problem controling a nicrew 50W lamp

[bishoptf]

I certainly hope so ! If everything else fails I would try to manipulate PS and directly input a 5V PWM signal to the channels, that should work as well, IF it's supposed to be 5V PWM


One question: can you trace where that mistery trace is going to and if it is also connected to R4 ?
View attachment 2981694

Yeah the dang standoffs and 3.5mm connectors throw shadows, I removed the standoffs and here is a pic, looks like it goes to the 3.5mm input jack, I will try to match it to a pin...but here is the pic:

Update, checking with continuity and the 3.5input pins, r11 is connected to ground.

 

[bishoptf]

Ya know looking the board if it would be easier to get a better look at the board I can desolder the 3.5mm plugs and remove them from the board, let me know if you think that would help even more, just throwing that out there. I can solder and de-solder stuff, that I am somewhat capable of, lol.

 

[Sral]

Ya know looking the board if it would be easier to get a better look at the board I can desolder the 3.5mm plugs and remove them from the board, let me know if you think that would help even more, just throwing that out there. I can solder and de-solder stuff, that I am somewhat capable of, lol.

It would help, although I can't tell you if it helps enough to value the risk. I have had bad experiences desoldering things that are stuck with 5 pins simultaneously

Yeah the dang standoffs and 3.5mm connectors throw shadows, I removed the standoffs and here is a pic, looks like it goes to the 3.5mm input jack, I will try to match it to a pin...but here is the pic:

Update, checking with continuity and the 3.5input pins, r11 is connected to ground.

Hm, that would mean that PS just creates 12mA of load on the 24V line. Strange.


So we have PS, which seems to create some load.
We have 2 PWM outs identified
We have 2 Analog Inputs 0-4.8V identified
We have the VCC voltage of ~5V
What's missing is this mistery pin that I suspected of detecting whether a jack is connected.

What I would try to do is input your signal at 100% and power up the board and tuirn the lamps off at the controls. Now measure the DC and AC voltage between the Input T pin and the pin next to it that didn't have continuity (marked in orange):

I'm thinking whether that could have catastrophic consequences, but I would maybe try to short those two pins manually, that is the T pin and the marked one without continuity.

 

[bishoptf]

It would help, although I can't tell you if it helps enough to value the risk. I have had bad experiences desoldering things that are stuck with 5 pins simultaneously


Hm, that would mean that PS just creates 12mA of load on the 24V line. Strange.


So we have PS, which seems to create some load.
We have 2 PWM outs identified
We have 2 Analog Inputs 0-4.8V identified
We have the VCC voltage of ~5V
What's missing is this mistery pin that I suspected of detecting whether a jack is connected.

What I would try to do is input your signal at 100% and power up the board and tuirn the lamps off at the controls. Now measure the DC and AC voltage between the Input T pin and the pin next to it that didn't have continuity (marked in orange):
View attachment 2981807

I'm thinking whether that could have catastrophic consequences, but I would maybe try to short those two pins manually, that is the T pin and the marked one without continuity.

FYI, the controls on the front panel only go from 5%-100%, they do not turn the lights off.

 

[theatrus]

No but why a 5v power supply I can do that, but I have verified that the output from my reef-pi controls a kessil which is the same 10v input. I can do it but just trying ti understand what that accomplishes...

Main reason was to check for source impedance - if the controller expects to sink a lot of mA, it may simply drop the voltage below a reasonable level. At least rules out one weird issue

 

[bishoptf]

Main reason was to check for source impedance - if the controller expects to sink a lot of mA, it may simply drop the voltage below a reasonable level. At least rules out one weird issue

I can do it, I assume I just feed the 5v to one of the pins and see if anything happens?

 

[bishoptf]

My other used unit I purchased will be in tomorrow, will be curious to see if that one works or not...FYI...

 

[theatrus]

I can do it, I assume I just feed the 5v to one of the pins and see if anything happens?

That's the idea. Just to rule out anything in the signal generation.

 

[bishoptf]

SO i have a 4 prong trrs plug and it seems to act differently vs the three prong, so maybe I need a 4 prong plug...

this was one of the original postings that called stuff out.

THey even said a trs plug should work...i dunno at this point, will try 5v later tonight...

 

[theatrus]

SO i have a 4 prong trrs plug and it seems to act differently vs the three prong, so maybe I need a 4 prong plug...

this was one of the original postings that called stuff out.

View attachment 2982213

THey even said a trs plug should work...i dunno at this point, will try 5v later tonight...

On TRS plugs, the three conductor version the sleeve conductor is the space where +24V and Ground are on the four conductor as shown here.

This could obviously lead to some issues, and prevent powering up the logic circuits in the PWM part (as its probably protected)

 

[bishoptf]

Here was one of the original threads, made it seem simple, same controller as what is running a Kessil...https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/reef-pi-control-lighting.811639/

My setup does work on my kessil so theres that, lol....

