Can we please treat corals for what they are?

[livinlifeinBKK]

This is something I disagree with.
Corals to myself and I think many others, are not living beings. They have no feelings or emotions. I look at them as I would plants. They are my under water garden. To be propagated they must be cut. I assume you have corals? If so did you harvest them from the ocean? If so you removed them from their home. If you didn't then they were cut (propagated) and you purchased them or someone gave them to you. But your comments make me think you only have fish only and no coral

Wow, you really don't see corals as living beings? That's very basic biology you've got incorrect. Granted I understand part of what you're saying here is that since they don't feel pain and therefore you don't feel bad about harming or killing them because they don't know they're dying. However, they are living beings that happen to be highly coveted and valued by many people. If someone's grandmother was braindead would you care euthenizing her with whatever you happened to be holding in your hand at the time? She would feel a thing just like the coral! Ok, maybe a little extreme. Maybe you decide to move but can't bring your dog with you. Would it be ok to sedate it and then throw it in a river? Come on, it would never know it was drowning! Corals have life and although we all place different value on different life forms your structure of value seems particularly harsh and you seem to care a lot less than most about organisms which really are actually pretty complex.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

Sorry my dogs express emotion and interact with people. Corals do not. A coral not being happy is a phrase not and statement of thier emotion because they have no emotions. No. More than saying a plant is unhappy because I forgot to water it. But we all have our own personal feelings and it's probably best I bow out at this time.

You do realize the reason you and your beloved dog are alive is because of plants, right?

 

[Velcro]

This is such a cry for help.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

I couldn't have cared less about the topic of the thread, I'm just astounded by how removed from reality some people who have posted appear to be. Life itself is something that has historically and continues to inspire awe in the majority of people. If there was nothing special about it then humans would have succeeded in their innumerable attempts to give life to an inanimate object or reanimate after death but we have no clue how to do something like that despite truly amazing leaps in science. Doesn't that clearly indicate there's something special about it? Life itself goes against the natural laws in that it leads to organization of atoms, molecules, and complex compounds that all work together. The laws of science would indicate that everything in the universe should move ever closer to complete disorder but life defies that. (This is the Theory of Entropy.). Isn't that itself incredible? No, I wouldn't feel bad about shooting a deer when hunting. That's the cycle of life. I dont have to feel pain to have great reverence for life itself. No, I don't feel guilty for my wild collected corals. It has nothing to do with them lacking emotion though. I take as good of care of them as I can and if one dies I don't cry, I still have great respect for life itself though!
Do some people on this thread believe life exists completely independent of all other life? That's absurd if it's the case. Life supports life. That's one more incredible fact. Something we don't fully understand that directly defies scientific theories supports itself in other forms!

 

[CodyBot]

This is such a cry for help.

 

[Townes_Van_Camp]

I couldn't have cared less about the topic of the thread, I'm just astounded by how removed from reality some people who have posted appear to be. Life itself is something that has historically and continues to inspire awe in the majority of people. If there was nothing special about it then humans would have succeeded in their innumerable attempts to give life to an inanimate object or reanimate after death but we have no clue how to do something like that despite truly amazing leaps in science. Doesn't that clearly indicate there's something special about it? Life itself goes against the natural laws in that it leads to organization of atoms, molecules, and complex compounds that all work together. The laws of science would indicate that everything in the universe should move ever closer to complete disorder but life defies that. (This is the Theory of Entropy.). Isn't that itself incredible? No, I wouldn't feel bad about shooting a deer when hunting. That's the cycle of life. I dont have to feel pain to have great reverence for life itself. No, I don't feel guilty for my wild collected corals. It has nothing to do with them lacking emotion though. I take as good of care of them as I can and if one dies I don't cry, I still have great respect for life itself though!
Do some people on this thread believe life exists completely independent of all other life? That's absurd if it's the case. Life supports life. That's one more incredible fact. Something we don't fully understand that directly defies scientific theories supports itself in other forms!

Life on this earth will not change one way or another if my entire reef dies. The reef won't know.

If every free frag on the planet rtn's right now it will have a zero net impact on the world.

Judge me. I like my coral. If I kill it, it won't know or care. Wanna know a secret? Once I had a run away favia. It grew and stung and grew and stung. I flipped it's rock over. It wasn't animal abuse. It was like pruning my roses.

