Squamosa clam stopped opening

[LagoonReefLife]

I’ve had this beautiful Squamosa clam for a little over two weeks. So far it’s been looking healthy and opening consistently, until yesterday. It closed up in the AM and stay shut all day. Started to open this morning but shut again maybe 30 minutes after the lights came on.

No fish bothering it. There are two clowns that started hanging out in the back corner above it. I could remove them and see if it doesn’t like the activity near it… but I think it wouldn’t care that much.

My phosphate dropped to 0.14 and nitrates dropped from 30s to 20s over the weekend, been working to get them lower. maybe the change?

This was on Sunday

 

[LagoonReefLife]

Here are my parameters from the past week.

Lighting and flow hasn’t changed.

 

[Tcook]

Maybe. Alk seems high. Maybe pmd. Check out @OrionN article on it. Need to save this beauty

 

[Macdaddynick1]

How many gallons is the tank and what types of lights are you running?


Check under the clam do you have white tiny snails that look like small rice, or amphipods hanging out there?

 

[hart24601]

My largest concern is that I don’t see any white new growth on the shell. Unless some is hiding in the little bit of shadows it’s very possible clam has been doing poorly a long time I’m sorry to say. They look great until they stop extending and die.

Having it only two weeks and with that little to no growth it was probably sick before you got it. That’s one of the biggest tricks to getting clams, finding healthy ones to start.

I doubt anything you do will help it, just hasten its demise. Wish I wasn’t such a downer but that’s my experience having 100s of clams over the years.

Edit- looking for snails is a good step. I have been able to save clams infested with those by weekly brushing.

 

[Tcook]

My largest concern is that I don’t see any white new growth on the shell. Unless some is hiding in the little bit of shadows it’s very possible clam has been doing poorly a long time I’m sorry to say.

This is a glaring finding that I overlooked. Two weeks time isn’t enough the loose that white rim on a healthy clam. As hartz points out it was probably going on for some time with the seller. Where did you get it from? An online vendor? Maybe reach out to them.

 

[Macdaddynick1]

My largest concern is that I don’t see any white new growth on the shell. Unless some is hiding in the little bit of shadows it’s very possible clam has been doing poorly a long time I’m sorry to say. They look great until they stop extending and die.

Having it only two weeks and with that little to no growth it was probably sick before you got it. That’s one of the biggest tricks to getting clams, finding healthy ones to start.

I doubt anything you do will help it, just hasten its demise. Wish I wasn’t such a downer but that’s my experience having 100s of clams over the years.

Although, I don’t have such vast experience with clams. I would have to disagree on this point. Clams do die once their shell stops growing. However, it takes larger clams a long time to die once the shell stops growing. I had experience with two clams recently. One of my Squamosa stopped growing for almost 7 months. I was hitting my head against the wall for a while. I finally figured out that amphipods were bothering it from the bottom. I now take the clam out every week or so and spray it with RODI, for the first time in months I see my clam resuming the growth. My second experience is with a maxima clam. I purchased it from the store with no shell growth, it came from someone else’s tank and was in a horrible state. I got it pretty cheap to see if I can get it to start growing again. It is now putting on new scutes in my system after two months. I just now moved my very large derasa from one tank to another due to it being bothered by tangs it also stopped growing. This one hasn’t recovered it’s shell growth yet, but I’m hopeful. My though is that unless it is a disease that cannot be cured by us, there’s always a chance to get the clam to start growing after a stress event. Howevere, OP needs to start acting now, and not just let it ride. If he manages to set optimal conditions for the clam it definitely can recover. IMO.

 

[hart24601]

Although, I don’t have such vast experience with clams. I would have to disagree on this point. Clams do die once their shell stops growing. However, it takes larger clams a long time to die once the shell stops growing. I had experience with two clams recently. One of my Squamosa stopped growing for almost 7 months. I was hitting my head against the wall for a while. I finally figured out that amphipods were bothering it from the bottom. I now take the clam out every week or so and spray it with RODI, for the first time in months I see my clam resuming the growth. My second experience is with a maxima clam. I purchased it from the store with no shell growth, it came from someone else’s tank and was in a horrible state. I got it pretty cheap to see if I can get it to start growing again. It is now putting on new scutes in my system after two months. I just now moved my very large derasa from one tank to another due to it being bothered by tangs it also stopped growing. This one hasn’t recovered it’s shell growth yet, but I’m hopeful. My though is that unless it is a disease that cannot be cured by us, there’s always a chance to get the clam to start growing after a stress event. Howevere, OP needs to start acting now, and not just let it ride. If he manages to set optimal conditions for the clam it definitely can recover. IMO.

Yeah there are always exceptions, I just have not had recovery from a vendor occur for me over the decades. I wanted to set expectations that recovery is probably not going to happen but you’re right, not impossible.

I totally agree that they should strive for optimal conditions, I didn’t mean to give the indication to toss it. However if water chemistry and quality is good, and PAR is 300+ I don’t advise messing with it unless it has snails. I have not seen legit pmd in over a decade but often people say to freshwater dip, in cases like this that tends to be the nail in the coffin.

