Wood stand possible for 300g... no center brace?

[whitelightning77]

Like the title states, it's it possible? I might be getting a 84x36x24 low iron tank this weekend. Wondering if a wood stand with no center brace is possible?

 

[ryanjohn1]

That’s a lot of weight

 

[whitelightning77]

I have my 200 gal on a stand I made following rocketengineers templates. Ita been standing strong for almost 10 yrs now.

 

[Crustaceon]

It's more than capable.

 

[Soren]

Like the title states, it's it possible? I might be getting a 84x36x24 low iron train this weekend. Wondering if a wood stand with no center brace is possible?

It's possible, but probably not worth it, in my opinion. Though I would not claim to be an expert, I am an engineer by profession and do work related to structures.
If you used something like 1X12's for the long span (84"), maybe there would not be enough warp to allow tank damage, but it seems a significant risk to me. If interested, I might be able to do some calculations to test this.

Is the tank rimless or rimmed? Euro-braced or other bracing?
What are the primary reasons you want to have no center braces?

 

[whitelightning77]

It's possible, but probably not worth it, in my opinion. Though I would not claim to be an expert, I am an engineer by profession and do work related to structures.
If you used something like 1X12's for the long span (84"), maybe there would not be enough warp to allow tank damage, but it seems a significant risk to me. If interested, I might be able to do some calculations to test this.

Is the tank rimless or rimmed? Euro-braced or other bracing?
What are the primary reasons you want to have no center braces?

The look, but mainly because I have an 80 gal sump which is 48x24. So I want to make sure I can remove it if need be. It's a rimmed tank.

 

[Soren]

The look, but mainly because I have an 80 gal sump which is 48x24. So I want to make sure I can remove it if need be. It's a rimmed tank.

48" sump would still fit with a "center" brace that is offset from center of the 84" span.
The issue with wood is not necessarily strength, but more about warp/deflection in the center.
Having a rim helps, since the primary support comes from either end of the tank rim, but some center support is needed for security on an 84" tank.

Offhand, I would recommend using 2x6's for most of the frame except for 2x8's or 2x10's for the 84" span and use a "center" support set for 50"-54" clearance for adding/removing the sump.
This design would be better than no center brace, as it would still provide significant deflection prevention at the center:

P.S. I would certainly recommend a center brace (probably truly centered) on the back span.

 

[whitelightning77]

48" sump would still fit with a "center" brace that is offset from center of the 84" span.
The issue with wood is not necessarily strength, but more about warp/deflection in the center.
Having a rim helps, since the primary support comes from either end of the tank rim, but some center support is needed for security on an 84" tank.

Offhand, I would recommend using 2x6's for most of the frame except for 2x8's or 2x10's for the 84" span and use a "center" support set for 50"-54" clearance for adding/removing the sump.
This design would be better than no center brace, as it would still provide significant deflection prevention at the center:

P.S. I would certainly recommend a center brace (probably truly centered) on the back span.

Thanks, that helps. Definitely planning on using 2x8s as the top span.

 

[Soren]

Thanks, that helps. Definitely planning on using 2x8s as the top span.

Also, @RocketEngineer is still active here on R2R and could offer much better insight from direct experience.

 

[Indymann99]

I would use a plywood gluelam vs typical lumber. Dimensionally more square and much stronger.

 

[RocketEngineer]

Also, @RocketEngineer is still active here on R2R and could offer much better insight from direct experience.

Yup, still around.

You don’t need anything above 2X4 except for the main span so stop recommending it please. An “L” pair of 2X4s could hold up a car all by themselves, let alone having one pair at each corner.

@whitelightning77 I’m thinking you could do it with a 2X10 top but I don’t have my calculations handy.

 

[whitelightning77]

What if I use some of these for the top span?

 

[PotatoPig]

What if I use some of these for the top span?

Realistically if there’s no center brace the glass is going to need to span no matter what beam you use because glass is so much stiffer than the wood.

Even if you use a 2x12 engineered lumber product the glass panel is somewhere between 8-10x as stiff vertically than the wood - so around 85-90% of the load will be carried by the glass regardless.

To even get to a 50:50 split between the glass and the wood you’ll need something like a 3” wide x 20” deep beam!

Check with the vendor, but if this is a framed tank it’s probably designed to span from one end to the other, even if such an arrangement looks very precarious…

 

[whitelightning77]

Realistically if there’s no center brace the glass is going to need to span no matter what beam you use because glass is so much stiffer than the wood.

Even if you use a 2x12 engineered lumber product the glass panel is somewhere between 8-10x as stiff vertically than the wood - so around 85-90% of the load will be carried by the glass regardless.

To even get to a 50:50 split between the glass and the wood you’ll need something like a 3” wide x 20” deep beam!

Check with the vendor, but if this is a framed tank it’s probably designed to span from one end to the other, even if such an arrangement looks very precarious…

Its def framed, with a metal top and bottom frame. 3/4" low iron glass, and its made by AGE.

 

[jsker]

It's possible, but probably not worth it, in my opinion. Though I would not claim to be an expert, I am an engineer by profession and do work related to structures.
If you used something like 1X12's for the long span (84"), maybe there would not be enough warp to allow tank damage, but it seems a significant risk to me. If interested, I might be able to do some calculations to test this.

Is the tank rimless or rimmed? Euro-braced or other bracing?
What are the primary reasons you want to have no center braces?

48" sump would still fit with a "center" brace that is offset from center of the 84" span.
The issue with wood is not necessarily strength, but more about warp/deflection in the center.
Having a rim helps, since the primary support comes from either end of the tank rim, but some center support is needed for security on an 84" tank.

Offhand, I would recommend using 2x6's for most of the frame except for 2x8's or 2x10's for the 84" span and use a "center" support set for 50"-54" clearance for adding/removing the sump.
This design would be better than no center brace, as it would still provide significant deflection prevention at the center:

P.S. I would certainly recommend a center brace (probably truly centered) on the back span.

@sron has given a very good answer. This would be the direction I would also suggest.

What if I use some of these for the top span?

Strand board would be another good option, with the length of the tank. I would suggest to still brace the middle or off set the center brace like @scron has drawn out.

 

[whitelightning77]

Here are a couple screen shots of the stand I made for my current tank. I had to find these on reefcentral of all places.

 

[whitelightning77]

Any objections to this layout?

2x4 on the bottom perimeter
2x6 as the corner and center brace uprights (with 2x4s as the backing of those uprights)
2x8 for the top spans.

"Center" or better said off center brace in the front is an opening of 48" on the larger opening.

Will place plywood on top and and the bottom of the inside.

 

[whitelightning77]

@RocketEngineer thoughts?

 

[Troylee]

Any objections to this layout?

2x4 on the bottom perimeter
2x6 as the corner and center brace uprights (with 2x4s as the backing of those uprights)
2x8 for the top spans.

"Center" or better said off center brace in the front is an opening of 48" on the larger opening.

Will place plywood on top and and the bottom of the inside.

Way overkill so it should fine lol.. I’d put a couple spanners across the top to support the plywood and call it day.. I have a 260 gal sitting on a plywood stand with just a single 2x4 in the corners and center and it’s super stout! I’ll try and get some pictures later today.

 

[whitelightning77]

Way overkill so it should fine lol.. I’d put a couple spanners across the top to support the plywood and call it day.. I have a 260 gal sitting on a plywood stand with just a single 2x4 in the corners and center and it’s super stout! I’ll try and get some pictures later today.

Yea I will get some 2x8 spans in the middle similar to how I did my previous stand.