The Proven Best Lighting Solution for your Aquarium

[A. grandis]

There is just so much wrong here. The main reason the average hobbyist goes with LEDs is because they last longer, use less energy, are far more adjustable (w/o having to buy new bulbs), they produce far less heat, come in a variety of form factors (pucks, strips, built into hoods, submersibles, etc), and are usable in more applications. Then there’s also the fact that halides just aren’t a good option for nanos. It’s not some conspiracy that LED manufactures have lied and manipulated to gain market share and put halide manufacturers out of business, they’ve simply marketed their products the same way that halide manufacturers have marketed theirs, and consumers decided that LEDs were the better option. Halides are likely better at growing corals, but positing the idea that LEDs are bad at growing corals or are unhealthy for corals is 100% nonsense. Halides were never the #1 lighting option in hobby. They probably were for hardcore reefers, but for the average hobbyist, and the total sales overall, power compacts, then T5s, and now LEDs always outsold them.

And there’s a reason for that, up until the time that LEDs started becoming a thing in the hobby (around 2007), there were no plug and play halide aquarium fixtures, you had to DIY the reflectors and ballasts into your setup, it wasn’t until LEDs were already gaining a foothold that self contained halide fixtures that had active cooling and that didn’t look like a construction site, that looked like any other aquarium light fixture, came out on the market. But even then you had to order them, no LFS I knew of sold them or carried them in all the common sizes. I remember having to order a 24” fixture and cutting off and then DIYing the legs back on it so it would fit my 20” tank (they didn’t make them that small). My point is that halides have never been an elegant or attractive lighting solution (not talking about the actual light), and I think you under estimate how much that matters.

I’ve been in the hobby for over 20 years, I’ve used regular fluorescent bulbs, VHOs, Power Compacts, Halides, T5s, and LEDs, and out of all of those I would choose LEDs every time (I would probably do halides and LEDs if I was planning some massive 300+ gallon build, but I’m not, and am unlikely to). The convenience, longevity, lack of heat, and adjustability of LEDs just completely outweigh any slight increase in growth I might get from halides.

You should know better, then.
Go listen to Tullio's videos..
Everyone that want to justify their LED purchases and excuses ignore Tullio's videos.

 

[A. grandis]

It's sad really. This thread is the perfect example of why the big names won't come to the forums any longer. Let alone will they ever share their own opinions on the matter.
This goes for both sides of this coin.

I've had personal conversations with some of the biggest names in the game and every single one of them told me the same thing: they'd run halides again in a heartbeat if the market showed people wanted them back. Multiple even said they plan to setup and run halides again in some way. We'll see if any of that comes to fruition.

For years, I helped run the largest lighting thread to ever exist over on RC with Grim. I no longer engage in these conversations though and rarely answer lighting questions. It's not worth it. Each side is set in their ways and the one who spent the most usually has the most to justify.

The personal attacks are pretty ridiculous in here. Not sure I'm all that surprised though. I did have to hit the "show ignored content" to see them

In the end, each of us should go enjoy our tank (s) while we can. Doesn't matter if you like looking at a yellow mess of brown or a Windex filled rave party where the lights are barely bright enough to see. Just go enjoy what you have and let others do the same.

Grim was the best!!!!

I'm getting tired of all this!
I really think this hobby will end up any time soon...
It is destroying itself by the minute and regressing with futility, sponsorships, youtube channels, propaganda and such!
I think I have tried too hard to tell people what results should look like, but I'm stating to realize that it is far gone and out of hands. People do not care about the real stuff! Tired of arguing here! Over and over posting the same stuff because of the new guys that come in not knowing anything and asking me to prove this and that... tired!
Something like Jake trying to fight the "name game". I bet he feels stupid some times too!
I have to admit that I feel myself being ridiculous arguing with this crowd!

Yes, maybe you're right... go enjoy your tanks! Whatever!!!!

 

[A. grandis]

400w Ushio 10,000k bulbs and 8 X URI 24" VHO 75w actinic bulbs and 2 X URI VHO 72" actinic bulbs:


3 X 400w metal halides and 2 X 100w Ecoxotic Cannon LEDs



2 X 250W MH and 4 X Giesemann super actinic T5s:


Those were good times!
We had a long day.
Have a good night!

 

[GHOSTLY]

I saw a LFS run on their 30 gallon 1 radion, 1 kessil 160 tuna blue, and A T5 coral plus I think

 

[Jposch]

Depends on the bulb and the Led.
20000k radium..
NOTE not sure why this spectrum is as it is.. Most are nowhere near as "fancy". See below.

and how you use it..
G5 pro..100%

I suppose "someone" will try to say the LED spectrum is faked.
Really I wouldn't say the above but you know it's true.
Just saving time.

ALL published spectra have some smoothing applied.
LED's are not as narrow a spectrum (well depends on the led again) as people ASSUME.
Just more FUD spreading.

You use "whiter" MH's than most would use so the above doesn't quite apply.

Would love to see your bulb spectrums..It's my "thing".

Even better..

Peninsula Tank Build – Lighting - ReefBum

I have never used LED’s over any of my SPS reef tanks but that is going to change with this tank. My plan is to use the GHL Mitras.

reefbum.com

One last NOTE of obviousness... as you dim channels you lose photons.
I know obvious but you'd be surprised..

