Question for control freaks out there

[C4ctus99]

So just out of curiosity… what size tank(s?) do you have and what do you have in it(them) cause this is one heck of a setup

 

[Reefering1]

180g total volume aspiring sps dominant consisting of 3 hydra64s supplementing 2 pheonix14k halides on m80 ballasts(these can but don't run during power outage), 2 maxspect xf250,2 jabao powerheads(need more flow),15000 l/h return pump. Alkatronic, dosetronic, 1/3hp chiller, a bunch of fans and refugium light. After writing this I realize your probably asking OP this question

 

[JDCagley]

No they are not.

There are no inputs of this kind on the APEX. I spoke to Terence (before Neptune was sold) about the million possibilities it would open but he wasn't interested. The array of high quality accessories with 0-10 or 4-20mA is just mind blowing....but until somebody starts selling their own why would you allow people to integrate anything from outside the ecosystem. Bah! god forbid you bought your Aquabus cables not from Neptune.

Kind of makes me happy I never considered buying one! I work in controls as a software engineer, so it wouldn't have been a benefit to me to even try an apex - but I have been curious about their capabilities. Considering their logic takes me back to the 1980's, I guess I am not surprised they don't accept industry standard inputs. That's a shame really, for the cost, that there is no openness about their system. The realm I work in is Whole Building Automation - we control everything that deals with the comfort of a building - boilers, chillers, pumps, air handlers, RTU's, FCU's all the way to the zone level thermostat. So, 15 years ago when I started in controls, I immediately saw the correlation between hvac controls and fish tanks (I was a journeyman electrician when I started controls and had a poorly rigged reef at that time). Pumps, temps, flow rates, delta t's, on and on - makes life nice for the reef mangement when the control system allows you the flexibility to use YOUR mind - and that being the ONLY limit!
Sounds like apex is something I will no longer even wonder about if they can't accept simple 0-10/4-20 inputs.

 

[BZOFIQ]

So just out of curiosity… what size tank(s?) do you have and what do you have in it(them) cause this is one heck of a setup

It's a 270G 83x32x24 with 150G sump primarily. Been in the hobby for nearly 2 decades so I've seen fair share of equipment failures for which there are solutions out there to either prevent or timely notify so you or somebody else can do something about it. Years ago, we did single pump, single heater, no controllers - times have changed.

My last setup was listed here, post #17, I'm not into $2000 frags, just simple softies with few LPS; I think this is going to be not much different; perhaps nicer softies and generally not frags!

QUESTION OF THE DAY - Plush polyp pool: Have you ever had a softie tank?

Plush polyp pool: Have you ever had a softie tank? Softie tanks can be beautiful too! With all the marketing focus on SPS and LPS highlighting the latest acro, torch, or other “must-have” coral, it seems that soft corals don’t get the same level of love. Sometimes softie tanks are viewed as...

www.reef2reef.com

Once I set things up I tend not to tinker with things. I sit back and enjoy looking at it. I keep my hands out of the water except for hand feeding. I put the work before so I don't have to worry later.

If there is one tank I aspire to mimic - it would have to be this one.

 

[C4ctus99]

Kind of makes me happy I never considered buying one! I work in controls as a software engineer, so it wouldn't have been a benefit to me to even try an apex - but I have been curious about their capabilities. Considering their logic takes me back to the 1980's, I guess I am not surprised they don't accept industry standard inputs. That's a shame really, for the cost, that there is no openness about their system. The realm I work in is Whole Building Automation - we control everything that deals with the comfort of a building - boilers, chillers, pumps, air handlers, RTU's, FCU's all the way to the zone level thermostat. So, 15 years ago when I started in controls, I immediately saw the correlation between hvac controls and fish tanks (I was a journeyman electrician when I started controls and had a poorly rigged reef at that time). Pumps, temps, flow rates, delta t's, on and on - makes life nice for the reef mangement when the control system allows you the flexibility to use YOUR mind - and that being the ONLY limit!
Sounds like apex is something I will no longer even wonder about if they can't accept simple 0-10/4-20 inputs.

I have a few friends who jumped ship from the electrical company I work for to do facility automation. I’ll have to get with you whenever I start deciding to automate my tank. How much trouble do you have with salt water ruining stuff like float switches and temp gauges and stuff when you use industrial?

 

[C4ctus99]

It's a 270G 83x32x24 with 150G sump primarily. Been in the hobby for nearly 2 decades so I've seen fair share of equipment failures for which there are solutions out there to either prevent or timely notify so you or somebody else can do something about it. Years ago, we did single pump, single heater, no controllers - times have changed.

