Current Quarantine Protocol

[Jay Hemdal]

Thanks for this great guide. I would follow the months long process if I were adding to a large and established display. In the past, I did no quarantine at all, because I was not yet well educated on the benefits.

I'm starting up a 10 gallon nano and will be doing only 1 - 3 small fish, and adding to a new tank, so following the shorter BRS style 80/20 is going to make more sense for me I think, rather than a very long quarantine. The only issue is that furan-2 is no longer a thing. Is Seachem polyguard an acceptable substitute, or is it better to use pure nitrofurazone?

Quarantine processes are always a balance of efficacy and effort. The BRS process is faster/easier, but not as comprehensive. No quarantine at all is of course the easiest thing to do, that's why so many people skip it. I have a different quarantine process in place at work that takes up to six months - because the system I am moving new fish into has tens of thousands of dollars of fish in it and I must lower the risk even more than the process we use here.

That said, unless the fish are showing signs of acute bacterial infection, you should not use antibiotics as part of any quarantine process. Close to 100% of external bacterial infections in fish are caused by bacteria that is normally present in aquariums. There is also the risk of developing resistance to antibiotics.

Jay

 

[AquaLogic]

Quarantine processes are always a balance of efficacy and effort. The BRS process is faster/easier, but not as comprehensive. No quarantine at all is of course the easiest thing to do, that's why so many people skip it. I have a different quarantine process in place at work that takes up to six months - because the system I am moving new fish into has tens of thousands of dollars of fish in it and I must lower the risk even more than the process we use here.

That said, unless the fish are showing signs of acute bacterial infection, you should not use antibiotics as part of any quarantine process. Close to 100% of external bacterial infections in fish are caused by bacteria that is normally present in aquariums. There is also the risk of developing resistance to antibiotics.

Jay

Great! Thanks for your input!

 

[ReeferDMD]

Is there a quarantine guide like this for FW? It’s so hard to separate facts from people selling stuff and curious what experts like @Jay Hemdal do in their personal tanks. Thanks!

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Is there a quarantine guide like this for FW? It’s so hard to separate facts from people selling stuff and curious what experts like @Jay Hemdal do in their personal tanks. Thanks!

I haven't written a FW guide up here, since this is mostly a marine site. The process would work for FW as well (coppersafe and prazi both can be used in FW) but for my own FW fish, I modify things to include another anti-protozoan drug, often formalin/malachite green. I also use sea salt if the FW fish are tolerant of that (usually dose that at 2 to 4 ppt).

Jay

 

[cjtabares]

My dt is currently cycling, near the end of the cycle, would I be able to put some sponge pads it the dt to then cycle my qt or should I get the qt going with a bottled bacteria? I was planning on using BRS 80/20 method, but this method seems less wasteful, and from what I am reading better, so might be behind in setting up the qt.

 

[mfinn]

My dt is currently cycling, near the end of the cycle, would I be able to put some sponge pads it the dt to then cycle my qt or should I get the qt going with a bottled bacteria? I was planning on using BRS 80/20 method, but this method seems less wasteful, and from what I am reading better, so might be behind in setting up the qt.

Pretty much anything that will grow bacteria will work. It does have to be size appropriate. Not exactly sure what that would be, but I'm pretty sure it can't be just a small piece of sponge.
I keep a 6" diameter air powered sponge filter in my display tank sump to use as a bio-filter for my quarantine tank.
I keep it running all the time so it's ready to go when I need it.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

My dt is currently cycling, near the end of the cycle, would I be able to put some sponge pads it the dt to then cycle my qt or should I get the qt going with a bottled bacteria? I was planning on using BRS 80/20 method, but this method seems less wasteful, and from what I am reading better, so might be behind in setting up the qt.

Sponges/filter media (non-calcium based) in your DT can then be transported to your QT to start the cycle, but it takes more time than people often think, perhaps 2 months. Also, just setting the sponge in the DT doesn't help, you need to actively move water through the sponge to preferentially grow bacteria there. I like to use air driven sponge filters (perhaps in the sump) to do that.

 

[AquaLogic]

My dt is currently cycling, near the end of the cycle, would I be able to put some sponge pads it the dt to then cycle my qt or should I get the qt going with a bottled bacteria? I was planning on using BRS 80/20 method, but this method seems less wasteful, and from what I am reading better, so might be behind in setting up the qt.

Grab something like Marinpure for your QT and start a cycle. It's cheap, and much more surface area than a bit of sponge.

 

[cjtabares]

Pretty much anything that will grow bacteria will work. It does have to be size appropriate. Not exactly sure what that would be, but I'm pretty sure it can't be just a small piece of sponge.
I keep a 6" diameter air powered sponge filter in my display tank sump to use as a bio-filter for my quarantine tank.
I keep it running all the time so it's ready to go when I need it.

Sponges/filter media (non-calcium based) in your DT can then be transported to your QT to start the cycle, but it takes more time than people often think, perhaps 2 months. Also, just setting the sponge in the DT doesn't help, you need to actively move water through the sponge to preferentially grow bacteria there. I like to use air driven sponge filters (perhaps in the sump) to do that.

Do I keep the qt running all the time, or should I break it down after every fish and clean it? I plan on adding coral after I add fish, would using the same tank for qt be an issue?

Would you suggest 1 fish at a time, or could I do multiple?

My qt is a 10 gallon and my dt is only 45gal. Nothing crazy going in, all, what I would consider small.

Sorry if any of these have been answered, have not been able to read all the pages in the thread.

 

[MnFish1]

Jay, this is great. Thanks!

