Should I add supplemental T5’s to my Kessil AP9X setup?

[Adam1985]

I would just rock the AP9X. I have the same light and I love it!!!

I previously ran a t5hybrid, it does wonders but… I don’t like the esthetics part. Too bulky for my taste.

These were my thoughts as well but now that it’s on there, I’m starting to like it. Definitely gives a fuller look when running but doesn’t overpower the Kessil shimmer.

Since it’s on during daytime hours only, I’m going to move to 100% ATI blue plus, and save the actinics for when/if I want more fluorescence or use the T5’s at night. I like actinics but feel the Kessil does a better job of fluorescence during sunset, etc.

 

[anthonygf]

Yeah I really like the way you set that up to manage the wires. My wire situation is terrible.

Anyway appreciate the comments. It’s actually the first time someone who knows anything about reefing has complimented my setup.

My other half doesn’t like to discuss my tank (pretty sure it’s a jealousy thing). And people who don’t know reefing might say it’s pretty but have no clue what kind of effort goes in.

Well when I first started reefing I converted my 46 bowfront to salt from fresh with a canister filter while waiting for my new sump. Didn't have room in the cabinet so had to place it on the floor next to tank. My wife finally had enough of it so I told her in order for me to fix it I need a bigger tank, this was the only way to convince her I need bigger. lol Then I got the 75 placed it in another location transferred everything over with new sand and rinsed rocks. I reused one of my canister filters to get it going while cleaning the sump. After a couple weeks noticed my sump will not fit in the cabinet, duh was supposed to go through the top I then realized, so now I am using my spare ten gallon for a sump.

Reefing sure is a learning experience for at least 2 years. I am retired bus mechanic of 20 years, was an auto mechanic for 30. I can think of ideas that can improved things in my life like that coat rack repurposed into a light hanger. My wife was like I don't know Tony, I said would you rather have wires from the ceiling?. Then I decorated the hanger with plastic vines and she likes it better now lol. Those rigid hangers mounted to the tank I hate them, they look nice but when you have to into the water for what ever reason you knock the light off kilter and you have to bend it back, with fixture hanging by wires you can knock the light and it will spring back.

Sorry for the long story. like I said I am retired and have plenty time on my hands. And happy to help new reefers, been there. As time goes on you will want bigger and better things maybe. But never stop learning and go slow, if you want to do something new to change what you are doing ask the experienced reefers heer, most are glad to help even if you think it is a dumb question. Glad to meet you and good luck on your tank. I got to stop talking know. Take Care.

 

[anthonygf]

Sorry. I had to edit my last reply 5 times for misspellings and always proof read before sending to make sure I say nothing offensive and didn't catch it then. I am a perfectionist when it comes to things I do that's why when I get a new job I quickly rise to the top. lol

 

[Adam1985]

Well when I first started reefing I converted my 46 bowfront to salt from fresh with a canister filter while waiting for my new sump. Didn't have room in the cabinet so had to place it on the floor next to tank. My wife finally had enough of it so I told her in order for me to fix it I need a bigger tank, this was the only way to convince her I need bigger. lol Then I got the 75 placed it in another location transferred everything over with new sand and rinsed rocks. I reused one of my canister filters to get it going while cleaning the sump. After a couple weeks noticed my sump will not fit in the cabinet, duh was supposed to go through the top I then realized, so now I am using my spare ten gallon for a sump.

Reefing sure is a learning experience for at least 2 years. I am retired bus mechanic of 20 years, was an auto mechanic for 30. I can think of ideas that can improved things in my life like that coat rack repurposed into a light hanger. My wife was like I don't know Tony, I said would you rather have wires from the ceiling?. Then I decorated the hanger with plastic vines and she likes it better now lol. Those rigid hangers mounted to the tank I hate them, they look nice but when you have to into the water for what ever reason you knock the light off kilter and you have to bend it back, with fixture hanging by wires you can knock the light and it will spring back.

