New Tank Syndrome Blues. Someone please help me.

[phildoingthings]

Hello all.

I am about 3 years into this hobby. Started with a 20gal Aqueon I got off Craigslist, and last September upgraded to a brand new RSR 250. I decided to start it with dry rock so I could glue my scape together and make what I wanted opposed to the much more expensive live rock option. Now it being February I have a few problems….
The tank cycled with no issues. I have my original 3 tank members from the start of this hobby still going strong (2 clowns and bangai cardi), as well as some random inverts. However my algae is completely out of control. It seems that almost overnight my scape is completely covered in algae and I want to quit the hobby. I blow down the rocks every day and sift out the debris with a net as best I can. I even scrubbed the few rocks that I have that aren’t glued together in a 5 gallon bucket last water change (Sunday) but already the film of algae is returning.

I had a beautiful purple tang that was added about 3 weeks ago who caught Ich, and I put him into QT with copper immediately and he only made it about 5 days in there until he had a random seizure when I went to feed him and he died overnight. I assume he caught ich from the stress of me blowing down the rocks and scrubbing every day but again I could be wrong I’ve never had a fish get Ich before.

I guess my issue is why why why will the algae not stay at bay? Maybe I have misdiagnosed what kind of algae it is? Do I not have enough good bacteria established to fight it? I also have a few small pieces of coral that have been doing well, and an anemone that is thriving so I don’t think it’s a water quality issue.

I just want this to stop and I’m about ready to just bust the tank down and sell it. I’ve had it at this point and I just want help from someone who knows more than I.

Parameter are all in proper range, temp constant 77.5-78 °F, Salinity 1.024-1.025

running only 2 AI Prime 16HD’s (underpowered for my tank size apparently)
And I run 2 MP40s on the back walls next to the overflow at about 10-20% speed(variable)


Please. Help.

 

[Tired]

Sounds like the ugly stage. "New tank syndrome" is when a tank isn't cycled and fish die as a result.

What fights algae is cleanup crew and more algae. What cleanup critters do you have?

What are your nitrate and phosphate levels, exactly? What test kit are you using?

Post a pic of the algae under white lights.

Stop scrubbing the rocks, you need to let them get established. What happens with dry rock is a bunch of fast-growing, hardy, opportunistic algae pops up and runs rampant in the free space. That's the ugly stage. The way to counteract that is to keep a reasonable amount of nutrients present, stock an appropriate cleanup crew, manually remove any long tufts of hair algae, and wait. Eventually, slower-growing, non-pest algae will take over, but you have to give that non-pest algae a good environment.

Fish get ich from the ich pathogen being present in their environment. Stress can help it get established in them, but it is, at the end of the line, from the pathogen.

 

[T-J]

Please post some FTS, as well as close-up pics of the rocks/algae. Use white light when possible. Post actual parameters. What are you using for a water source?

 

[Aquanic]

You need to look at your phosphate and nitrates. Typically, a acceptable range for nitrate is close to 0-~30ppm(I shoot for about 5ppm). Anything above 10ppm and you’ll probably have algae unless you have a good crew in the tank (zebramosa tang, lawnmower blenny, bristletooth tang, hermits, copepods, etc) A good range for phosphate is close to 0-~.2 (I shoot for .05). Anything above .1ppm and you’ll probably have algae issues.
I agree with stopping scrubbing the rocks everyday. You need to let the tank settle and mature. There’s tons of tiny creatures on those rocks cleaning parts we can’t see. My best advice is patience, do as minimal chemicals as you can, peroxide works well for algae but I’d recommend fixing the nutrient issue before I just tried to kill all the algae by hand.
You could also benefit from an algae scrubber. What kind of filtration do you have?

 

[Aqua Man]

I just want this to stop and I’m about ready to just bust the tank down and sell it. I’ve had it at this point and I just want help from someone who knows more than I.

Do you have coral? if not, turn your lights down/off for awhile.

Also wondering like the others, what does your CUC look like?

 

[Troylee]

It sounds like Dino’s… need your po4 and nitrates tested.. I’ve been battling them for years and I am currently.. it’s a pain it sucks but they will go away in time..

 

[Aquanic]

It sounds like Dino’s… need your po4 and nitrates tested.. I’ve been battling them for years and I am currently.. it’s a pain it sucks but they will go away in time..

Copepods do wonders on Dino’s. It can just be a challenge to have a good population in the display with fish

 

[ReefGuard Systems]

hang in there... try and stay positive.

 

[phildoingthings]

Sounds like the ugly stage. "New tank syndrome" is when a tank isn't cycled and fish die as a result.

What fights algae is cleanup crew and more algae. What cleanup critters do you have?

What are your nitrate and phosphate levels, exactly? What test kit are you using?

Post a pic of the algae under white lights.

