Radium metal halide bulbs will not be produced anymore!

[JCOLE]

How many hours per day are you running these? What ballasts are you using?

8 hours a day on the Hamilton M135 400 Watt Pulse Start Ballast

 

[Graemesreef]

Had a chat late last night with a semi-friend overseas. He said that the market is currently changing, but not going away... and it started a while ago with some stock dwindling of known companies. He put the annual bulb demand well over 100k in total. There was a rise in 2018 to now in both planted and reef tank demand, but still not what it was before T5 - we knew there was a rise about then from several different manufacturers. T5 cut MH use more than LED did. Their company will still make bulbs as long as public aquariums and researchers still want to use them, and this is a big enough market - some of the research institutions buy hundreds a year and change them at the moment that output or spectrum shift just a little bit which is sometimes a month or two. Some of these places tried LED, but could not use the "but" in the typical reason of "MH was the best light that I ever used, but..." and they need the optimum performance. These research institutions exist all over the world where there are oceans.

He did confirm that NOBODY has banned or limited hobby and specialty type bulbs. It takes special people, who are smart, to exempt total parts of a market in legislation. In our cases, these will be people who are researchers with pHd, etc. who wold likely testify the LED cannot do the same thing and also that there are no real power savings. The regulators won't look to math-lacking hobbyists or stupid manufacturers claims. With power not being an issue, then it is down to hazardous materials and a single thermostat contains between 2.5 and 4 grams of mercury and a MODERN MH bulbs is between 10 and 50mg.

This is me talking now, but the argument for everybody just to get a whole pile of 400w halides and 4x T5s has been gone for a long time. LED did help with this - it made people do math. Most people could use 150w halides and on a tank like a 75, 90 or 120 gallon, those 300 watts are less, or no more, than what people use with their panels or T5s... and save some heater costs since 150w Halides don't really heat the tank up all that much.

My point exactly, there will always be a product available that fits one's needs as long as the demand is right. REPLACEMENTS will always be available when a company goes under or calls it quits. Thats what China does and they're very good at it. As a proud American I try my best to shop responsibly but the current administration is making it almost impossible.

 

[Troylee]

You lads may be getting the A's here shortly. Of course this is a 100% unrelated topic post but figured it wouldn't hurt

They’re coming.. they’re actually demolishing the Tropicana hotel and casino “a Vegas icon” to build the ball park..

 

[X-37B]

In

I think this time this is it for halides as Europe is pushing for less energy using items. Europe has a poor energy system to begin with. They have a dream of electric cars, scooters, and everything else. The grid systems around the world will not handle everyone boosted into it. They still need fossil fuels to run the grid. Even in the US our grid is not going to take everyone driving an electric car. That is the secret they are not telling anyone or that the system has to use fossil fuels or nuclear power plants to drive what energy we could produce. Energy is not finite. Can you say rolling power outages. I picture nations having to shut off power for 4 to 6 hours a day just to meet demand.

Interesting take. Most forget that their electric car still needs the grid for power.
The US

Has anyone ever tried the $20 Marine color bulbs from Ebay? Debating ordering one to compare par/spectrum.

Yes I have a few. I prefered the Aquaticlife 150de fo $20 too. I ran 1 of the other ebay $20 bulbs and it lasted 3 months so I never bought more.

 

[jda]

How cool would it be if somebody produced an HQI version of the 20k Radium reformulated with less IR and heat? Hammy did this with their new 20k for electronic ballasts where they are much less hot than they used to be and look like Radiums. Radium bulb always have been more hot than most. ...just wondering...

 

[Troylee]

How cool would it be if somebody produced an HQI version of the 20k Radium reformulated with less IR and heat? Hammy did this with their new 20k for electronic ballasts where they are much less hot than they used to be and look like Radiums. Radium bulb always have been more hot than most. ...just wondering...

It would just be cool to find some double ended 250w hqi bulbs period haha! I think I bought the last 2 Phoenix known to man.. every where says out of stock

 

[jmichaelh7]

It would just be cool to find some double ended 250w hqi bulbs period haha! I think I bought the last 2 Phoenix known to man.. every where says out of stock

some day on ebay maybe they will pop up!

 

[X-37B]

Here are some de 250's on ebay.
They have 6500, 15 and 20k in stock if anyone want to give them a try.
If I was to keep the 250de I have I would look at these.
More available than I thought their would be.

MH Bulb 250W Metal Halide 250 Watts Lamp 10000K 15000K 20000K 10K 15K 20K FC2 DE | eBay

Base: FC2 double ended (DE). Available Spectrum: 6500K, 10000K, 15000K. Helpful Links. Used products will not be accepted.

www.ebay.com

 

[Battlecorals]

Since I have an investment in Halide with 5 years of 400w Radiums stocked up. What is the maximum length I could run a bulb before changing. I realize there will be a spectrum shift, etc but if I cannot get these bulbs anymore, I want to use them as long as I can.