Sorry for the long story. like I said I am retired and have plenty time on my hands. And happy to help new reefers, been there. As time goes on you will want bigger and better things maybe. But never stop learning and go slow, if you want to do something new to change what you are doing ask the experienced reefers heer, most are glad to help even if you think it is a dumb question. Glad to meet you and good luck on your tank. I got to stop talking know. Take Care.

Thanks a lot and likewise! Let’s keep learning together!

 

[anthonygf]

If you want to use the T5's make or buy a bracket to mount all the fixtures to it to make it look like one fixture. Nothing wrong with having all that light. if you do move the lights closer to the water lower the intensity to compensate. I have mine at 90% intensity for the blue spectrum, reds, green keep low 5-10%, whites no higher than 25% or cyano will bloom. In my tank anyway. I will raise the whites if taking pics or just to get a good look into my rocks.

 

[RBarth]

Glad to see someone with an ap9x over a cube. I'm about a month out from buying my light and also have a 2ft cube. Seems like everyone favors the a360/t5 hybrid but I'm kinda in love with the ap9x. How did u feel about the light spill when just using that? Both these options price out about the same but dang the ap9x is just a sharp looking setup! Thanks!

 

[Adam1985]

Glad to see someone with an ap9x over a cube. I'm about a month out from buying my light and also have a 2ft cube. Seems like everyone favors the a360/t5 hybrid but I'm kinda in love with the ap9x. How did u feel about the light spill when just using that? Both these options price out about the same but dang the ap9x is just a sharp looking setup! Thanks!

I’m quite happy with the combination, but if I could go back I probably would have gotten 2 A360x’s or 1 A500x (AP9X fixture is sleeker of course).

Reason being that the distribution from the AP9X is obviously longer than it is wide, which is nice for a mixed reef but isn’t changeable. Now, because my tank is overflowing with corals and fish to the point I can’t add anything else without removing something first, I’m actually going to a 1 m x 1 m x 62 cm tank which while not a cube is still a square footprint. I’m finding that planning how the AP9X will work on the wider, deeper square footprint tank isn’t as easy as it would have been with the single spotlights. Questions like do I go with 2 AP9X’s spaced equally one behind the other (expensive), add A360x’s or an A500 (also expensive), or just keep the one AP9X and add more T5’s, etc. Not a big problem but less adjustable than I’d like. I’m even considering 150W halides on either side of the central AP9X but it would be a nightmare to set up without a ceiling mount.

None of it is cheap of course and you’d probably spend more on multiple spotlights, but having the AP9X is a less adjustable and less symmetrical option.

Light spill is significant but I have mine mounted 10” above the edge of the tank due to the T5 combo fixture only offering two height options (the other being 6”). I went with that after watching a BRS video on the AP9X where 10” from the water was the optimal height to keep intensity loss due to light spill at 15% or less while making the light distribution as even as possible. 10” off the water isn’t possible with my hybrid mount so I went with the closest option and bumped the intensity a little bit.

I’ll probably lower it on the new deeper tank. If I wasn’t changing tanks I’d probably still lower it and drop the AP9X intensity/T5 photo period at first to avoid shocking the corals with suddenly higher intensity.

Overall I’m very happy with the AP9X. In my opinion the color is excellent and the coral growth is decent across the board from leathers to acropora but it’s possible other solutions would give better growth. Adding the T5’s was a good choice in retrospect. I think the rectangular light distribution might be a plus if you want a lot of different light levels in a cube as for a mixed reef, but you could have that with two single spotlights as well.

If I could go back in time and the A500 was available, I probably would have done that instead. I don’t think a single A360x would have done it for me but two would have.

It’s worth noting that the AP9X has more diodes than the A500 (I think 110 total vs. 100) while the power rating is similar. Not sure if that matters in practice. I can’t recall how many the A360’s have.

I wouldn’t bank on spectacular growth with these fixtures but the color is excellent.

Generally speaking I’m not sure these ultra premium LEDs in general offer as much value per dollar cost as some other options but it’s kind of like a luxury car; really awesome if it’s workable for your budget.

 

[Adam1985]

I’m quite happy with the combination, but if I could go back I probably would have gotten 2 A360x’s or 1 A500x (AP9X fixture is sleeker of course).