Stop scrubbing the rocks, you need to let them get established. What happens with dry rock is a bunch of fast-growing, hardy, opportunistic algae pops up and runs rampant in the free space. That's the ugly stage. The way to counteract that is to keep a reasonable amount of nutrients present, stock an appropriate cleanup crew, manually remove any long tufts of hair algae, and wait. Eventually, slower-growing, non-pest algae will take over, but you have to give that non-pest algae a good environment.

Fish get ich from the ich pathogen being present in their environment. Stress can help it get established in them, but it is, at the end of the line, from the pathogen.

Hello thank you for responding sorry for the late reply....
Cleanup crew as of today is:
10 Blue Leg Hermits
12 Astrea Snails
2 Emerald Crabs
7 Nassarius Snails

Im using APi test kits and my Nitrate is 0 as well as Phosphate 0

I will attach photos in this reply of the rocks as they are now and eep in mind they were scrubbed on Sunday so it's not as bad as it was but here we go...

Please post some FTS, as well as close-up pics of the rocks/algae. Use white light when possible. Post actual parameters. What are you using for a water source?

Photos Attached in reply...
Water source meaning for RO/DI? or Salt I use to mix? I use a 1 month old BRS 75GPD RO/DI system with Red Sea Salt (black bucket). I live on Long Island so we fortunately have some of the best quality tap water in the US so I doubt its my RO/DI water

Full parameters are as follows:
Temp.: 77.5-78 F
Salinity: 1.024-1.025
pH: 8
Nitrate: 0
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Phosphate: 0

You need to look at your phosphate and nitrates. Typically, a acceptable range for nitrate is close to 0-~30ppm(I shoot for about 5ppm). Anything above 10ppm and you’ll probably have algae unless you have a good crew in the tank (zebramosa tang, lawnmower blenny, bristletooth tang, hermits, copepods, etc) A good range for phosphate is close to 0-~.2 (I shoot for .05). Anything above .1ppm and you’ll probably have algae issues.
I agree with stopping scrubbing the rocks everyday. You need to let the tank settle and mature. There’s tons of tiny creatures on those rocks cleaning parts we can’t see. My best advice is patience, do as minimal chemicals as you can, peroxide works well for algae but I’d recommend fixing the nutrient issue before I just tried to kill all the algae by hand.
You could also benefit from an algae scrubber. What kind of filtration do you have?

Thanks for the input....As far as filtration I have a simplicity 240DC Protein Skimmer, and a RS Reef Mat 500, I also keep 3 large seeded bio balls in my sump, mainly used for QT purposes. I posted my paramters above.

It sounds like Dino’s… need your po4 and nitrates tested.. I’ve been battling them for years and I am currently.. it’s a pain it sucks but they will go away in time..

I hope not! I have photos attached let me hear what you think. Phosphate and Nitrate both tested at 0 on APi test kits

 

[Lavey29]

Hello thank you for responding sorry for the late reply....
Cleanup crew as of today is:
10 Blue Leg Hermits
12 Astrea Snails
2 Emerald Crabs
7 Nassarius Snails

Im using APi test kits and my Nitrate is 0 as well as Phosphate 0

I will attach photos in this reply of the rocks as they are now and eep in mind they were scrubbed on Sunday so it's not as bad as it was but here we go...

Photos Attached in reply...
Water source meaning for RO/DI? or Salt I use to mix? I use a 1 month old BRS 75GPD RO/DI system with Red Sea Salt (black bucket). I live on Long Island so we fortunately have some of the best quality tap water in the US so I doubt its my RO/DI water

Full parameters are as follows:
Temp.: 77.5-78 F
Salinity: 1.024-1.025
pH: 8
Nitrate: 0
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Phosphate: 0


Thanks for the input....As far as filtration I have a simplicity 240DC Protein Skimmer, and a RS Reef Mat 500, I also keep 3 large seeded bio balls in my sump, mainly used for QT purposes. I posted my paramters above.


I hope not! I have photos attached let me hear what you think. Phosphate and Mitrate both tested at 0 on APi test kits

I see film algae on the rocks and dinos in the sand. Your parameters are messed up. 0 phosphate and nitrate is bad news for the tank. You want phosphate. 05 to .1 and nitrates at 10. Cut lights to 6 hours with blue and uv only no whites. Get a diverse cleaner crew. Weekly water changes with manual siphon of the sand. Dose phytoplankton with a bunch of pods and dose PNS probio which is a natural heterotrophic bacteria that breaks down organic waste before it feeds your dinos. This battle will take a month or two. Green film algae on rocks is normal evolution for dead rocks maturing in reef tanks.

 

[Reefbuds]

I would definitely add a more diverse cuc. A lot of times I've found that just having the proper clean up crew deals with algae 100% over time. I would get as many different types of Snails as you can. They do wonders. Turbos are great.

