Reasonable Budget for a first timer?

[Fish Styx]

ive never heard this, nor adhere to this. But it definitely feels that way some times. I think unless youre going way high tech its closer to 10-20 a gallon maybe 30.

I'd like to see your 200 gallon build for 2-3k.

 

[Tamberav]

Nah .. it's way closer to $100, than $20

welll technically you could just get a petco 75g and add two jeabos and a heater and some Chinese led (noops?) plus rock and that would run a reef. Blow whatever is left on live rock!

 

[Rijodan]

I'd like to see your 200 gallon build for 2-3k.

ha you joke but currently doing this gimme a min and ill post it

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

highly recomend a made sump, if youre looking at mp40s to start off youve got the money to burn on a good sump. especially if your planning 5,10 year tank.

What perceived benefits are you thinking there is with an acrylic fabricated sump, versus a well laid out DIY sump? It is literally a rectangle with compartments which moves water through it.

on the live rock, bare rock decision keep in mind that youve gotta do the live rock scaping while theyre still wet. dry rock while it has its issues gives you infinite amount of time to build the scape you want

Scaping with wet rock is easiest using a 1/4" impact hammer, 1/4" masonry bit, acrylic rods and ca glue. You can come behind and add epoxy to the joints if you want.

Good the piece how you want it, drill through, insert rod, adjust the fit, fill the hole with glue. Insert acrylic rod and connect. Each joint takes less time than with the powder plus glue plus powder plus glue plus powder plus glue plus burning your fingers on the glue. It's not hard. Also not easy

 

[JCM]

ive never heard this, nor adhere to this. But it definitely feels that way some times. I think unless youre going way high tech its closer to 10-20 a gallon maybe 30.

Eh, I don't agree. Sure, it can be done that cheaply if you don't care what the setup looks like and use the cheapest basic necessity equipment. A redsea tank (which most would probably agree is middle of the road as far as quality) is like $35 a gallon just for the tank/stand/sump. Decent equipment can easily double/triple that.

 

[rja]

Well,
I got my Biocube, light, pump, powerhead, and a few other things for $300. $30 for sand, $50 for rock, and probably $800 in livestock and other equipment. I think using facebook marketplace is a tool that is completely necessary in reefing.

It can be as cheap or expensive as you want it to be. just depends on how much human involvement the tank needs. the handier you are, the easier it is.

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

welll technically you could just get a petco 75g and add two jeabos and a heater and some Chinese led (noops?) plus rock and that would run a reef. Blow whatever is left on live rock!

Correct. I could absolutely build 120 gallon brief for under a grand.

,AND by that same metric using an outlier as an example, TECHNICALLY I can order a Starfire 1-in thick all around including the bottom, plus top of the line everything and spend 30k. It's not the norm but it's possible.

Neither one of those are really the wheelhouse OP was describing.

 

[Rijodan]

Sca 180 gal tank, bought used local with the 8 light unit, stand, 150lb rock, 75g diy sump, random chinese return and power heads. -$450
Vectra L2 new- 550
2 200lb sacks salt - 160
600w heater and controller new - 150
Gyre and controller new -330
Trigger sapphire sump used local -115
Another 200lbs rock from local club leavers just wanting gone -~60 (collected over last 2-3 years)
Reef octo 110- got for the chinese pumps in trade, will upgrade to something later prob in the 400-500 range
Plumbing suppkies ~250
Jebao doser - bought local unused 20
Filter socks - 50-60 bucks

So yeah a new setup may be up near 100 a gall but it does not need to be anywhere near it

 

[Rijodan]

What perceived benefits are you thinking there is with an acrylic fabricated sump, versus a well laid out DIY sump? It is literally a rectangle with compartments which moves water through

not that one couldnt make a good sump from scratch, but many premade tanks are way too tall to fit well under stands if theyre wide enough, or too thin if theyre short enough. if you were to diy a whole sump ill agree with you and it will be much cheaper and more attuned to your needs than anything else. BUT a newly returning reefer wont know what his needs will be, so will either follow blindly or end up with regrets. if hes got the money to burn and wants one that already has much thought put into it why not.

and youre live rock scaping is still avoiding thatyouve got to keep it very wet while working with it, the longer its air drying the more and more die off you have. again i never said it was impossible to scape with live rock just much easier with dry

 

[vetteguy53081]

I honestly have so many woodworking tools and do so much woodworking stuff that I am probably just being lazy not building my own stand :|

This helps cut costs as well as some shelves for stand (inside) and canopy cover if desired to cut light all over the room and to conceal and hang lights.
I tend to get used tanks and you can find cheap ones on Craigslist, Facebook groups, LFS and R2R Marketplace.

