Hawaii Fish Ban Update

[JayM]

This comes up a lot - what does it exactly mean and what is the threshold between what is deemed affordable or not? This should not be part of the discussions regarding the continued or removal of said ban.

You're right - "affordable" means different things for different people, but from my experience interacting with others in the hobby, affordable would likely be sub $100. Maybe the $50 to $75 range.

I know pricing is all about supply and demand, but when the supply is artificially reduced, people tend to get a bit irritated. Especially when the lack of supply has nothing to do with anything other than feelings and/or politics, which is what the ban was all about in the first place.

And FWIW, I never said pricing should be part of the discussion about the ban being lifted - only that when it is, prices should come down which means that they'll be more affordable (but not necessarily affordable).

 

[topjimmy]

Your instincts serve you well. Basically the reason is the BLNR is learning they don’t have the legal right to withhold the permits as they’re not empowered to ban the fishery. We are legislated into statute therefore they can’t undo that. This unelected group that has no knowledge or experience have been sitting around trying to figure out how to deny the science from the state. The game is over

Send in supporting testimony if you can

Typical beurocrats

 

[areefer01]

You're right - "affordable" means different things for different people, but from my experience interacting with others in the hobby, affordable would likely be sub $100. Maybe the $50 to $75 range.

It does mean different things to different people but it is just odd to me when the same people are willing to throw down 150 or more on a 1/4" freshly cut and glued coral frag. I guess my point is that we don't know what the price is going to be and shouldn't assume it is going to be pre-ban pricing. Different economy not factoring in the time these small businesses have been out of work and inflation.

And FWIW, I never said pricing should be part of the discussion about the ban being lifted - only that when it is, prices should come down which means that they'll be more affordable (but not necessarily affordable).

I know you didn't. It was more a generalization when these discussions happen among hobbyist. It is like one of the original posts on this meeting/voting subject specifically stated "bringing back affordable yellow tangs". That line item has no bearing on the meeting or votes. Leave it off and the message, post, has the same meaning.

Just my opinion.

Edit: btw - just talking - no right or wrong. I have my own thoughts on the ban and opinion but always try to see it from the small business side of things. I hope they find a way to work together with captive group and universities. I stay out of the rest and in my own lane. Hope your day is going well.

 

[Kylesreeftank]

I can't speak for anyone else, but I have a couple of thoughts.

Less than 100 species of marine fish have been successfully captive bred, and only about 30 of those are commonly available. I'm confident that there's more to come at some point. Maybe sooner than later. But it will likely be mostly just to see if it can be done because economics and sustainability will be a significant hurdle.

Have you seen Biota's facilities? Can you imagine the financial and environmental cost to scale production to meet the demand of producing 1000's of species of captive bred fish? And 1000's of each specimen?

The math just doesn't math for species that are common and collected in an ethical fashion. It's a different ballgame if we're talking rare and/or threatened species (which is where captive bred programs should probably focus on) as those could likely be done with existing facilities.

I suppose at some point the numbers could make sense, but I don't see it reaching that point anytime soon.

The website clearly states that a big issue with the species beyond the 100 with all the kinks worked out is economic pricing relative to the wild caught versions, not necessarily issues in their genetics or rearing.

 

[davidflagg]

New-ish guy here. Can anyone define "fishery" for me in this context? Are we talking about a ban on live fish exported from Hawaii? Does that include inverts, corals, algae, etc?

I've tried a few times in the relatively recent past to contact IPSF for an order, and they never responded, despite me hearing praises about it. Is this the explanation? Buying from Hawaii is a no-go?

 

[vetteguy53081]

New-ish guy here. Can anyone define "fishery" for me in this context? Are we talking about a ban on live fish exported from Hawaii? Does that include inverts, corals, algae, etc?

I've tried a few times in the relatively recent past to contact IPSF for an order, and they never responded, despite me hearing praises about it. Is this the explanation? Buying from Hawaii is a no-go?

Mainly fish

 

[dwarfseahorse]

You nailed it!