 

[Sral]

I can do it, I assume I just feed the 5v to one of the pins and see if anything happens?

Yeah, feed one of the signal ports (Tip or Ring) the 5V and connect GND to the sleeve.

I don't think this will show anything, but you never know

 

[Sral]

On TRS plugs, the three conductor version the sleeve conductor is the space where +24V and Ground are on the four conductor as shown here.

This could obviously lead to some issues, and prevent powering up the logic circuits in the PWM part (as its probably protected)

Actually ... this could be what the p-MOSFET is for. Supply that 24V, but limit the current if the plug shorts this to GND.

@Tom Bishop: if you try a TRRS plug: be careful with those 24V. What kind of connector/socket do you have on the ReefPi side ? I would not want you to fry any ReefPi components with that, so best just try your TRRS connector with the 5V USB. Rather fry that USB supply than your Setup.

 

[bishoptf]

Actually ... this could be what the p-MOSFET is for. Supply that 24V, but limit the current if the plug shorts this to GND.

@Tom Bishop: if you try a TRRS plug: be careful with those 24V. What kind of connector/socket do you have on the ReefPi side ? I would not want you to fry any ReefPi components with that, so best just try your TRRS connector with the 5V USB. Rather fry that USB supply than your Setup.

Yeah the one TRRS plug that I do have I cut the end off and the conductors are minuscule, an audio plug so it's not really useful. I think I have the other unit coming in today, will be interesting to see if it works with a trs plug or not, if it does then I know my current unit is busted which is what I believe it is. I just don't want to have to take another one apart but might have to do that and see what the other board looks like.

I think if you use a trrs plug then it can supply 24v, their new controller I believe can be run from the lights so I think it supplies 24v if using a trrs plug.

Where does that leave us, basically those back pins on the board are coming from the 3.5mm input jacks, they have no markings on them, but how do we take the next step to figure out whats busted on the board? I thought about taking voltage of the light going through its settings, that will at least give us an idea of what it is using internally for pwm. I took some measurements before but I think what I saw was .1v through 5v which was 5%,20,40-100% but I can take them again to verify if needed.

 

[bishoptf]

I did the 5v test and it was kind of a bust but when testing I noticed that all is not well with that input module, if you flex the cable or just tap it, it lights all the leds up. I can't quite pinpoint where the issue is but there is something that is not making proper contact, I have uploaded a short video to show what I am talking about. Just need to figure out what is causing that, the cable is seated but you twist it or tap the module and it does this.

nicrew 50w

youtube.com

Pretty sure it shouldnt be doing that, but let me know what you think.

 

[theatrus]

I did the 5v test and it was kind of a bust but when testing I noticed that all is not well with that input module, if you flex the cable or just tap it, it lights all the leds up. I can't quite pinpoint where the issue is but there is something that is not making proper contact, I have uploaded a short video to show what I am talking about. Just need to figure out what is causing that, the cable is seated but you twist it or tap the module and it does this.

nicrew 50w

youtube.com

Pretty sure it shouldnt be doing that, but let me know what you think.

Usually a cracked solder joint, _usually_ in a connector.

 

[Lbrdsoxfan]

I'm just watching this thread out of curiosity, but I used to have the 150w nicrews on my tank and I used the Kessil/apex plug for dimming with good success which IIRC was a trs plug.

I'm totally curious on the end game of this one.

Following!

 

[bishoptf]

I'm just watching this thread out of curiosity, but I used to have the 150w nicrews on my tank and I used the Kessil/apex plug for dimming with good success which IIRC was a trs plug.

I'm totally curious on the end game of this one.

Following!

Welcome along to my latest rabbit hole, lol...wasted a bunch of time on this but I'd like to get it working...@theatrus and @Sral are the smart ones, I'm just glad they are helping me oither wise I would be lost in the desert...

 

[bishoptf]

Usually a cracked solder joint, _usually_ in a connector.

Welp I touch some joints and put things back and still no joy, its right at the connector, I turned around the connector and it followed the cable so its the cable and I see one connector that looks like its broken...and wouldnt you know it, they chose to use JST PH connectors 2mm pitch, I have tools and materials to make JST XH and ST connectors, how I do everything for my connectors but have no PH connectors or cable, lol....

trying to figure out how to remove the connectors from the shell, SMH

 

[theatrus]

Welp I touch some joints and put things back and still no joy, its right at the connector, I turned around the connector and it followed the cable so its the cable and I see one connector that looks like its broken...and wouldnt you know it, they chose to use JST PH connectors 2mm pitch, I have tools and materials to make JST XH and ST connectors, how I do everything for my connectors but have no PH connectors or cable, lol....

trying to figure out how to remove the connectors from the shell, SMH

Hah. Yeah. I own more bespoke crimp tools now than I care to admit...

Most of the JSTs I can just stab the visible locking tab with a pair of small tweezers and get it to pop out.