they talked about ammonia dosing. They recommended not doing it unless you are heavily stocked with corals.

My tank has been up for a year and have a good amount of corals - from frags to small colonies but I wouldn’t say I am heavily stocked at this point. However, my nitrates continue to drift towards zero so I dose neonitro. Is it appropriate to start ammonia dosing or should I remain on nitrate dosing for a while longer?

What little I caught of it I have to say I enjoyed Mr. Delbeek's perspective on Ammonia and a few other talking points.