Corals are Dying - Help Please. Documentation, parameters and YouTube video included

[Aquaman102]

Hi All –

YouTube Video:


I’m hoping you can help me figure out why some of my corals are dying in my tank. When I say dying, I mean mainly SPS and some LPS. I've only have tried a few “sticks”. It always seems to be that the SPS starts to have tissue recede from the top down. The top will get white, then algae takes over that receded spot and it continued demise from there. I had a patch of green zoas, that just melted, other zoas are fine. I have a large Christmas Tree Favia that is melting away. Most softies and Euphyllia’s are ok. Had some Acan polyp bailout to.

The Beginning:
My tank is just over a year old. It was started with dry Marco rock / dry sand. The rock was cycled in a brute trash can for two months. It’s a standard 120-gallon tank / 40-gallon breeder sump setup, with 100 to 120 pounds of rock. Roughly a 2” sandbed. Went through the standard uglies of diatoms, green hair algae and got cyano around 6 months into it…

Salt: hw-marine reefer mix

Lighting:
ReefBreeders Photon V2 LED + 4 x T5 bulb Aquatic Life (3 Blue+, 1 Coral +).
Tested with PAR Meter: ranges from 160ish on the sandbed to 300ish at the top of the rock. 350 at the surface water level.
Lights are 12” off the water surface

Light Schedule:
12 hours
10 am - LEDs come on, reduced intensity, blues only
12 pm - T5’s come on (3 x Blue+, 1x Coral Plus)
12 pm – 4 pm: T5’s are on, LED’s at 70% intensity with Blues Only.
4 pm – 10 pm: T5’s off - LED Blues only ramping down in intensity hourly
10 pm - LEDs off
10 pm – 10 am – Fuge lights on

Flow:
2 x MP40’s, 1 x MP10
Echotech S1 return pump

Heaters:
4 x 100W Cobalt heaters

Skimmer:
Octo-150

Sump:
3 chambers – first chamber is for the skimmer, middle has some rubble rock and a small bit of chaeto, 3rd chamber is the return.

Parameters:
Salinity: 35 ppt
Temp: 78 degrees
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrated: 20ish (between 12 and 25 on Nyos test kit)
Phospate: .17 on last night’s check with Hanna Phos Checker
Ph: 8.1 to 8.6 (hard to tell on the Rea Sea kit)
Alk: 10.6
Calc: 484

Tank Inhabitants:
2 x Clowns
1 x Melanurus Wrasse
1 x Yellow Tang
1 x Blue Chromis
1 x Mandarin Dragonet
1 x Lawnmower Blenny
1 x Yellow Watchmen Goby
1 x Purple Firefish


Issues:
When the cyano showed up I dosed Chemiclean. Chemiclean knocked out the cyano real quick but left me with no nutrients in the system and Prorocenrum dinoflagellates showed up soon after.
I went through the Dr Tim’s method to try to eradicate them, which includes a blackout plus various bacterial dosing. Worked for a bit, but the dino’s came back.
Then I tried the Elegant Coral method to fight them, which includes microbubbling, dosing bacteria and Vodka. That worked mostly, but I have a slight layer of dino’s on the sandbed still.
The leftover dino’s have not gotten worse, nor cleared up anymore. The bacteria in the tank seems to be holding it at bay for now.
I do add some Microbacter7 every now and then, but that is literally all I dose.
I also have a 25W UV running as well. In the display tank.
I do have a some carbon in the sump in case there is any chemical warfare going on. My dino “infestation” was that bad to start with, so there isn’t a lot of die off.

Theories:

• Out of Balance:
• 
  
• One theory is the tank is “out of balance” from the different dino treatments. I’ve not changed the water for about 2 months in fear that the dino’s will fire back up again. Again, they are being “managed” right now. Not getting worse and not getting better.
• 
  
• Too much light to quick:
• The T5 addition is relatively new. When I added them (2 months ago), I reduced the LED’s to 50% intensity and only had the T5’s on for 1 hour. I have bumped up the T5’s by 30 minutes each week and increased Blue LEDs up by 5% each week. I’m at 65% now (pre T5’s, LEDs maxed at 70%). The original goal was to get 6 hours of T5’s, so I’d get some red and green spectrum and why I only run Blues outside of the T5 times. The PAR levels seem to be in range with what is acceptable for a mixed again. Again, those range from 160 on the sandbed to 300 at the top of the rocks. The tops of the rocks are 24” from the lights.
• 
  
• Stray current – I bought a voltage meter and it didn’t pick up any stray current in the tank. I even turned the heaters up to 80 degrees temporarily to see if those were causing stray current when they were on.
• 
  
• Alk to high – the Alk in my tank frequently tests a >10. Using an Hanna Alk Checker. It hovers between 10.1 and 10.6.
• 
  
• Pest – I do dip my corals, don’t have a QT system. I scan frequently and have not seen pests in my system.

Thoughts on what I should do?
I’ve considered doing a small water change, like 5 gallons, and hope that doesn’t fuel the dino’s again.

Do I shut off the T5’s and go back to LEDs only for a while?

Or leave the T5’s and wait longer before I increase the length of time they are on?

Alk to high?

 

[Hemmdog]

What’s your magnesium?

 

[Aquaman102]

What’s your magnesium?

That's one test kit I don't have. Guess I should order one.

 

[Hemmdog]

That's one test kit I don't have. Guess I should order one.

Yeah, If that is low it could explain your issues with corals dying. If mag is 1300-1450 then I’d suggest doing an ICP test as the next step.

 

[ccombs]

How often do you do water changes?

 

[Aquaman102]

How often do you do water changes?

