Half-Black Mimic Tang with brown/black spots

[SaltwaterScoop]

I noticed a week ago that my Half-Black Mimic Tang had some black/brown spots on it. They seemed to get better over the week. Fast forward to today, I did a 20% water change (my first decent water change in awhile), I noticed there were A LOT that popped up.

He is still eating normally but is flashing / weirdly swimming in place.

I don't see any spots on any other fish but my 2 leopard wrasses and goby seem to be flashing some though.

I have prazipro on hand (I had a mandarin that passed previously and thought he might've had flukes) but I've never dosed it. I'm scared to with my wrasses & cleaner shrimp.

Best Pictures I could get (he's fast):

looks like a weird line in this one????

Feeding Behavior:

 

[vetteguy53081]

I noticed a week ago that my Half-Black Mimic Tang had some black/brown spots on it. They seemed to get better over the week. Fast forward to today, I did a 20% water change (my first decent water change in awhile), I noticed there were A LOT that popped up.

He is still eating normally but is flashing / weirdly swimming in place.

I don't see any spots on any other fish but my 2 leopard wrasses and goby seem to be flashing some though.

I have prazipro on hand (I had a mandarin that passed previously and thought he might've had flukes) but I've never dosed it. I'm scared to with my wrasses & cleaner shrimp.

Best Pictures I could get (he's fast):

looks like a weird line in this one????

Feeding Behavior:

Use the prazi pro as the symptoms you describe suggest flukes but looks like blach ich (not the parasite ich) which are turbellarian worms and likely the Paravortex version which are smaller and appear as grains of black spots
These worms have a single host life cycle producing several juveniles which can last up to 30 days but rarely do. Best is to treat with Praziquantel better known as prazi pro. If flukes they treat the same- PraziPro. When applying praziPro, dose at 85% of recommended and apply initial dosage known as an interval for 8 days, do a water change and do one more 8 day dose interval
Use airstone with prazi as it does reduce both oxygen and appetite. If running a skimmer, leave cup off first 24 hrs as skimmer will go nuts from the glycol solution in Prazi

 

[SaltwaterScoop]

Use the prazi pro as the symptoms you describe suggest flukes but looks like blach ich (not the parasite ich) which are turbellarian worms and likely the Paravortex version which are smaller and appear as grains of black spots
These worms have a single host life cycle producing several juveniles which can last up to 30 days but rarely do. Best is to treat with Praziquantel better known as prazi pro. If flukes they treat the same- PraziPro. When applying praziPro, dose at 85% of recommended and apply initial dosage known as an interval for 8 days, do a water change and do one more 8 day dose interval
Use airstone with prazi as it does reduce both oxygen and appetite. If running a skimmer, leave cup off first 24 hrs as skimmer will go nuts from the glycol solution in Prazi

Thanks for the response!

Since my tank is a weird setup (2x 40 gallons and a Waterbox 180.5 plumbed into 1 sump) how does this sound?

Tank Net Volume Estimates:

	Gross Water Volume	Net Water Volume	85% PraziPro Dosage
Waterbox 180.5	135	108	22.5 ml (0.765 oz)
Left 40 Gallon	40	38	8 ml (.27 oz)
Right 40 Gallon	40	38	8 ml (.27 oz)
Sump	37	20	4 ml (0.14 oz)
Total	252	204	42.5 ml (1.445 oz)

Proposed Dosing Procedure:

1. Remove Carbon and Skimmer Cup
2. Add an air bubbler to each tank
3. Add 22.5 ml of PraziPro to Left 40 gallon
4. Add 8 ml of PraziPro to Right 40 gallon
5. Add 8 ml oz of PraziPro to Waterbox 180.5 gallon
6. Add 4 ml of PraziPro to Sump
7. Put skimmer cup back on after 24 hours
8. Wait 8 days
9. Do a 40 gallon water change
10. Repeat Steps 1-9
11. Add Carbon back

Should I do less than 85% to account for rock displacement?

 

[MnFish1]

Thanks for the response!

Since my tank is a weird setup (2x 40 gallons and a Waterbox 180.5 plumbed into 1 sump) how does this sound?

