Vendors are Doing Nothing Wrong by Raising their Prices.

[exnisstech]

Just because there’s some idiot out there paying $45 for 1” piece of bubblegum digi, or $65 for a 1” piece of green slimer, doesn’t mean you have to.

Don't forget the $35 orange monti cap pieces smaller than the ones I throw away because I always break one when I stick my hand in the tank.
I agree that old time reefers don't pay these prices unless it's one if those I gotta have it frags they've been waiting for. The new reefers want it all and are willing to pay for it. All the latest name makes no sense to me frag, instant cycle, and god forbid algae enter the tank. I consider myself a newb because I am still learning so much. I'm starting to follow the advise of more mature members which usually ends up being to just keep and eye on things and let the tank mature. Sorry for straying off topic, it's an old guy thing.

 

[spsick]

I think you entirely missed the point of the other thread which was pointing out some vendors jacked up prices right before a “sale”.

Far different than 10-15% regular increases to cover rising costs.

 

[GARRIGA]

Free market is awesome but so is free purchase. Reason we have inflation is because consumers keep paying the higher prices. Which isn’t sustainable since eventually wages won’t keep up and consumers will be forced to overpay for necessities and ignore luxuries such as frags or that latest generation of LED.

When the only consumers available to pay high prices are those not affected by inflation then most vendors will perish or be affected because those consumers will be a minuscule section of the population.

Large companies will be forced to lay workers off which will compound the problem and then the only solution will be to drop prices.

Nobel to want and support businesses but that’s not how the economy sustains itself. Success is when the population has disposable income to splurge on a $150 coral that probably should be $20 considering it’s not more expensive to grow. Just has a fancy name.

 

[flashsmith]

I find it funny many many people on this forum will spend 15k or more on a setup without even a thought but when they go to fill it up constantly complain about the cost of livestock. The cost of maintaining a tank etc.. Simply put this is a hobby that you have to be in it to win it. It's like owning a boat. You better love to fish because it's one of the worst ways to spend money. So is reefing therefore you better have a real love for it because you'll be lucky to get 5k back when you decide to get out in a year. I repair stuff on my boat even when it sits. But I love being on the water and that more than takes away the pain in my bank account. This hobby is no different. There's no easy road in reefing. If you can't afford it go smaller or get out. If you complain now you're already there so you might as well pack it up.

 

[Tamberav]

I don’t watch those videos they put out.

I guess since I don’t watch them I am off the hook and don’t have to buy from them

 

[rtparty]

Threads like this and the other one crack me up

Like there was ever a point that this hobby was for the poor lol

The only time corals were cheap in this hobby was when countries and wholesalers were raping and pillaging the ocean unchecked. Yeah, that’s a good ideal to hang your hat on.

For those complaining about prices, you’d be better off starting your own coral farm and giving us all these low prices you seem to demand. The demand for them has to be ASTRONOMICAL and you would be a millionaire overnight. You could even be super nice and just ship a bunch of weed corals for free seeming you aren’t allowed to charge for them any longer

 

[Sean Clark]

Oh boy do I have a deal for you!

 

[rtparty]

Oh boy do I have a deal for you!

Coral pic NFTs! You’re a genius!

 

[BroccoliFarmer]

I’m not sure how long you were in the hobby for. Your account is only a few months old. So I’ll let this one slide…. The point is. This hobby will ultimately be dead if the prices of everything continues to climb and only the rich will be able to enjoy this hobby.

The hobby wont die. What will happen is it will push enough people out of the hobby, reducing demand which will in turn bring prices down. If it keeps attracting new reefers, prices will continue to go up. As much as we complain about pricing, it is the pricing which is inspiring the innovation and investments into the hobby in the first place. Eventually the laws (theories?) of economics will come into play and prices will hit a ceiling, if only temporarily.

 

[BroccoliFarmer]

Coral pic NFTs! You’re a genius!

Dont laugh. I work for an accounting firm and they are (maybe were) investing big money thinking this was the next big thing. And I am not talking mom and pop shop either.

 

[rtparty]

Dont laugh. I work for an accounting firm and they are (maybe were) investing big money thinking this was the next big thing. And I am not talking mom and pop shop either.

I’ve got some sweet hermit crab feet pics if they’re interested

 

[FishTruck]

I’m not sure how long you were in the hobby for. Your account is only a few months old. So I’ll let this one slide…. The point is. This hobby will ultimately be dead if the prices of everything continues to climb and only the rich will be able to enjoy this hobby.

No it won't! It will go back to local frag swaps and re ignite local reef clubs... which will put natural downward pressure on the vendor prices. The real problem is that the local reef scene is dead and everyone (me included) is too lazy to reboot it.

 

[gpd124]

I think it is fair to observe that prices are continuing to rise, which makes it tough come checkout time.

Vendors can charge what they want and we are free to buy or not buy. It was observed in a few posts that there are alternate paths, which include trading or buying from other hobbyists.

It is unfortunate that some are criticizing others for what they decide to pay for an item. My wife and I don’t buy flashy cars because we prioritize other things, but that doesn’t mean others are wrong for buying the latest and greatest cars.

 

[Scdell]

All this makes me laugh. Just like the annual Xmas hoopla. People are going to spend, spend and spend some more. I saw sales for daylight savings time recently. Really????
This hobby has become a cash cow. Why........because people have to have and they make the money to be able to have. This whole forum supports spending more than the hobby for the most part.
So...... You want to buy, then buy. You want to cry, then cry. It is what it's going to be.