 

[Fish Styx]

Sca 180 gal tank, bought used local with the 8 light unit, stand, 150lb rock, 75g diy sump, random chinese return and power heads. -$450
Vectra L2 new- 550
2 200lb sacks salt - 160
600w heater and controller new - 150
Gyre and controller new -330
Trigger sapphire sump used local -115
Another 200lbs rock from local club leavers just wanting gone -~60 (collected over last 2-3 years)
Reef octo 110- got for the chinese pumps in trade, will upgrade to something later prob in the 400-500 range
Plumbing suppkies ~250
Jebao doser - bought local unused 20
Filter socks - 50-60 bucks

So yeah a new setup may be up near 100 a gall but it does not need to be anywhere near it

Again, not what the OP was asking about. I also noted that the $100 per gallon figure was a ballpark (one that is widely accepted, for note), but that buying used equipment could lower it, or conversely, buying all top of the line would raise it. Can it be done for that figure? Sure. Will you be spending double or triple to replace that gear in the first year or so? I'd venture to say, "sure" here, as-well.

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

not that one couldnt make a good sump from scratch, but many premade tanks are way too tall to fit well under stands if theyre wide enough, or too thin if theyre short enough. if you were to diy a whole sump ill agree with you and it will be much cheaper and more attuned to your needs than anything else. BUT a newly returning reefer wont know what his needs will be, so will either follow blindly or end up with regrets. if hes got the money to burn and wants one that already has much thought put into it why not.

I don't really see any benefits, of the premade sump here.. only benefits of the diy.

Many off the shelf with acrylic sumps apartments are too tight, use top bracing which makes it much more difficult to get in and out of, makes viewing from the top harder. DIY you can choose the right size tank for the stand you have. There's a massive variability of height and width and lengths, between 20 gallon and 100 gallon normal aquariums. You Get to choose the right one for you. If you're making your own sump you're not going to end up with one that is oversized, for your stand. You Plan for that because you're doing it. You get to choose the sizes of the compartments, and flow between them quickly based on the equipment you have or what. That's a benefit of a DIY.

Buying a pre-made sump you are essentially following blindly.. You're assuming what was built for Everybody else is going to be right for you.

and youre live rock scaping is still avoiding thatyouve got to keep it very wet while working with it, the longer its air drying the more and more die off you have. again i never said it was impossible to scape with live rock just much easier with dry

You do not need to keep it Very wet. Damp. Moist. A dip in a water bucket next to you. Every two to three minutes is perfectly adequate. The Rock can dry out a lot more than every few minutes before you will have die off that will be worth even trying to measure.
I can connect two medium size rocks together in around 3 minutes, using that method. Everything but the drilling can be done with the rock submerged. Underwater epoxy putty is also a good option.

 

[Rijodan]

But back on topic

OP
seems like youve got much a plan, if you are a cabinet maker you can definetly make a stand that looks better and more sturdy than anything that is off the rack, with the only thing i could think being better is if you could find a welding friend to make you a steel frame and than do cabinet magic to look nice around it.

Mp40s are great pumps and if youre happy with their performance and cost than theres nothing to worry about there other than watch for used equipment,

Apex- take it or leave it i ahve one on my 110g and to be honest i barely use its capablities. its very much a pay to play ecosystem and some automation set up that i wasnt fond of. in my use its a fancy ph and temp graph maker

rodi- just make sure youve got good filters and membrane depending how old the system is, a booster pump is also a great investment for larger tanks

lighting can go any which way, i have no experience with the ai blades but love the ai 16hds i had on the 110 before i upgraded to radions and the 28g i used to have. Radions are great blankets of light costly and depending on what youre growing may need even more many arm brackets or canopy options to set light up. t5 and metal halide also are options

just rent the par meter cause unless youre constantly ******* with settings just write it down when you make it and then return the par meter

sump - as you see from the posts above many good options here, i still lean towards a premade acrylic cause form and function though with a cost. at the end of the day its your wallet and your time that you chose which will work for you. you wont have a tank fail from one or the other

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

But back on topic

OP
seems like youve got much a plan, if you are a cabinet maker you can definetly make a stand that looks better and more sturdy than anything that is off the rack, with the only thing i could think being better is if you could find a welding friend to make you a steel frame and than do cabinet magic to look nice around it.

This is Solid advice. Under my 300, I wish I had made it from steel, and skinned it with Baltic birch. So much more room.

 

[JCM]

This is Solid advice. Under my 300, I wish I had made it from steel, and skinned it with Baltic birch. So much more room.

