Tank cycled but after 25% water change I got readings of Ammonia and Nitrites

[fideladio]

Hello there,

Im new in the hobby, I just started my reef tank, 20 gallons, I started my cycling period about 25 days ago using Brightwell Micro Bacter Dry Rock Starter Kit, I made the cycle, brought down Ammonia and Nitrite to zero and my Nitrates where reading at 80PPM, the instructions on the Brightwell Kit notes that after Im cycled that I have to do a 25% water change, which I did, however, after I finished the water change I measured all my parameters and I got some reading on Ammonia and Nitrite, Its my understanding that it's not suppose to happen. Can someone shed some light on this?

PS. My Nitrites after the water change lowered to 40PPM

 

[KTrevino]

what type of test kit?

 

[Auquanut]

A water change alone should not cause a spike in ammonia or nitrite. Are you using RO/DI water to mix your SW, or are you getting your water from a different source?

 

[Idoc]

25 days with a bacterial starter kit... miter than likely cycled.

Don't worry about nitrites... no issues with those in a saltwater system. Ammonia is a problem... what test kit are you using?

What kind of rock did you start with...ie, dry marco rock, pukani dry rock, or recently dried out live rock? Asking because if the ammonia is true, you might still be having some organic decomposition occuring (rock curing).

 

[Geonet]

I'm kinda new also...was told pretty quickly about API Ammonia test kits always reading .25

I bought a Seachem ammonia badge on advice from some members here...Zero Ammonia registered since then.

 

[fideladio]

what type of test kit?

API Saltwater Master Test Kit

 

[fideladio]

A water change alone should not cause a spike in ammonia or nitrite. Are you using RO/DI water to mix your SW, or are you getting your water from a different source?

Hello there, yes Im used RODI water, I wouldn't call it a spike, both Ammonia and Nitrite are below 0.25 PPM but they are supposed to be zero... right?

 

[homer1475]

While API will get you close, the ammonia kit is known to always have that slight tinge of green, and not perfectly yellow like the card shows.

With that said, what is your source water?

 

[fideladio]

25 days with a bacterial starter kit... miter than likely cycled.

Don't worry about nitrites... no issues with those in a saltwater system. Ammonia is a problem... what test kit are you using?

What kind of rock did you start with...ie, dry marco rock, pukani dry rock, or recently dried out live rock? Asking because if the ammonia is true, you might still be having some organic decomposition occuring (rock curing).

Hello, I used dry rock, not pukani or anything like that, I boiled the rocks before placing them in the tank, as per test kit Im using API Saltwater Master Test Kit.

 

[fideladio]

While API will get you close, the ammonia kit is known to always have that slight tinge of green, and not perfectly yellow like the card shows.

With that said, what is your source water?

Hey Homer, my water is RODI, here is the picture of the reading of ammonia last night.

 

[homer1475]

Thats what I'm talking about, always that slight tinge of green.

Probably cycled. While you said your using RO/DI, do you happen to know if your town uses chloramines in the water system?

take your API kit, and measure your RO/DI for ammonia.

 

[brandon429]

Agreed that’s a classic .25

the ammonia going down stated earlier confirms the cycle, no zero required for either of the tests, this tank is cycled (initial additions won’t die) due to a month underwater plus measured ammonia movement.

the trainers who wrote cycling rules for us didn’t know seneye monitoring would come alone one day and reveal there isn’t an ammonia zero, only ammonia in the thousandths constantly


that api system might be over reporting legit ammonia presence in all reefs, pre conversion levels. Other nitrogen species might be cross reading, which is why we’ve amended cycling rules to only require the down reading for ammonia from a prior sample, but not hard zero.

nitrite and nitrate simply don’t matter in cycling, so you are set and ready. Initial additions will not die over nite like they will in an uncycled reef/max 48 hours

 

[AquaBiomics]

I'm kinda new also...was told pretty quickly about API Ammonia test kits always reading .25

I bought a Seachem ammonia badge on advice from some members here...Zero Ammonia registered since then.

I generally agree with brandon on this. If your tank showed evidence of ammonia and nitrite removal, its cycled. The nitrifying microbes don't go away, even if population size may fluctuate a little.

My only caution for you is this. Sometimes people try to cycle with the lights on and get an ineffective cycle, because algae takes up most of the ammonia and nitrite. If your lights have been off during your cycle, I'm confident its cycled. If not, I'd check the ammonia removal rates one more time just to be sure. This time during a 48 hour lights out period.

Algae can take up a lot of N waste and screw up our ability to detect cycling, and I think they also can slow down the growth of nitrifying microbes.