My last setup was listed here, post #17, I'm not into $2000 frags, just simple softies with few LPS; I think this is going to be not much different; perhaps nicer softies and generally not frags!

QUESTION OF THE DAY - Plush polyp pool: Have you ever had a softie tank?

Plush polyp pool: Have you ever had a softie tank? Softie tanks can be beautiful too! With all the marketing focus on SPS and LPS highlighting the latest acro, torch, or other “must-have” coral, it seems that soft corals don’t get the same level of love. Sometimes softie tanks are viewed as...

www.reef2reef.com

Once I set things up I tend not to tinker with things. I sit back and enjoy looking at it. I keep my hands out of the water except for hand feeding. I put the work before so I don't have to worry later.

If there is one tank I aspire to mimic - it would have to be this one.

View attachment 3078928

Makes sense, just an incredible amount of redundancy and for a second I was wondering if you had some of those $3,000 fish or something

 

[Lbrdsoxfan]

Kind of makes me happy I never considered buying one! I work in controls as a software engineer, so it wouldn't have been a benefit to me to even try an apex - but I have been curious about their capabilities. Considering their logic takes me back to the 1980's, I guess I am not surprised they don't accept industry standard inputs. That's a shame really, for the cost, that there is no openness about their system. The realm I work in is Whole Building Automation - we control everything that deals with the comfort of a building - boilers, chillers, pumps, air handlers, RTU's, FCU's all the way to the zone level thermostat. So, 15 years ago when I started in controls, I immediately saw the correlation between hvac controls and fish tanks (I was a journeyman electrician when I started controls and had a poorly rigged reef at that time). Pumps, temps, flow rates, delta t's, on and on - makes life nice for the reef mangement when the control system allows you the flexibility to use YOUR mind - and that being the ONLY limit!
Sounds like apex is something I will no longer even wonder about if they can't accept simple 0-10/4-20 inputs.

I wish I had the time/energy to get into controls. When I was in the learning phase it was all relays and timers as PLC controls was still only large scale, industrial applications (mid 90's).

I look at the stuff my younger brother bangs out without thinking (he does robotics and programming for assembly line applications) and I'm just amazed. I have some primitive AB rslogix and some siemens S7 knowledge but I dont have the drive to do it from scratch. On the other side of it the apex logic/programming is childs play, its boolean logic simple.

 

[JDCagley]

I have a few friends who jumped ship from the electrical company I work for to do facility automation. I’ll have to get with you whenever I start deciding to automate my tank. How much trouble do you have with salt water ruining stuff like float switches and temp gauges and stuff when you use industrial?

I have had zero failures of any sensor on this current tank of 1 year. Temp sensors I use SS and wrap them in heat shrink, then seal the ends with epoxy. I forsee them lasting forever. Floats - I don't use any mechanical floats. I am currently done testing the flowline ultra sonic sensor (is very accurate - see previous trend data screenshot) for an ATO system. Beyond that, I do all monitoring of equipment status using wrap around current transmitters. Measuring the voltages as well, I am able to get a "real" real-time wattage/current useage thus giving me real-time totals of tank load, deamand, Max daily consumption, etc. The graphic below (and the logic underneath) is some I wrote for a large campus-wide Geo Thermal plant. This tracks every single device that consumes energy in my tank. I did not have all items monitored 100% until late December - so all previous months are not the full tank demand totals.
All in all - there are devices specifically made for corrosive environments that I would suspect work quite well with saltwater also. Considering cooling towers have some of the most caustic chemicals known to man in them and I have sensors located all over the midwest - some have been installed for more than 10 years with no failures reported.

 

[robinm]

I'd wire 1 direct and stick an optocoupler on the line and wire the second to the opto. When current flows in the primary it will allow current in the secondary whilst keeping them completely isolated.

 

[JDCagley]

I wish I had the time/energy to get into controls. When I was in the learning phase it was all relays and timers as PLC controls was still only large scale, industrial applications (mid 90's).

I look at the stuff my younger brother bangs out without thinking (he does robotics and programming for assembly line applications) and I'm just amazed. I have some primitive AB rslogix and some siemens S7 knowledge but I dont have the drive to do it from scratch. On the other side of it the apex logic/programming is childs play, its boolean logic simple.

Quite honestly, to me, all logic is 'simple' - it is merely a human telling a mchine how to do human things - measure this, if that, then do this....etc.
Newer styles of logic though are graphical in nature - some do it better than others. I am partial to my software as it is what I use everyday and find it extremly simple to use. Obviously building logic that works is a skill - but seeing text-based logic, still in 2023, makes me scratch my head! The thought of going back to that would make me do everything manual!