The reason for a fish club is to stay informed and learn or teach new things. Changing laws are important to everyone, regardless of if you are for or against them. The most important thing is that we can't stay informed if we don't have the information. Providing this report for Hawaii was important information for fish clubs to be aware of.

 

[areefer01]

I've tried a few times in the relatively recent past to contact IPSF for an order, and they never responded, despite me hearing praises about it. Is this the explanation? Buying from Hawaii is a no-go?

Indo Pacific Sea Farms is different as they do not export fish. Oddly enough I was trying to reach ipsf the other day and I couldn't reach their portal.

 

[litsoh]

Indo Pacific Sea Farms is different as they do not export fish. Oddly enough I was trying to reach ipsf the other day and I couldn't reach their portal.

Ugh ISPF, how can they be based IN Hawaii and not ship TO us here? Makes no sense.

 

[Reefering1]

Ugh ISPF, how can they be based IN Hawaii and not ship TO us here? Makes no sense.

@Kona Diver
So, currently, can people living in Hawaii go fishing in local waters?

 

[litsoh]

@Kona Diver
So, currently, can people living in Hawaii go fishing in local waters?

Oh yeah, we're allowed to take for personal use provided that is in within the limits set by the Department of Fisheries (if I remember correctly). Nothing is really stopping me from going out to the beach and grabbing a Yellow Tang or a Flame Wrasse so long as it isn't from protected areas. I actually saw someone offering some caught juvenile Convict Tangs for like $30 on a Facebook group

 

[litsoh]

I even overheard a customer at an LFS talking to the employee about what to feed an octopus that they caught while out diving.

 

[Reefering1]

Oh yeah, we're allowed to take for personal use provided that is in within the limits set by the Department of Fisheries (if I remember correctly). Nothing is really stopping me from going out to the beach and grabbing a Yellow Tang or a Flame Wrasse so long as it isn't from protected areas. I actually saw someone offering some caught juvenile Convict Tangs for like $30 on a Facebook group

If you moved to the mainland, could you bring them with you?

 

[litsoh]

If you moved to the mainland, could you bring them with you?

I'm inclined to say no, there may be a loophole somewhere but for the most part the airport agents will most likely confiscate whatever livestock you have with you.

 

[F i s h y]

 

[F i s h y]

Bring back the best US reef fish!...

I have a Chevron Tang, and a wild Yellow. 2 of my favorites by far...

Want some of those beautiful cleaner wrasse as well...

 

[TangerineSpeedo]

I may be in the minority here, but I hope the ban stays in place, unless it truly is sustainable for the fish populations. Maybe another decade of the ban would be best. I personally don't care if certain fish aren't available for my aquarium or if captive breds aren't as nice. I own 3 Biota YTs and they look just fine to me..if that means not plucking them from the ocean, I'm not selfish enough to demand a bright yellow to stare at for my own personal enjoyment at the expense of the YT wild populations.

According to a several sources, there was no "sustainability" issues for the ban, It was political. The ban ruling ignored studies from University of Hawaii and state department study that concluded that the aquarium fisheries was sustainable at its current rate before the ban. Please do your own research before you jump to conclusions.

 

[Garyakala]

If you guys want the price of the yellow tang to go down then “STOP” purchases them with a high price??? It is called “supply and demand”.

 

[TangerineSpeedo]

If that is truly the case, and I have no idea if it was, doesn't that point to there being at least the perception that the exports was decimating the local populations? What is the theory behind this rumor?

It is not a rumor. Knowing personally a ex fisheries diver. Dive tourists were upset because as the were diving the reef, fisherman were collecting at the same time. OMG "Karen" was aghast... and called peta...

 

[strich]

It is not a rumor. Knowing personally a ex fisheries diver. Dive tourists were upset because as the were diving the reef, fisherman were collecting at the same time. OMG "Karen" was aghast... and called peta...

I mean yeah I would be pretty annoyed if taking a walk through a forest whilst a for profit company was chainsawing trees down around me.