The world is soft. It's time for me to find a shack in the woods and start writing letters.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

Life on this earth will not change one way or another if my entire reef dies. The reef won't know.

If every free frag on the planet rtn's right now it will have a zero net impact on the world.

Judge me. I like my coral. If I kill it, it won't know or care. Wanna know a secret? Once I had a run away favia. It grew and stung and grew and stung. I flipped it's rock over. It wasn't animal abuse. It was like pruning my roses.

The world is soft. It's time for me to find a shack in the woods and start writing letters.

Everything you said is wrong. All of that would actually have an impact. Your reef dies so you go replace it and kill more organisms which would have been food in the wild.
If every free frag dies right now it will affect human behavior directly and lead to actions which wouldn't be all good nor bad but a mix of both.
Wow, you want to call the world soft, you got angry because YOU touched a corals defense mechanism. You are surely a mastermind well in control of himself.
If you want to go to a shack and write letters that sounds like somewhere good for your mental state since you won't be surrounded by the overwhelming population of humans that disagrees with you.
You claim theres no impact if you don't perceive one occured or will occur.perhaps you think you're a little wiser than you might truly be....

 

[Townes_Van_Camp]

Everything you said is wrong. All of that would actually have an impact. Your reef dies so you go replace it and kill more organisms which would have been food in the wild.
If every free frag dies right now it will affect human behavior directly and lead to actions which wouldn't be all good nor bad but a mix of both.
Wow, you want to call the world soft, you got angry because YOU touched a corals defense mechanism. You are surely a mastermind well in control of himself.
If you want to go to a shack and write letters that sounds like somewhere good for your mental state since you won't be surrounded by the overwhelming population of humans that disagrees with you.
You claim theres no impact if you don't perceive one occured or will occur.perhaps you think you're a little wiser than you might truly be....

Zero impact and I'm not buying this this Doo Doo. Coral is an ornamental organizm inside the home. You aren't Nobel in your pursuit to keep it alive. You are selfish. You don't get to judge me while doing the exact same thing. How many fish have died to satisfy your desire to covet them? How many sticks die in transit to your LFS. How many fish die that you never see so that you may one day purchase them for you viewing pleasure?

You don't care about that do you? If you did. You would quit right now. You would quit this instant. Yet you don't. Instead you choose to judge others from your own moral high ground. You aren't morally superior because you care about the coral you order. You are selfish.

Harsh pill to swallow. Take it because it's the truth.


I challenge you to stand up for what is right. Lead by example and quit the hobby right now.

By the way, it didn't sting me and I wasn't angry. It's coral, it does what it does. It grew too fast and I pruned a favia the only way I could in that setting. I killed it. So what?

Do you like flowers in a vase on your table?
Do you also drive an electric car because it's good for the planet while ignoring the child slaves who mined your cobalt?

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

Zero impact and I'm not buying this this Doo Doo. Coral is an ornamental organizm inside the home. You aren't Nobel in your pursuit to keep it alive. You are selfish. You don't get to judge me while doing the exact same thing. How many fish have died to satisfy your desire to covet them? How many sticks die in transit to your LFS. How many fish die that you never see so that you may one day purchase them for you viewing pleasure?

You don't care about that do you? If you did. You would quit right now. You would quit this instant. Yet you don't. Instead you choose to judge others from your own moral high ground. You aren't morally superior because you care about the coral you order. You are selfish.

Harsh pill to swallow. Take it because it's the truth.


I challenge you to stand up for what is right. Lead by example and quit the hobby right now.

I assume you're likely very young and feel the need to fight against anyone you think feels is superior to others. Reread what I wrote. You weren't able to comprehend it so I'll repeat myself.
"No, I wouldn't feel bad about shooting a deer when hunting. That's the cycle of life. I dont have to feel pain to have great reverence for life itself. No, I don't feel guilty for my wild collected corals. It has nothing to do with them lacking emotion though. I take as good of care of them as I can and if one dies I don't cry, I still have great respect for life itself though!"
I don't feel bad which I explicitly stated. Was the wording too complex? The difference between me and you is my respect for something we know very little about and humans have failed time and time again to recreate it despite how advanced we've become. How can you have no respect (it actually appears you have disrespect) for something you know probably nothing about on any level. I don't think I'm better than you, only that you seem foolish. I'm not trying to insult you but that's the correct word.