Tank Net Volume Estimates:

	Gross Water Volume	Net Water Volume	85% PraziPro Dosage
Waterbox 180.5	135	108	22.5 ml (0.765 oz)
Left 40 Gallon	40	38	8 ml (.27 oz)
Right 40 Gallon	40	38	8 ml (.27 oz)
Sump	37	20	4 ml (0.14 oz)
Total	252	204	42.5 ml (1.445 oz)

Proposed Dosing Procedure:

1. Remove Carbon and Skimmer Cup
2. Add an air bubbler to each tank
3. Add 22.5 ml of PraziPro to Left 40 gallon
4. Add 8 ml of PraziPro to Right 40 gallon
5. Add 8 ml oz of PraziPro to Waterbox 180.5 gallon
6. Add 4 ml of PraziPro to Sump
7. Put skimmer cup back on after 24 hours
8. Wait 8 days
9. Do a 40 gallon water change
10. Repeat Steps 1-9
11. Add Carbon back

Should I do less than 85% to account for rock displacement?

With this complexity, I would consider treating in a hospital tank. It's pretty hard to decide the dose to use - I'm assuming all the tanks are connected - which would mean add up the total volume, multiple by 0.85 and use that. I'm not sure why you're adding different amounts to different tanks - unless they are separated completely from eachother. Yes - remove the carbon and the skimmer cup. I would not divide things up dosage wise the way you are - unless they are separate tanks. PS - agree with Vetteguy - it looks like turbellarians.

 

[SaltwaterScoop]

With this complexity, I would consider treating in a hospital tank. It's pretty hard to decide the dose to use - I'm assuming all the tanks are connected - which would mean add up the total volume, multiple by 0.85 and use that. I'm not sure why you're adding different amounts to different tanks - unless they are separated completely from eachother. Yes - remove the carbon and the skimmer cup. I would not divide things up dosage wise the way you are - unless they are separate tanks. PS - agree with Vetteguy - it looks like turbellarians.

They are all plumbed together. I only accounted for internal dimensions & fill height for the net volume calculation and not the rock. Is the idea behind the 85% dosage to account for things like that?

Should I just do the full dose in the sump then? I was worried about the 40s getting too much.

 

[MnFish1]

They are all plumbed together. I only accounted for internal dimensions & fill height for the net volume calculation and not the rock. Is the idea behind the 85% dosage to account for things like that?

Should I just do the full dose in the sump then? I was worried about the 40s getting too much.

Yes - assuming the flow between all of the tanks are connected, you could do it one of 2 ways - either dump the whole amount slowly into 1 tank - or divide into the 2 tanks. (slowly to me means 6 hours or so to me)

 

[SaltwaterScoop]

Yes - assuming the flow between all of the tanks are connected, you could do it one of 2 ways - either dump the whole amount slowly into 1 tank - or divide into the 2 tanks. (slowly to me means 6 hours or so to me)

so it's ok to slowly dose into the sump over 6 hours?

 

[vetteguy53081]

Thanks for the response!

Since my tank is a weird setup (2x 40 gallons and a Waterbox 180.5 plumbed into 1 sump) how does this sound?

Tank Net Volume Estimates:

	Gross Water Volume	Net Water Volume	85% PraziPro Dosage
Waterbox 180.5	135	108	22.5 ml (0.765 oz)
Left 40 Gallon	40	38	8 ml (.27 oz)
Right 40 Gallon	40	38	8 ml (.27 oz)
Sump	37	20	4 ml (0.14 oz)
Total	252	204	42.5 ml (1.445 oz)

Proposed Dosing Procedure:

1. Remove Carbon and Skimmer Cup
2. Add an air bubbler to each tank
3. Add 22.5 ml of PraziPro to Left 40 gallon
4. Add 8 ml of PraziPro to Right 40 gallon
5. Add 8 ml oz of PraziPro to Waterbox 180.5 gallon
6. Add 4 ml of PraziPro to Sump
7. Put skimmer cup back on after 24 hours
8. Wait 8 days
9. Do a 40 gallon water change
10. Repeat Steps 1-9
11. Add Carbon back

Should I do less than 85% to account for rock displacement?

Youre very close. You can treat in tank however separate tank is best with added air stone as mentioned. You dont want to risk any worms running through your system

 

[SaltwaterScoop]

Youre very close. You can treat in tank however separate tank is best with added air stone as mentioned. You dont want to risk any worms running through your system

What should I change other than dosing it all in the sump instead of the separate tanks.

 

[vetteguy53081]

What should I change other than dosing it all in the sump instead of the separate tanks.