That's exactly what I did, super happy with it. All the panels are held on with magnets. Sump work is such a breeze with the panels removed

 

[vittpsu21]

But back on topic

OP
seems like youve got much a plan, if you are a cabinet maker you can definetly make a stand that looks better and more sturdy than anything that is off the rack, with the only thing i could think being better is if you could find a welding friend to make you a steel frame and than do cabinet magic to look nice around it.

Mp40s are great pumps and if youre happy with their performance and cost than theres nothing to worry about there other than watch for used equipment,

Apex- take it or leave it i ahve one on my 110g and to be honest i barely use its capablities. its very much a pay to play ecosystem and some automation set up that i wasnt fond of. in my use its a fancy ph and temp graph maker

rodi- just make sure youve got good filters and membrane depending how old the system is, a booster pump is also a great investment for larger tanks

lighting can go any which way, i have no experience with the ai blades but love the ai 16hds i had on the 110 before i upgraded to radions and the 28g i used to have. Radions are great blankets of light costly and depending on what youre growing may need even more many arm brackets or canopy options to set light up. t5 and metal halide also are options

just rent the par meter cause unless youre constantly ******* with settings just write it down when you make it and then return the par meter

sump - as you see from the posts above many good options here, i still lean towards a premade acrylic cause form and function though with a cost. at the end of the day its your wallet and your time that you chose which will work for you. you wont have a tank fail from one or the other

yeah I think that Lost convinced me of the same on the stand front, I did a bit of research and honestly it wont take me more than a weekend to do this + canopy if I want as well (if I go with the blades I am honestly not sure I even need a canopy)

I should definitely have clarified I do not plan to keep the par meter, I do think I will drop the apex for now, a lot of the feedback is take it or leave it so better to start without and then see.

As for the sump I see both pov's on this and if I had more experience I think DIY would be my instant go to because I could plan more properly, that being said the cost savings is definitely still there on a DIY so I have to figure out what I think my time and headache are worth on something like this.

Appreciate the feedback

 

[vittpsu21]

This is Solid advice. Under my 300, I wish I had made it from steel, and skinned it with Baltic birch. So much more room.

I assume space coming from formfactor yeah? Can just support more with a smaller framework on steel?

 

[vittpsu21]

this can be cause of concern. some heating sysems will cause ph issues if directed at tank and then ac blowing on the tank in summer, just keep in mind this can cause issues.

highly recomend a made sump, if youre looking at mp40s to start off youve got the money to burn on a good sump. especially if your planning 5,10 year tank.

on the live rock, bare rock decision keep in mind that youve gotta do the live rock scaping while theyre still wet. dry rock while it has its issues gives you infinite amount of time to build the scape you want

ah yes sorry there is no actual supply or return vents, the actual air/heat just runs above where the tank will go(it is covered in drywall so I can't really drill through it without puncturing the actual system)

 

[vittpsu21]

I don't really see any benefits, of the premade sump here.. only benefits of the diy.

Many off the shelf with acrylic sumps apartments are too tight, use top bracing which makes it much more difficult to get in and out of, makes viewing from the top harder. DIY you can choose the right size tank for the stand you have. There's a massive variability of height and width and lengths, between 20 gallon and 100 gallon normal aquariums. You Get to choose the right one for you. If you're making your own sump you're not going to end up with one that is oversized, for your stand. You Plan for that because you're doing it. You get to choose the sizes of the compartments, and flow between them quickly based on the equipment you have or what. That's a benefit of a DIY.

Buying a pre-made sump you are essentially following blindly.. You're assuming what was built for Everybody else is going to be right for you.

You do not need to keep it Very wet. Damp. Moist. A dip in a water bucket next to you. Every two to three minutes is perfectly adequate. The Rock can dry out a lot more than every few minutes before you will have die off that will be worth even trying to measure.
I can connect two medium size rocks together in around 3 minutes, using that method. Everything but the drilling can be done with the rock submerged. Underwater epoxy putty is also a good option.

oddly I find the aquascaping to be the most daunting for me, I am hoping I am just being over the top with it but last time I hardcore struggled with this **** lol

 

[dedragon]

hould have clarified, the way I tend to scape involves a lot of experimentation and repositioning before supergluing and epoxying. I usually take a few days to get it all situated. Doing this while keeping the rock moist would be tough for me and my living situation, so much easier to use dry rock. Could definitely do the same with live rock, but. . . not for me.

you would have loved pukani dry rock when it was available. It was way cheaper than live or even dry (fake) rock today. It was also lightweight, with tons of structure to work with