NEW Vodka and Vinegar Dosing Charts

[davidwillis]

I have some information on this!


Here’s a quote by Randy



You can reduce the total pH drop by 50% solely by saturating calcium hydroxide with vinegar.

Add kalkwasser powder to the jug of vinegar until no more solid calcium hydroxide (kalkwasser) dissolves. You should see undissolved solids that will settle on the bottom after letting the container settle for a few minutes.

If you add more vinegar, the remaining powder will redissolve, so don’t assume the precipitate went to waste. It’s just an insurance policy that all the acidity was neutralized.

Only dose the clear liquid on top.

This solution will raise calcium and alkalinity in a balanced fashion.

If you follow the week 2 dosage with saturated calcium hydroxide with vinegar, you will roughly add 0.3dKH per day.

So week 2 dosage with saturated calcium hydroxide/vinegar, would add 0.3dkh per day. How does that compare to soda ash? Meaning how much soda ash would you need to dose to equal the same dkh per day. Or in other words if I know how much soda Ash I am dosing how would I figure out how much it would need to be reduced to add the same dkh per day?

Also am I correct in saying that the .3dkh from the hydroxide increases ph more than the same dkh from soda ash?

 

[Reefering1]

In my opinion, yes.

I don’t have an answer for those other questions. It seems like it would need complicated answer.

I don’t think you’d need to worry about bacteria outcompeting corals for nutrients. Just don’t bottom the nutrients out.

Thank you!!

 

[Kzang]

Ever experimented with suboptimal aka under dosing carbon, for the bacteria growth to feed corals and not focus on lowering nitrate?

 

[jsker]

Nice write up!!

 

[Miami Reef]

Ever experimented with suboptimal aka under dosing carbon, for the bacteria growth to feed corals and not focus on lowering nitrate?

You can totally do this! I highly recommend vinegar for this. Maybe dose at or below week 1. The bacteria that gets spurred from organic carbon + the coral’s direct metabolism of acetate make vinegar the best choice for this goal IMO.

 

[Miami Reef]

So week 2 dosage with saturated calcium hydroxide/vinegar, would add 0.3dkh per day. How does that compare to soda ash? Meaning how much soda ash would you need to dose to equal the same dkh per day. Or in other words if I know how much soda Ash I am dosing how would I figure out how much it would need to be reduced to add the same dkh per day?

Also am I correct in saying that the .3dkh from the hydroxide increases ph more than the same dkh from soda ash?

What was your tank size?

Also, hydroxide has twice the pH boost of sodium carbonate (per unit of alk added). However, hydroxide mixed with vinegar does not have much of a pH rise in my experience. It seems to just eliminate the pH drop, but it doesn’t actually raise it appreciably IME.

Maybe @Randy Holmes-Farley see confirm if my observation matches reality or not?

 

[Miami Reef]

Nice write up!!

Thank you!

 

[davidwillis]

What was your tank size?

Also, hydroxide has twice the pH boost of sodium carbonate (per unit of alk added). However, hydroxide mixed with vinegar does not have much of a pH rise in my experience. It seems to just eliminate the pH drop, but it doesn’t actually raise it appreciably IME.

Maybe @Randy Holmes-Farley see confirm if my observation matches reality or not?

Tank size is is 300 gallons.

 

[Miami Reef]

Tank size is is 300 gallons.

Using the soda ash recipe from Randy/BRS, you would need to decrease your 2 part by 64.3mL.

If you were to do this, make sure you also decrease the calcium addition by the same amount as the alkalinity.

I used this calculator to figure the dosage amount: https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/reef-calculator/alkalinity-calculator-reef

 

[Reefering1]

Using the soda ash recipe from Randy/BRS, you would need to decrease your 2 part by 64.3mL.

If you were to do this, make sure you also decrease the calcium addition by the same amount as the alkalinity.

I used this calculator to figure the dosage amount: https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/reef-calculator/alkalinity-calculator-reef

Ok, who are you? What do you do? Why are you being so helpful?

 

[davidwillis]

Using the soda ash recipe from Randy/BRS, you would need to decrease your 2 part by 64.3mL.

If you were to do this, make sure you also decrease the calcium addition by the same amount as the alkalinity.

I used this calculator to figure the dosage amount: https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/reef-calculator/alkalinity-calculator-reef

Thank you!