Water changes have been minimal because I am coming out of a dinoflagellate battle. Last one I did was about 6 weeks ago. Trying not to do them because it fuels the dino's. I did think about changing 5 gallons or so...just haven't done it yet.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Dino issue from experience has not helped.
Do a 2-3 day blackout. Run UV at night, DO not Add anymore vodka, etc as it is fuel for the dino.
Add the bacter 7 daily during the day for a week. Rinse filters daily which are holding matter from the dino.
One last suggestion:
Take a nice size water sample to a Trusted LFS ASAP and have them test Mag (as suggested by Hemmdog) and remaining parameters for you for comparison to your readings and to confirm parameters.

 

[Aquaman102]

Dino issue from experience has not helped.
Do a 2-3 day blackout. Run UV at night, DO not Add anymore vodka, etc as it is fuel for the dino.
Add the bacter 7 daily during the day for a week. Rinse filters daily which are holding matter from the dino.
One last suggestion:
Take a nice size water sample to a Trusted LFS ASAP and have them test Mag (as suggested by Hemmdog) and remaining parameters for you for comparison to your readings and to confirm parameters.

I'm several weeks past the dino treatment, so haven't been dosing vodka. UV is running 24/7. No filters. I have been dosing Microbacter7 too.

 

[ccombs]

I am thinking that since you are out of your dinos, you can do a water change. IMO something in the water is making the corals unhappy, so with some replacement and dilution you might have some luck.

 

[Aquaman102]

Yeah, If that is low it could explain your issues with corals dying. If mag is 1300-1450 then I’d suggest doing an ICP test as the next step.

If I did the Salifert Mag test right, if came in around 1275. I also did a 5 gallon water change a couple of days ago. So far, the dino did not refuel itself.

Is 1275 low?

 

[Hemmdog]

If I did the Salifert Mag test right, if came in around 1275. I also did a 5 gallon water change a couple of days ago. So far, the dino did not refuel itself.

Is 1275 low?

It’s low for how high your alk is. Raise it to 1380

 

[Aquaman102]

It’s low for how high your alk is. Raise it to 1380

Thanks, I've ordered the B-Ionic Magnesium supplement.

Any advice on how fast to raise the Mag?

 

[Hemmdog]

Thanks, I've ordered the B-Ionic Magnesium supplement.

Any advice on how fast to raise the Mag?

You can raise mag quicker than Alk & cal, when I need to make corrections I dose 100ml at a time of b-ioniic mag into my 90 gal.

 

[Aquaman102]

Hi Everyone,

Checking back in my issues, so far my corals don't seem to be recovering. I got the Mag raised a bit and also submitted a Triton water test. I got the results back and the only thing that was not in the green zone was phosphorus / phosphate. Phosphate was in the red zone. That was because I am coming out of a fight with dinoflagellates and I raised my nutrients. Tested today and the Phosphate is .15 (Hanna Phos Checker) and Nitrates are around 5 - 10pmm (Nyos test kit).

So it seems my tank measurables are all within exceptionable ranges outside of Phosphate, which is back down a bit.

I've done 3 x gallon water changes over the last 2 weeks. It hasn't necessarily eliminated the dino's, but they aren't horrible either. I was worried new water would fuel them, but appears other bacteria is keeping them in check. I am syphoning the sandbed daily to hopefully finish them off. I syphon into a 1 micro filter sock in the sump, so I am not adding new water, outside of those 3 x 5 gallon water changes.

While the BRS Par Meter (ranging from 160 on the sand bed to 300'ish at the top of the rocks) would seem to be inline with acceptable par readings, I am going to shut the T5's off for a week to see how things react.

I don't know what else it could be outside of being on the upper edge of too much light.

Part of me wonders if I am not giving new coral enough time to adjust to the light. I usually leave them on the sand for a couple of days, then move them up the rockwork every couple of days until they reach the final placement spot.

Am I moving coral up to fast?

Is my Nitrate and Phosphate out of whack? Should Nitrate ppm be higher than Phosphate ppm?

I really am stumped..

Reminder, in my first post I tried to include everything I could think of, plus a YouTube video of my tank.

I would appreciate any help!

 

[Aquaman102]

tagging the #reefsquad crew in hopes of additional input.

 

[dadnjesse]

You started your tank with dry rock. It could be you just don't have the beneficial bacteria needed.

 

[kireek]

I would think this is a combination of high Alkalinity,low mag and intense lighting.Unfortunately your corals could take months or even years to recover.It's just the way this game goes. You could try to frag certain corals if their condition worsens.The favia in particular should benefit from a trimming.

You are doing some awesome work though.Thank you for posting up all the information up front.

 

[Aquaman102]

I would think this is a combination of high Alkalinity,low mag and intense lighting.Unfortunately your corals could take months or even years to recover.It's just the way this game goes. You could try to frag certain corals if their condition worsens.The favia in particular should benefit from a trimming.

You are doing some awesome work though.Thank you for posting up all the information up front.

I've shut off the T5s for now. I'm going to leave them off for a while and see how things react.

My Mag is around 1380 now. Is that still to low? That's the upper end of the green zone in the Triton results.

My tank is in my finished basement, usually I'm the only one down there watching TV, so there's not much carbon dioxide in the room.

Should I buffer the alk down?

 

[kevin_e]

I think your mag is and was fine. I would honestly let things be. Water chemistry seems fine outside of slightly elevated nutrients, but that isnt killing your coral. You've made a LOT of changes. Very little stability in parameters. I'd give stability a shot.

 

[bobssecrtsn]

If I plugged in your icp test your Sg in ppt was 34.5. So that isn’t the problem.