Reason being that the distribution from the AP9X is obviously longer than it is wide, which is nice for a mixed reef but isn’t changeable. Now, because my tank is overflowing with corals and fish to the point I can’t add anything else without removing something first, I’m actually going to a 1 m x 1 m x 62 cm tank which while not a cube is still a square footprint. I’m finding that planning how the AP9X will work on the wider, deeper square footprint tank isn’t as easy as it would have been with the single spotlights. Questions like do I go with 2 AP9X’s spaced equally one behind the other (expensive), add A360x’s or an A500 (also expensive), or just keep the one AP9X and add more T5’s, etc. Not a big problem but less adjustable than I’d like. I’m even considering 150W halides on either side of the central AP9X but it would be a nightmare to set up without a ceiling mount.

None of it is cheap of course and you’d probably spend more on multiple spotlights, but having the AP9X is a less adjustable and less symmetrical option.

Light spill is significant but I have mine mounted 10” above the edge of the tank due to the T5 combo fixture only offering two height options (the other being 6”). I went with that after watching a BRS video on the AP9X where 10” from the water was the optimal height to keep intensity loss due to light spill at 15% or less while making the light distribution as even as possible. 10” off the water isn’t possible with my hybrid mount so I went with the closest option and bumped the intensity a little bit.

I’ll probably lower it on the new deeper tank. If I wasn’t changing tanks I’d probably still lower it and drop the AP9X intensity/T5 photo period at first to avoid shocking the corals with suddenly higher intensity.

Overall I’m very happy with the AP9X. In my opinion the color is excellent and the coral growth is decent across the board from leathers to acropora but it’s possible other solutions would give better growth. Adding the T5’s was a good choice in retrospect. I think the rectangular light distribution might be a plus if you want a lot of different light levels in a cube as for a mixed reef, but you could have that with two single spotlights as well.

If I could go back in time and the A500 was available, I probably would have done that instead. I don’t think a single A360x would have done it for me but two would have.

It’s worth noting that the AP9X has more diodes than the A500 (I think 110 total vs. 100) while the power rating is similar. Not sure if that matters in practice. I can’t recall how many the A360’s have.

I wouldn’t bank on spectacular growth with these fixtures but the color is excellent.

Generally speaking I’m not sure these ultra premium LEDs in general offer as much value per dollar cost as some other options but it’s kind of like a luxury car; really awesome if it’s workable for your budget.

Not sure if you realized I added 4x24w T5’s as well. I don’t know if it’s truly needed in general, but the AP9X alone left a lot of pretty dark pockets in the front and back due to shadowing from my rock structure so I wanted to fill that in.

But in all honesty, while the T5’s alone fill in those spots nicely, the intensity seems very weak vs. the AP9X. Of course my mounting height is very high and I’ve only got 4 T5’s, while someone traditionally might choose 8 T5 tubes mounted much closer to the water.

I can’t easily get a good PAR meter where I am. At least without spending a fortune, and it’s not like I’d use either of them daily. So take all my intensity comments with a grain of salt; as they have not been actually measured.

All in all I think this setup is very nice solution for a truly mixed reef, but might not be optimal for non-mixed where you might want a more even distribution.

 

[DesertReefT4r]

I vote yes. Here is why. Kessil makes great lights and they really proved a great shimmer, best of all the LED lights in fact. They also really make corals pop with coral. Ever notice how nearly all vendors use Kessil lights on frag tanks at coral shows. Their big down side is also what gives Kessil lights such awesome shimmer, the dense LED cluster. This also causes a lot of shadowing that T5 will fill in.

 

[RBarth]

I’m quite happy with the combination, but if I could go back I probably would have gotten 2 A360x’s or 1 A500x (AP9X fixture is sleeker of course).