 

[Reefbuds]

Also as someone else said, keep your nitrates and phosphates off of 0 and it will change your life

 

[phildoingthings]

I would definitely add a more diverse cuc. A lot of times I've found that just having the proper clean up crew deals with algae 100% over time.

Cool what others would you suggest adding? I was at my LFS today to try and pick up some Turbos but he was sold out until the weekend....Also My tang WAS doing a good job at grazing (RIP) now I'm just cautious of adding another expensive tang just to watch it get Ich and die if the tank isn't in a good enough place for him to be comfortable

 

[phildoingthings]

Also as someone else said, keep your nitrates and phosphates off of 0 and it will change your life

Suggestions to raise the levels?

 

[phildoingthings]

I see film algae on the rocks and dinos in the sand. Your parameters are messed up. 0 phosphate and nitrate is bad news for the tank. You want phosphate. 05 to .1 and nitrates at 10. Cut lights to 6 hours with blue and uv only no whites. Get a diverse cleaner crew. Weekly water changes with manual siphon of the sand. Dose phytoplankton with a bunch of pods and dose PNS probio which is a natural heterotrophic bacteria that breaks down organic waste before it feeds your dinos. This battle will take a month or two. Green film algae on rocks is normal evolution for dead rocks maturing in reef tanks.

Thanks for the input, I asked Mean Reef the same question...what would you suggest adding to the CUC to add diversity, and how would you go about raising nitrate and phosphate? Thanks

 

[Tired]

You definitely need to get your nutrients up, and stop scrubbing. That should handle things, more or less, though you may need to add more algae-eating snails. I like ceriths. A tuxedo urchin can also be a fun addition, and should eat hair algae.

To raise nutrients, don't do water changes unless you need to lower nutrients or replace calcium/etc that the corals have used up. Make sure you're feeding your fish a good amount, and consider feeding any LPS corals you have. If that doesn't do the trick, dose the nutrients directly.

If your tank has ich, the only way to fix that is to remove and treat all fish, and leave the tank fallow for at least 72 days. You then need to quarantine to prevent more ich being introduced, otherwise it'll lurk around at sub-visible levels, waiting for a stressed fish to reinfect.

 

[Reefbuds]

Feeding is an easy way. Cleanest way is to use a phosphate and nitrate supplement. Slowly add over time until your consistently where you want to be.

 

[phildoingthings]

Feeding is an easy way. Cleanest way is to use a phosphate and nitrate supplement. Slowly add over time until your consistently where you want to be.

I am feeding 2x a day frozen brine and mysis half a cube of each type a day. Current stock is 2 clowns, 1 bangai, 4 Neon Damselfish

 

[phildoingthings]

You definitely need to get your nutrients up, and stop scrubbing. That should handle things, more or less, though you may need to add more algae-eating snails. I like ceriths. A tuxedo urchin can also be a fun addition, and should eat hair algae.

To raise nutrients, don't do water changes unless you need to lower nutrients or replace calcium/etc that the corals have used up. Make sure you're feeding your fish a good amount, and consider feeding any LPS corals you have. If that doesn't do the trick, dose the nutrients directly.

If your tank has ich, the only way to fix that is to remove and treat all fish, and leave the tank fallow for at least 72 days. You then need to quarantine to prevent more ich being introduced, otherwise it'll lurk around at sub-visible levels, waiting for a stressed fish to reinfect.

Cool originally I was looking for ceriths but one LFS didn't have them so I'll try another. I heard pincushion urchins work well as well. I will probably go the route of less water changes, maybe 10% biweekly and just check Ca during the week. I feed about 1/2 a cube of frozen mysis and 1/2 a cube of frozen brine a day and Reef Roids 2x a week so i will up those amounts as well.

Thanks for the advice on the Ich situation...II;m going waya 4th week of Feb so 'll set up a nice 20 gallon QT when I get back.

 

[Troylee]

Cool originally I was looking for ceriths but one LFS didn't have them so I'll try another. I heard pincushion urchins work well as well. I will probably go the route of less water changes, maybe 10% biweekly and just check Ca during the week. I feed about 1/2 a cube of frozen mysis and 1/2 a cube of frozen brine a day and Reef Roids 2x a week so i will up those amounts as well.

Thanks for the advice on the Ich situation...II;m going waya 4th week of Feb so 'll set up a nice 20 gallon QT when I get back.

Def looks like Dino’s unfortunately and that strain is toxic… I had those a couple months back and they took out my snails and a couple corals rrrrr… get a Hannah checker for po4 and nitrate or at least sailfert for nitrate… api isn’t gonna give correct readings and like mentioned get your nitrate and po4 up some.. once you beat the Dino’s then replenish your cuc to take care of the hair algae etc.. a uv sterilizer will help take them Dino’s out!