 

[Reefering1]

looking for more than that...

 

[Reefering1]

 

[davidwillis]

looking for more than that...

There are a lot of amazing people in this hobby that just like to help and make it better for everyone. Miami Reef is one of those, and there are a lot of others.

 

[Miami Reef]

Ok, who are you? What do you do? Why are you being so helpful?

I am a reefer who struggled with nitrate longer than I’d like to admit. I’m an over-thinker and a perfectionist, so I strived for the easiest and least risk way to lower nitrates for me.

The older carbon dosing chart sucked IMO. It took far too long and didn’t get high enough. The scaling was done poorly.

I like to help because when I was researching about my questions, my life was so much easier when I had knowledgeable people help me out.

Sometimes I fear to tell people this because of the backlash: I’m an ULN system nut. I love ultra low nutrient tanks. This was primarily the reason why I’ve researched so much about nitrate. In my bare bottom tank, I needed more help with carbon dosing to achieve my goals.

In the chart, I said don’t bottom nutrients out, and I still strive by that. I keep a lot of fish and feed my corals, so my issue likely won’t ever be due to nutrient starvation. I also keep a keen eye on my corals.

I still don’t recommend low nutrients for most reefers because there’s still a possibility of it failing if the person doesn’t feed enough etc.

 

[Miami Reef]

Ps, my chart most likely WON’T get you to ULN. I gave very reasonable dosing suggestions.

 

[davidwillis]

Sorry, another question on PH, I know you said that vodka will not effect ph instantly, but overall will have the same effect as vinegar. Since vinegar has an instant effect, how long does it last? For example I dose vinegar from 9:00am to 3:00pm. I see it instantly pull it down (even with a slow addition), then it starts going back up after 3:00pm. But how long will the effects last? Meaning at 9:00pm, my ph is up to 8.05, would it be 8.05 at 9:00pm if I did not dose any vinegar during the day?

 

[Reefering1]

I am a reefer who struggled with nitrate longer than I’d like to admit. I’m an over-thinker and a perfectionist, so I strived for the easiest and least risk way to lower nitrates for me.

The older carbon dosing chart sucked IMO. It took far too long and didn’t get high enough. The scaling was done poorly.

I like to help because when I was researching about my questions, my life was so much easier when I had knowledgeable people help me out.

Sometimes I fear to tell people this because of the backlash: I’m an ULN system nut. I love ultra low nutrient tanks. This was primarily the reason why I’ve researched so much about nitrate. In my bare bottom tank, I needed more help with carbon dosing to achieve my goals.

In the chart, I said don’t bottom nutrients out, and I still strive by that. I keep a lot of fish and feed my corals, so my issue likely won’t ever be due to nutrient starvation. I also keep a keen eye on my corals.

I still don’t recommend low nutrients for most reefers because there’s still a possibility of it failing if the person doesn’t feed enough etc.

Sounds familiar, which other methods did you try before carbon dosing? Still use any of them?

 

[Miami Reef]

Sorry, another question on PH, I know you said that vodka will not effect ph instantly, but overall will have the same effect as vinegar. Since vinegar has an instant effect, how long does it last? For example I dose vinegar from 9:00am to 3:00pm. I see it instantly pull it down (even with a slow addition), then it starts going back up after 3:00pm. But how long will the effects last? Meaning at 9:00pm, my ph is up to 8.05, would it be 8.05 at 9:00pm if I did not dose any vinegar during the day?

That’s a tricky question because there’s a lot of variables: CO2, alkalinity, aeration, and photosynthesis all play a role in pH in reef aquariums.

It’s very likely your pH would be a little higher if you didn’t dose any vinegar or vodka.

I personally don’t see much difference when carbon dosing with vodka. It’s so gradual that it gets lost between all the processes that drop and raise pH in tanks. You might see the drop when you just add the vinegar next to the pH probe, but it doesn’t drop it by that much once it mixed in with the rest of the aquarium water in my experience.

 

[Miami Reef]

Sounds familiar, which other methods did you try before carbon dosing? Still use any of them?

Water changes, skimming, filter socks, and carbon dosing. I recently added some seachem matrix (a month ago) to test out how effective it is for nitrates. I need more time to see if it works. I’ll know it works if I find I need to decrease my carbon dosing to maintain the same nitrate levels.

I never tried algae turf scrubbers, but it does look satisfying to harvest.