 

[flashsmith]

Another thing.. I got all kinds of things I'm more than willing to give away that literally nobody wants. I've got a hundred heads of Duncan. Mats of xenia, Hundreds of all types of zoa polyps. Super nice leathers I can frag candy canes and many other nice corals that are overgrown but none of them are "in" so therefore I'll keep trimming them and throwing them in the trash. I don't recall anyone ever forcing me to buy anything or pay a certain price for a coral that Aquaman himself swam to an undisclosed location and pulled this one of a kind special leather scoly zoa cross Walt Disney Charles Barkley SPS Taylor Swift ticketmaster special hammer torch. Just say no! I will guarantee you without a doubt that nobody else outside this hobby but you will know the difference between a $10 Duncan and a $300 torch. They both flow. For that matter a long tentacle nem too. People outside the hobby just don't know the difference nor do they care. They'll probably point out that $1.00 snail or hermit crab or that overgrown xenia.

 

[LRT]

Some of us love the 30% off 50% already marked black friday prices. Builds character

 

[InactiveAcct]

It’s tough to be a business in these times. Gave employees 30% raise this year since we are as desperate to keep them as other businesses are to hire them. Added retirement plan and extra 2 weeks of vacation on top of that - employees making more than us with none of the downside risks lol

 

[BroccoliFarmer]

It’s tough to be a business in these times. Gave employees 30% raise this year since we are as desperate to keep them as other businesses are to hire them. Added retirement plan and extra 2 weeks of vacation on top of that - employees making more than us with none of the downside risks lol

Well, to be fair, their down side risk is two fold:

1. You could fire them any day
2. Staying with you means they may be giving up a higher salary somewhere else.

as I said, I am a business owner too. Just a sucky situation right now all around.

 

[AKG]

You're ascribing a weird amount of altruism to businesses who are here to make money.

They are absolutely not running holiday sales out of the goodness of their heart. They are wisely using human buying patterns to optimize profit during this time.

You think BRS is doing their giant giveaways out of the goodness of their hearts? Someone has run the numbers and determined that x amount of money spent on giveaways leads to y amount of increased sales.

Yes vendors are doing nothing wrong by raising prices just as much as consumers are doing nothing wrong by complaining about them.

I mean, yeah but BRS doesn't have to make videos, someone ran the numbers and saw that more educated reefers spend more money in the long run and keep coming back as customers.

We can go back and forth all day but ultimately nobody is forcing us to buy the ballbuster bounce blastomussa or whatever is next on the chopping block. Frankly, if someone is willing to pay for it then good for them and good for that company to understand that market.

I do feel like there's no reason to offer giveaways beyond that obviously sure it increases sales, but honestly I'm not sure that offering a sale or not would change the public opinion behind a vendor, but you really have two choices. Offer a black Friday sale of some kind and play the price game, or look like a chump when others do the same and you choose not to.

Sure, prices go up. Don't blame the vendor, blame the customer for not understanding what a good price actually looks like for their products before they buy them .

If I see Single vineyard chianti classico from a good year at $35/bottle, that's a great price. But to be upset when someone at a restaurant offers 20% off bottles and you order the same bottle for $45 +tax and tip, yes, I do feel like that makes you a fool. Either you want the buyer experience or you don't, and if you don't then you need to be intelligent enough to shop around or wait for something to show up at a good price.

I'm not here to draw arguments, I'm here to say either you play the game and play the price, or you don't. Nobody is forcing us to buy the corals, but vendors run on thinner margins than I think most people realize. It's definitely below 20% margin when you factor in losses and most of your money is made on water and coral /inverts. You can argue all day but ask your lfs what they have to pay in just rent for a month on their 5-10 year lease. It's insane.


Anyone thinking a price hike is reflective of a holiday and not global economy and demand is blowing smoke -- the pricing is likely there to stay.

why do you think Waterbox can ship salt so cheaply? Do you think they honestly ship empty aquariums in containers?

They have a salt product and they fill the tanks with the packaged salt to save money on shipping container prices.

Lots of creative stuff happens on the vendor's side to make ends meet. You can call it robbery but meanwhile we pay Spotify and Netflix monthly for things we don't even own ourselves.

But go ahead and tell me that lfs is a problem when people are subscribed for 4-5 of these services sometimes monthly anyway..... I'm not here to gain anything from a vendor. I'm just saying you guys are full of yourselves for getting upset about black friday pricing when there are so many bigger problems we spend our money on but are afraid to say anything about how wrong or corrupt they are in comparison. We just put it undera carpet and ignore it. We work for money, not for fuzzy feelings. Same with vendors. Stagflation is real. Raising prices just proves all my points.

If you don't want black Friday fomo price manipulation to happen, stop shopping Black Friday events and stop supporting vendors who do Black Friday.

All I know is vendors don't owe reefers Jack diddly squat, and if it weren't for things like volunteers on forums and video material by content creators, business or not, the hobby wouldn't be anywhere near where it is today because nobody would be educated enough to understand the purpose of a reef mat, or gyre flow, etc.

But to be honest, it's a hobby. A reef isn't a necessity. Prices go up because people pay them. As more and more automation happens, and people entering the hobby become more and more detached, reefing will continue to move into being a luxury product.

 

[Lbrdsoxfan]

I don’t watch those videos they put out.

I guess since I don’t watch them I am off the hook and don’t have to buy from them

This. I avoid the hype like a plague.