Since many of us order fish online, they often come to us with a salinity much lower than our reef tanks (22 ppt. vs 35 for example). I have been matching the QT salinity to that of the new arrivals then slowly adjusting up. Is that necessary?

It is necessary. But I think each fish is different - I would suggest following the acclimation procedures in the instructions you receive. It's impossible to analyze every company. And yes @Jay Hemdal awesome summary

 

[MnFish1]

I have checked copper daily with Hanna checker and copper has never drooped below 2.3. So I would assume that I am ok with continuing the treatment for the 30 days. I will definitely not put the rock back into a display but in the emergency I wanted the rock to control ammonia and its only a couple of small pieces. Right now I'm on Day 21 so I don't want to start over if I don't have to. Fish are looking great and eating good.

would keep checking your copper levels - don't stop now

 

[AquaLogic]

Would ceramic media like marinepure be a good choice for bio filter?

 

[mfinn]

Do I keep the qt running all the time, or should I break it down after every fish and clean it? I plan on adding coral after I add fish, would using the same tank for qt be an issue?

Would you suggest 1 fish at a time, or could I do multiple?

My qt is a 10 gallon and my dt is only 45gal. Nothing crazy going in, all, what I would consider small.

Sorry if any of these have been answered, have not been able to read all the pages in the thread.

Because I keep a sponge filter going all of the time I take my quarantine tank down when not in use.
All I have to do is mix up a batch of new water and add the air powered sponge filter, heater, powerhead, and cover in the tank and it's set up.
For me, I see no reason to keep it going once I'm at a stable level of critters I want to add.
But can be ready in a moments notice for anything suddenly arriving.

 

[Lgara1303]

Thank you Jay for a nice write-up.

I heard there is fluke resistant to prazipro. So I also do hyposalinity just in case. In addition I add the following

FORMALIN dip (Brooklynella, Uronema, Tricodina).

METRONIDAZOL (Intestinal and other Protozoa).

ERYTHROMYCIN (Bacterial)

DO you dose these all together and at what point do you start

 

[Jay Hemdal]

DO you dose these all together and at what point do you start

You should avoid dosing multiple drugs at the same time unless the issue is very severe. For example - formalin can react with amine based copper. Prazipro can reduce the oxygen level and do does formalin - so you can’t run those concurrently.

 

[PotatoPig]

Water change after Prazi?

Jay, thank you for this and all the work you do on the forum for fish care

I know this is answered earlier but searching through the lengthy thread I’m not finding it’s. I’m about 3 days past Prazi treatment 2 and want to do a water change to remove some detritus and clean the tank a bit after what seems to have been a bacterial bloom with the last dose.

It’s my understanding is the Prazi works for about a day or so before it’s metabolized from the system, hence the three doses some days apart. Based on this I’m assuming no ill effects if I do a 50% water change 3 days after a treatment, is that correct?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Water change after Prazi?

Jay, thank you for this and all the work you do on the forum for fish care

I know this is answered earlier but searching through the lengthy thread I’m not finding it’s. I’m about 3 days past Prazi treatment 2 and want to do a water change to remove some detritus and clean the tank a bit after what seems to have been a bacterial bloom with the last dose.

It’s my understanding is the Prazi works for about a day or so before it’s metabolized from the system, hence the three doses some days apart. Based on this I’m assuming no ill effects if I do a 50% water change 3 days after a treatment, is that correct?

Correct, praziquantel is pretty much digested by bacteria after 72 hours. This time becomes even shorter after multiple treatments, where the specific bacteria grows in population.

Prazipro uses a solvent (a glycol that is 95% of the dose) that adds organics to a system, and those need proportionally larger water changes to remove. This is mostly an issue with reef aquariums where nutrient control is more of an issue.

 

[DartTanks]

Really appreciate the time for both the write up and to answer questions, Jay!

I've been trying to understand the water regiment under "normal" circumstances... ideally, you would:

1. Start with new saltwater
2. Add cycled media / complete cycle
3. Maintain water levels with normal fresh top off from evaporation
4. Add fish following your method

I'm trying to understand two things:

1. When/how often are you performing "normal" water changes during the entire QT process, if at all?
2. What exactly does it look like to perform the water changes to remove copper, as mentioned in the process? 1/4 change at a time? 100% change? Sorry if this is obvious, but a bit of a beginner.

• Begin copper removal through water changes.
• Binding agents Cuprisorb may be used to hasten the removal process.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Really appreciate the time for both the write up and to answer questions, Jay!

I've been trying to understand the water regiment under "normal" circumstances... ideally, you would:

1. Start with new saltwater
2. Add cycled media / complete cycle
3. Maintain water levels with normal fresh top off from evaporation
4. Add fish following your method

I'm trying to understand two things:

1. When/how often are you performing "normal" water changes during the entire QT process, if at all?
2. What exactly does it look like to perform the water changes to remove copper, as mentioned in the process? 1/4 change at a time? 100% change? Sorry if this is obvious, but a bit of a beginner.

• Begin copper removal through water changes.
• Binding agents Cuprisorb may be used to hasten the removal process.

You can actually set up your QT using water from your display, as well as move some bio media over to "jump start" the cycle. Then, you can add freshly made saltwater back to your display - in essence giving that tank a water change when you set up the QT. Remember, you don't need a sterile QT, the fish in it are going into the display at a later date anyway.

You don't need to do routine water changes during a normal QT cycle, unless there is a critical ammonia or low pH issue. As long as those parameters are in range, you can avoid water changes. Some people change 25% of the water after each praziquantel treatment. Also, a 50% water change after the 30 day copper treatment is the best/easiest way to lower that.

 

[DartTanks]

Awesome, thanks for the info, this helps clear up my water change questions.