 

[Miller535]

Hello there,

Im new in the hobby, I just started my reef tank, 20 gallons, I started my cycling period about 25 days ago using Brightwell Micro Bacter Dry Rock Starter Kit, I made the cycle, brought down Ammonia and Nitrite to zero and my Nitrates where reading at 80PPM, the instructions on the Brightwell Kit notes that after Im cycled that I have to do a 25% water change, which I did, however, after I finished the water change I measured all my parameters and I got some reading on Ammonia and Nitrite, Its my understanding that it's not suppose to happen. Can someone shed some light on this?

PS. My Nitrites after the water change lowered to 40PPM

As others have stated API is not very good. For instance, mathematically it's impossible to have a Nitrate of 80ppm, and do a 25% water change, and have your Nitrate cut in half. I would call the API error

 

[brandon429]

I promptly hit private message in 1.2 nanoseconds response time / earns a reward pellet


bottom line, whatever you add for a new reef won’t die here when added. Is there a better measure for a closed cycle


*how do reef conventions ensure five hundred no issue skip cycle reefs, and did you do anything the 500 do? That’s why you are cycled, because when sales cash is on the line somehow nobody stumbles on their cycle. The sales machine for the hobby is also our skip cycle legitimizer.

confidence will directly save us money when reef tank cycling.

 

[Miller535]

I promptly hit private message in 1.2 nanoseconds response time / earns a reward pellet


bottom line, whatever you add for a new reef won’t die here when added. Is there a better measure for a closed cycle


*how do reef conventions ensure five hundred no issue skip cycle reefs, and did you do anything the 500 do? That’s why you are cycled, because when sales cash is on the line somehow nobody stumbles on their cycle. The sales machine for the hobby is also our skip cycle legitimizer.

confidence will directly save us money when reef tank cycling.

While I agree that the OP's tank is cycled. I would argue that a person starting a tank with dry rock and starting from scratch is completely different then vendors at a convention. A vendor at a convention is taking rock and media out of cycled tanks (that in itself makes the convention tank cycled already), and they are only leaving them set up for maybe 2 days. So all the circumstances are different. Comparing vendor tanks at a convention to a brand new, dry rock tank is comparing apples to oranges.

 

[brandon429]

I like to generate that type of discussion for sure

Dr Reef's thread shows nearly all bottle bac deposit onto surfaces and become immune to a full water change within 3 days of adding, most are ready overnite.

that's the hallmark measure of a completed cycle, the proofs we use to show a tank ready (can support life) are not affected by full water changes.

how would that factor into your assessment that convention cycles are weak, on a decline of ability, vs an old school 30 day cycle

at aquashella, I saw the bottle bac group with white rock and a bunch of clowns in a no skimmer nano

its hard to imagine that being equal to a 30 day cycle, but activated surface area is activated no matter how you arrive, quick or fast. not all are live rock transfers.

 

[brandon429]

a dry rock insta start. the gutsiest one Ive ever seen lol, call anemone police stat

Bio-spira works great

I just started a new tank a little over a week ago. I started with all dry rock and new sand. I added a bottle of Bio-Spira and put fish and coral the same day. Never saw any ammonia and fish and coral seem healthy.

www.reef2reef.com

there are no forms of cycles that are weaker than others, its all equal ends once the workers have deposited. there's a moores law for reef tank cycling just like there's one for speed of computing

old school 30 day ramp up and fed cycle: cannot be undone with a full water change.


fritz refrigerated bacteria dosed into a new dry scape cannot be undone by a full water change the next day after its dosed, amazing transfer biology in a bottle they've attained. that characteristic links the two cycle as equal in ends.

 

[fideladio]

I generally agree with brandon on this. If your tank showed evidence of ammonia and nitrite removal, its cycled. The nitrifying microbes don't go away, even if population size may fluctuate a little.

My only caution for you is this. Sometimes people try to cycle with the lights on and get an ineffective cycle, because algae takes up most of the ammonia and nitrite. If your lights have been off during your cycle, I'm confident its cycled. If not, I'd check the ammonia removal rates one more time just to be sure. This time during a 48 hour lights out period.

Algae can take up a lot of N waste and screw up our ability to detect cycling, and I think they also can slow down the growth of nitrifying microbes.

Awesome, great! I can guarantee there is no light involved due to the fact that I haven't received them yet XD.

 

[Miller535]

@brandon429 , I think you misunderstand me. I was not saying that convention tanks are weak. On the contrary, I am saying that MOST of them are fully cycled because MOST are taking rock and media from established tanks at their facilities generally. Which is not what a person cycling from scratch is doing. So should not be compared.