Reason being that the distribution from the AP9X is obviously longer than it is wide, which is nice for a mixed reef but isn’t changeable. Now, because my tank is overflowing with corals and fish to the point I can’t add anything else without removing something first, I’m actually going to a 1 m x 1 m x 62 cm tank which while not a cube is still a square footprint. I’m finding that planning how the AP9X will work on the wider, deeper square footprint tank isn’t as easy as it would have been with the single spotlights. Questions like do I go with 2 AP9X’s spaced equally one behind the other (expensive), add A360x’s or an A500 (also expensive), or just keep the one AP9X and add more T5’s, etc. Not a big problem but less adjustable than I’d like. I’m even considering 150W halides on either side of the central AP9X but it would be a nightmare to set up without a ceiling mount.

None of it is cheap of course and you’d probably spend more on multiple spotlights, but having the AP9X is a less adjustable and less symmetrical option.

Light spill is significant but I have mine mounted 10” above the edge of the tank due to the T5 combo fixture only offering two height options (the other being 6”). I went with that after watching a BRS video on the AP9X where 10” from the water was the optimal height to keep intensity loss due to light spill at 15% or less while making the light distribution as even as possible. 10” off the water isn’t possible with my hybrid mount so I went with the closest option and bumped the intensity a little bit.

I’ll probably lower it on the new deeper tank. If I wasn’t changing tanks I’d probably still lower it and drop the AP9X intensity/T5 photo period at first to avoid shocking the corals with suddenly higher intensity.

Overall I’m very happy with the AP9X. In my opinion the color is excellent and the coral growth is decent across the board from leathers to acropora but it’s possible other solutions would give better growth. Adding the T5’s was a good choice in retrospect. I think the rectangular light distribution might be a plus if you want a lot of different light levels in a cube as for a mixed reef, but you could have that with two single spotlights as well.

If I could go back in time and the A500 was available, I probably would have done that instead. I don’t think a single A360x would have done it for me but two would have.

It’s worth noting that the AP9X has more diodes than the A500 (I think 110 total vs. 100) while the power rating is similar. Not sure if that matters in practice. I can’t recall how many the A360’s have.

I wouldn’t bank on spectacular growth with these fixtures but the color is excellent.

Generally speaking I’m not sure these ultra premium LEDs in general offer as much value per dollar cost as some other options but it’s kind of like a luxury car; really awesome if it’s workable for your budget.

Man thanks for this! Ever been in one of those situations where u want what u want and don't like it when others won't agree with u LOL. As much as I love the ap9x I'm just having to come to the conclusion it ain't gonna work for my setup no matter how much I want it to work. I mean, yes it will work but u know what I mean. A360/t5 is what I'm gonna do...at least as of this hour. Left the hobby 10 years ago but used to run a t5/halide combo. Just not wanting to do halide again for different reasons. The one thing I'm actually considering is doing a red sea 90 for the led instead of kessil. Seems like that's all I see around the LFS's lately and I do like the look. Oh well..first world problems!

 

[Adam1985]

Man thanks for this! Ever been in one of those situations where u want what u want and don't like it when others won't agree with u LOL. As much as I love the ap9x I'm just having to come to the conclusion it ain't gonna work for my setup no matter how much I want it to work. I mean, yes it will work but u know what I mean. A360/t5 is what I'm gonna do...at least as of this hour. Left the hobby 10 years ago but used to run a t5/halide combo. Just not wanting to do halide again for different reasons. The one thing I'm actually considering is doing a red sea 90 for the led instead of kessil. Seems like that's all I see around the LFS's lately and I do like the look. Oh well..first world problems!

You’re very welcome and I’ve definitely been in that position before! Your plan makes sense with the A360 since you can basically get the AP9X equivalent a bit later if you want just by adding another A360. Really no idea on the Red Sea; I’m sure they’re good but I tend to go by an old adage that led me to Kessil. Basically that a jack of all trades is a master of none. I’m quite sure that a successful company that only makes special purpose LEDs probably has really good LEDs. From a company that makes a bit of everything, I’d be less certain.

One thing I also look at more these days when looking at equipment is resale value and secondary market demand. If you can resell a piece of equipment and recap most of your value, it’s probably a good piece of equipment.

Good luck; your thinking and logic are sound.