I may get some valid blow back on this one man but I say shoot for 2 at least and aim for 3 years a bulb unless you see undeniable proof that the lighting is causing you issues

I got 3+ years out of an iwasaki overdriven on m-80s even. I made thread about it somewhere I'll see if I can dig it up.

 

[jda]

I used most bulbs for 2 years. I can tell a slight difference when I change them whereas I cannot after a year so much.

 

[jmichaelh7]

I may get some valid blow back on this one man but I say shoot for 2 at least and aim for 3 years a bulb unless you see undeniable proof that the lighting is causing you issues

I got 3+ years out of an iwasaki overdriven on m-80s even. I made thread about it somewhere I'll see if I can dig it up.

I used most bulbs for 2 years. I can tell a slight difference when I change them whereas I cannot after a year so much.

With my recent purchase i should be good for 12 years then

 

[jda]

The bulbs lose a lot of their output in the first few months. Then they stay pretty stable for about 24 months, if not longer. Spectrum shift barely happens, but it does.

Here is a long-term study with Phoenix 14k. These are not magical with some type of salts or halides in them that other bulbs could never figure out. I don't expect these exact same results with other bulbs, but they should be in the ballpark. My testing in the years that I have had my Apogee 510 has shown similar initial decline and then flatter output afterward with every bulb. I have no issues using my Phoenix 14k for 24 months.

Their advice: just lower the fixture a few inches and you are right back to where you started with output.

https://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-04/ac/index.php

 

[GarrettT]

I used most bulbs for 2 years. I can tell a slight difference when I change them whereas I cannot after a year so much.

How long are you running them?

 

[jda]

I am a 10 hour a day guy - on an off with a light timer. For the part time runners, like 4-5 hours a day, run them things for 4 years... or until new bulbs are abundant again.

 

[jmichaelh7]

The bulbs lose a lot of their output in the first few months. Then they stay pretty stable for about 24 months, if not longer. Spectrum shift barely happens, but it does.

Here is a long-term study with Phoenix 14k. These are not magical with some type of salts or halides in them that other bulbs could never figure out. I don't expect these exact same results with other bulbs, but they should be in the ballpark. My testing in the years that I have had my Apogee 510 has shown similar initial decline and then flatter output afterward with every bulb. I have no issues using my Phoenix 14k for 24 months.

Their advice: just lower the fixture a few inches and you are right back to where you started with output.

https://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-04/ac/index.php

Wow this is very interesting

 

[njreefkeeper]

I may get some valid blow back on this one man but I say shoot for 2 at least and aim for 3 years a bulb unless you see undeniable proof that the lighting is causing you issues

I got 3+ years out of an iwasaki overdriven on m-80s even. I made thread about it somewhere I'll see if I can dig it up.

Adam, I think there was a test done years back in the mid 2000’s (showing my age here) that showed the spectral shift of metal halide lighting. Of particular note was that all the “blue, bluish white and white bulbs” (10-20k) shift hard toward yellow a little after a year of normal usage. The Iwasaki if I’m not mistaken is a 6500k bulb with a noticeable yellow hue that had virtually no spectral shift…only a slight decline in par. So that may be why those wanting a bluish halide tank lose considerable output and replace after a year.

 

[aquavista99]

I always switched my halide bulbs out frequently. Before 2014, I would donate them to a local hobbyist for extended use. Since then, I saved many years worth of used halide bulbs in boxes in my basement....just waiting to recycle ♻ them responsibly knowing I would have to pay a fee for proper disposal. I even added detailed notes on each bulb box every time I replaced them. Each bulb was used for about 7 to 11 months on average. Most are Ushio 14k 400 watt mogul bulbs (some 250 watt) and more recently Hamilton 20k 400 watt moguls.

 

[Rjmul]

But specialty lighting like reef tanks the leds draw as much as a mh on the higher end fixtures.. xr30 is almost equivalent of a 250w mh… to bad it’s not a big enough market

Ding ding ding

 

[jda]

It just hit me that I am pretty sure that Advance Aquarist did another paper from months 12-24 with those Phoenix bulbs. I have to go do something else right now, but I did search for a minute or two. If somebody has a link, please post it.

@aquavista99 - you can use all of those babies for another year.

 

[GarrettT]

Can any MH bulb be used on any electronic ballast as long as their wattage is the same and bulb type (single/double ended) matches pendant? Feel like I read awhile back that only specific bulbs and ballasts were compatible.