A separate quarantine/treatment tank. A rubbermaid tub is also acceptable in lieu of tank but as with any disease or condition, you dont want it to spread

 

[SaltwaterScoop]

A separate quarantine/treatment tank. A rubbermaid tub is also acceptable in lieu of tank but as with any disease or condition, you dont want it to spread

right...I bet it's in all 3 systems at this point that's why I am leaning towards treating the whole system

 

[MnFish1]

With this complexity, I would consider treating in a hospital tank. It's pretty hard to decide the dose to use - I'm assuming all the tanks are connected - which would mean add up the total volume, multiple by 0.85 and use that. I'm not sure why you're adding different amounts to different tanks - unless they are separated completely from eachother. Yes - remove the carbon and the skimmer cup. I would not divide things up dosage wise the way you are - unless they are separate tanks. PS - agree with Vetteguy - it looks like turbellarians.

btw - I meant 85% - of total volume (and you already made the calculation in your table) - so just saying I didn't mean 85% of that

 

[SaltwaterScoop]

Are there any major concerns if I overdose? I'm not sure what to look out for.

 

[MnFish1]

Are there any major concerns if I overdose? I'm not sure what to look out for.

Well - it probably differs from fish to fish - so I don't know - as vetteguy already said - the best idea is a hospital tank - where you know the volume (exact) - however with your setup - I can see where this could be an issue. Oxygenation is paramount with prazipro - if you can add a couple airstones that would be great. I mean - if you're concerned - do the dosing over 12 hours - dose by dose, watching for any abnormal behavior/symptoms. Unfortunately, I can't list all of the potential symptoms - so I would watch for ANY new symptoms. (new)

 

[vetteguy53081]

Are there any major concerns if I overdose? I'm not sure what to look out for.

Remember, I mentioned Prazi can reduce oxygen and appetite. Avoid overdosing at all costs why I mentioned, dose at 85% of recommended

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I noticed a week ago that my Half-Black Mimic Tang had some black/brown spots on it. They seemed to get better over the week. Fast forward to today, I did a 20% water change (my first decent water change in awhile), I noticed there were A LOT that popped up.

He is still eating normally but is flashing / weirdly swimming in place.

I don't see any spots on any other fish but my 2 leopard wrasses and goby seem to be flashing some though.

I have prazipro on hand (I had a mandarin that passed previously and thought he might've had flukes) but I've never dosed it. I'm scared to with my wrasses & cleaner shrimp.

Best Pictures I could get (he's fast):

looks like a weird line in this one????

Feeding Behavior:

I agree, this is a turbellarian infection. I do want to add though, because these worms form thick cysts on the fish’s skin, prazi has difficulty reaching them, so it often doesn’t work. You’ll need to dose 2 or 3 times, 8 days apart. Be sure to aerate the water well.

Turbellarians sometimes go away on their own, nobody knows why.

 

[SaltwaterScoop]

I agree, this is a turbellarian infection. I do want to add though, because these worms form thick cysts on the fish’s skin, prazi has difficulty reaching them, so it often doesn’t work. You’ll need to dose 2 or 3 times, 8 days apart. Be sure to aerate the water well.

Turbellarians sometimes go away on their own, nobody knows why.

Thanks for the info! That's interesting.

The mimic tang definitely looks better today (color is back and behaving normally), but I still see some spots. Water changes must make the worms move and irritate the fish. Have you ever heard of a green mandarin having a turbellarian infection? I'm thinking that's how I lost mine a few weeks back.

I plan to run my skimmer without a cup and add an air bubbler on each tank in the system. How long should I leave the air bubblers going (thinking 72 hours)?

I also plan to do 2 doses 8 days apart and go from there.

 

[SaltwaterScoop]

How does this look for my air bubbler setup? I have them mounted under the left and right MP40 and on full blast so there are a lot of micro bubbles in the tank (not sure if this is bad for the fish or not). I mounted the 40 gallon air bubblers under the MP10s.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Thanks for the info! That's interesting.

The mimic tang definitely looks better today (color is back and behaving normally), but I still see some spots. Water changes must make the worms move and irritate the fish. Have you ever heard of a green mandarin having a turbellarian infection? I'm thinking that's how I lost mine a few weeks back.

I plan to run my skimmer without a cup and add an air bubbler on each tank in the system. How long should I leave the air bubblers going (thinking 72 hours)?

I also plan to do 2 doses 8 days apart and go from there.

I’ve never seen a mandarin with turbellarians, but maybe? Digenean trematodes are often confused with turbellarians, and some black spots (especially on freshwater fish) are these.

Yes - leave the skimmer running, but don’t collect the skimmate. Are you using Prazipro? If so, run the airstone the entire treatment time, as it is bacterial breakdown of the solvent in that product which reduces the oxygen.

 

[SaltwaterScoop]

...removed carbon + skimmer head & have the airstones going. I just dosed 44 ml...now we wait

Immediate Observable Reactions

• Fish are behaving normally just annoyed by the bubbles
• Feather duster closed up (this is the only thing I'm expecting to lose)
• LPS are closed up/pooping but it might be a result of increased flow + bubbles