Take that pill.

 

[Townes_Van_Camp]

I assume you're likely very young and feel the need to fight against anyone you think feels is superior to others. Reread what I wrote. You weren't able to comprehend it so I'll repeat myself.
"No, I wouldn't feel bad about shooting a deer when hunting. That's the cycle of life. I dont have to feel pain to have great reverence for life itself. No, I don't feel guilty for my wild collected corals. It has nothing to do with them lacking emotion though. I take as good of care of them as I can and if one dies I don't cry, I still have great respect for life itself though!"
I don't feel bad which I explicitly stated. Was the wording too complex? The difference between me and you is my respect for something we know very little about and humans have failed time and time again to recreate it despite how advanced we've become. How can you have no respect (it actually appears you have disrespect) for something you know probably nothing about on any level. I don't think I'm better than you, only that you seem foolish. I'm not trying to insult you but that's the correct word.


Take that pill.

No I'm very old and tired of judgmental fools who look the other way during the performance of their hypocritical actions then point their finger in superiority. I had long checked out to see you jump in for a final word of judgement when all other states their piece and walked away.

I mean, how many clams can you pack into a 20 gallon reef without being selfish? Did you ever get an answer to that? Don't answer. I think you get the point. Imma put you on ignore. You can do the same for me. Have a good day and good luck with your clams.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

No I'm very old and tired of judgmental fools who look the other way during the performance of their hypocritical actions then point their finger in superiority. I had long checked out to see you jump in for a final word of judgement when all other states their piece and walked away.

I mean, how many clams can you pack into a 20 gallon reef without being selfish? Did you ever get an answer to that? Don't answer. I think you get the point. Imma put you on ignore. You can do the same for me. Have a good day and good luck with your clams.

If you have to protect your ego that way, I support your decision to walk away. I've done nothing hypocritical. Reread what I wrote again and maybe this time you'll understand it. You seem very embittered by life if you are old.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

No I'm very old and tired of judgmental fools who look the other way during the performance of their hypocritical actions then point their finger in superiority. I had long checked out to see you jump in for a final word of judgement when all other states their piece and walked away.

I mean, how many clams can you pack into a 20 gallon reef without being selfish? Did you ever get an answer to that? Don't answer. I think you get the point. Imma put you on ignore. You can do the same for me. Have a good day and good luck with your clams.

If you have to protect your ego that way, I support your decision to walk away. I've done nothing hypocritical. Reread what I wrote again and maybe this time you'll understand it. You seem very embittered by life if you are old.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

No I'm very old and tired of judgmental fools who look the other way during the performance of their hypocritical actions then point their finger in superiority. I had long checked out to see you jump in for a final word of judgement when all other states their piece and walked away.

I mean, how many clams can you pack into a 20 gallon reef without being selfish? Did you ever get an answer to that? Don't answer. I think you get the point. Imma put you on ignore. You can do the same for me. Have a good day and good luck with your clams.

If you have to protect your ego that way, I support your decision to walk away. I've done nothing hypocritical. Reread what I wrote again and maybe this time you'll understand it. You seem very embittered by life if you are old.

 

[thatmanMIKEson]

yes you are. It might be because you are not a vendor and are unfamiliar with how they may operate. I can't speak for all vendors but most of them have no idea what FREE frag they are going to give you until they fill your order. 1st they need to look at your total order and determine what type frags your buying (zoas, lps, sps, ect). Then they have to look and see what frags are available that will go with the corals you're already getting. To ask them to do that in advance for every FREE frag they give away is a big ask. I have been apart of many many frag giveaways and this is the first time someone has complained about a free gift, much less before they even know what the gift is. And to create a thread under the disguise that its a Poll about caring for animals only to further your complaint in public seems very wrong. It's click bait and only hurts the guy that was trying to give you THREE free gifts in the first place.

There is a old saying: " Don't look a gift horse in the mouth"

looking....it was a deep examination of the oral cavity!

 

[Peace River]

We have chosen to close this thread for now and the mod team is currently reviewing the posts. Please remember that being nice is important at R2R. While we appreciate and encourage differences of opinion, please focus on the issues and not on the people. If you have specific questions relating to this action or to this thread, please reach out to me directly via PM.

~Peace