Exactly. All of the published data is apples to oranges. I agree, 20k's are not really a good candidate for comparison to a well engineered led fixture that is being tested at 100% across all channels. Trouble is, (as you brought up) most run all channels low besides the blue. First hand experience has been with 15 halides, and growth obviously increased compared to the several tanks I've had in the past that ran leds, as well as the tank I only changed from leda to halides, but otherwise it was the same system, parameters, etc. 20ks put out far less par than a 14k, or especially a 6500k. Efficiency isn't always true. One example, winter I a cold climate (where I live) halides did nothing to my electric bill, because all of the "wasted heat" it used to heat the house and tank for half of the year. Average lumen per watt (sure, it's not not par, blah, blah) on halides is 80-100lumens per watt. Leds typically claim 100 lumens per watt.
Also, bulbs do not just explode...if they get wet, yeah. But, run reflectors with glass shields. Don't touch the bulbs with dirty hands, and replace them Avery 12-18 months. I pay $12/ bulb. So, $150 for the fixture used, $24/bulb per year, and is 67 years, I'll finally have spent on annual bulbs what a pair of g5's would have costed me. I run my lights in an unvented canopy, the hot air pocket above the tank is more humid than room air, and evap has actually been less than ever.
Not sure how halides are a significant fire hazard compared to just having saltwater near an electrical outlet.
Like everything, there is no cut and dry answer. It all depends on the situation. My frag tank was halides, but they were kept my basement too hot, so back to leds for the summer. I may swap back in the fall, but probably not because acclimation coral to different lights 2x a year won't be a fun time

 

[Jposch]

And, the add to that, g5 pro's run 200w each compared to a pair of 150 hqi bulbs. So, set the leds to 75% on all channels, and the power consumption is the same. Nor sure if people know this, but leds shift spectrum when dimmed. So, running leds low is not ideal, but I think leds are all pwm dimming, So that point is moot. I'll defend halides as a viable option all day. I won't just broadly say they are insanely better than leds. Halides vs. A $60 Black box..all dang day.

 

[Ryan Avery]

It is destroying itself by the minute and regressing with futility, sponsorships, youtube channels, propaganda and such!

How are you tube channels destroying the hobbie? There are great educational channels out there like melevs, reef builders, reef bum, etc. Also, there is nothing wrong with sponsorships, its just business. They forum your using now has tons of them.

 

[oreo54]

I think I have tried too hard to tell people what results should look like

Yes, maybe you're right... go enjoy your tanks! Whatever!!!!

There is the issue right there.

Change should to could.. leave it at that.

 

[mitten_reef]

this thread is a joke, right? half of it is one guy ranting cuz he can't cope with 21st century technology.....we should all go back to Ford model T - it gets us from point A to point B

If he loves MH so much (I've seen plenty of his MH-love posts, and I'm not disputing the success it can provide/provided to certain tanks), I wish he'd be willing to show off his own tank with a build thread... not old pictures or someone else's success

 

[Ryan Avery]

Lets bring back led based paint and asbestos insulation while were at it haha

 

[Waynerock]

Not that my tank is perfect by any means. I work hard to make it what it is. I have 3 under rated light fixtures ( prime 16’s) and I can not grasp how much better Halide would make my tank look. I find fault in your proclamation that they are the best. In 2002 I had Halide and PC’s and my tank NEVER looked this good. But beauty is the eye of the beholder. To each his own but I don’t try to rub anyone’s face in it. Like the song says LET IT GO! You do you and I’ll do me

 

[Jposch]

The comments about Model T's and asbestos, and "led" (spelled LEAD) based paint are completely irrelevant, and as usual, the thread is way off from what it started as. Halides are an options. It's just not cut and dry. Just like comparing a radion vs any other brand LED. Put your and away, and have a civilized discussion with less opinion. You should always be skeptical of any claims or marketing. But, not an aggogant prick. I do run diy led strips a couple of hours morning and night. I used tonrun them with the halides, but I've seen a good response in coral only running them alone before and after the halide photo period. Leds will make the fluorescent colors stand out more than any halide can try to do. No question. For me, brown and pink coral looks like doo-doo under blue leds, so only a few of the corals in my tank actually look good in the evenings. Tou don't see ppl crucify Paul B. For his reverse UGF, or running ozone. BTW, I also run "antique" ozone. 2nd best thing I've done besides halides (IME.) The ozone thing is hard to explain, and again, not always applicable to many tanks.

 

[Ryan Avery]

Not that my tank is perfect by any means. I work hard to make it what it is. I have 3 under rated light fixtures ( prime 16’s) and I can not grasp how much better Halide would make my tank look. I find fault in your proclamation that they are the best. In 2002 I had Halide and PC’s and my tank NEVER looked this good. But beauty is the eye of the beholder. To each his own but I don’t try to rub anyone’s face in it. Like the song says LET IT GO! You do you and I’ll do me

Thats a beautiful tank. Good job!

 

[revhtree]

These types of threads only degrade into name calling, endless reported posts and hard feelings. When it gets to that point it is no longer healthy for the community and we're not going to watch it and edit all day long. Thanks and closing this one.