Over the years I had two clams systems wiped out by mystery disease, no pinched mantle, but both times were from blue squammys from divers den. I stupidly didn’t QT at that time. Each occasion, perhaps 5 years apart, I got a blue squammy with no white shell and whatever disease it had spread to my others. Last time cost me 50 healthy growing clams before learned my lesson….

 

[hart24601]

I will add that imo most clam deaths if not unhealthy to start, come from fish picking at it. Doesn’t seem to be the case here, but it only takes a few fish pecks a day which most people never notice to get the clam to stay closed and starve.

I have also had pods eat clam mantles, I had to add fish to my clam system for that exact reason!

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

I think that a maxima crocea? It should be on the rocks, and should have a high enough par. I doubt the par is adequate on the sandbed, and judging by all that algae, I question the cleanliness of that tank. As mentioned, the clam has not been growing for a while, so where ever you got it from, it wasn't in good condition to start, and your tank doesn't seem stable enough for a sensitive animal to recover in.

 

[Macdaddynick1]

I

I will add that imo most clam deaths if not unhealthy to start, come from fish picking at it. Doesn’t seem to be the case here, but it only takes a few fish pecks a day which most people never notice to get the clam to stay closed and starve.

I have also had pods eat clam mantles, I had to add fish to my clam system for that exact reason!

I wonder if Cipro would be something to treat the clams from the weird disease you’ve had to deal with. It seems to be solving bacterial problems for LPS and Anemones.

Also which fish did you add to the system to control the pods?

 

[LagoonReefLife]

How many gallons is the tank and what types of lights are you running?


Check under the clam do you have white tiny snails that look like small rice, or amphipods hanging out there?

It's a 180 gallon system with Kessil a500x + 30 degree reflector. Running at around 550-600 PAR.
I'm going to check for snails, I'm sure there are lots of pods at around the bysal opening. This tank is mostly fishless so there's lots of pods in it.

 

[LagoonReefLife]

Yeah there are always exceptions, I just have not had recovery from a vendor occur for me over the decades. I wanted to set expectations that recovery is probably not going to happen but you’re right, not impossible.

I totally agree that they should strive for optimal conditions, I didn’t mean to give the indication to toss it. However if water chemistry and quality is good, and PAR is 300+ I don’t advise messing with it unless it has snails. I have not seen legit pmd in over a decade but often people say to freshwater dip, in cases like this that tends to be the nail in the coffin.

Over the years I had two clams systems wiped out by mystery disease, no pinched mantle, but both times were from blue squammys from divers den. I stupidly didn’t QT at that time. Each occasion, perhaps 5 years apart, I got a blue squammy with no white shell and whatever disease it had spread to my others. Last time cost me 50 healthy growing clams before learned my lesson….

My PAR is around 550-600. I'm going to check it for snails, but if I don't find any pyramid snails I won't mess with it more.

I got it from @PacificEastAquaculture
I emailed them asking for some help, we'll see what the response is. From what I've been told the best place to get healthy clams.
I know things happen, but I'm really bummed out, I hate to watch this one die. Although I made this post knowing there isn't much that can be done, worth reaching out for sure.

 

[hart24601]

I

I wonder if Cipro would be something to treat the clams from the weird disease you’ve had to deal with. It seems to be solving bacterial problems for LPS and Anemones.

Also which fish did you add to the system to control the pods?

Not to distract too much off the OP, but I added a dottyback.

Over the years have tried cipro, and all sorts of other antibiotics to no help when clams are sick. Not much is known about their diseases.

 

[hart24601]

My PAR is around 550-600. I'm going to check it for snails, but if I don't find any pyramid snails I won't mess with it more.

I got it from @PacificEastAquaculture
I emailed them asking for some help, we'll see what the response is. From what I've been told the best place to get healthy clams.
I know things happen, but I'm really bummed out, I hate to watch this one die. Although I made this post knowing there isn't much that can be done, worth reaching out for sure.

Oh wow yeah I have never had a clam from them arrive without growth, and I have bought a lot from them, at least several thousands $ over the years. I hope they come through for you.

 

[LagoonReefLife]

Oh wow yeah I have never had a clam from them arrive without growth, and I have bought a lot from them, at least several thousands $ over the years. I hope they come through for you.

According to them, white shell growth isn't an indicator of a healthy large Squamosa clam. They sent pictures of many without any white shell growth.

They are blaming my water quality, siting algae growth, changing parameters, and high alkalinity. I plan on letting my alkalinity drop back down to 9.
I'll admit they need to be more stable, and of course that's my primary goal. I'm still dialing the system in.

If that's true, and it's simply unhappy because of some parameter shifting, it shouldn't die right?

 

[iseethruyou2]

I recently bought a blue Squamosa from them that was super small and noticed no new shell growth when I received it. So far it’s been fine but just wanted you to know it wasn’t just yours that didn’t have shell growth when received.

 

[hart24601]

According to them, white shell growth isn't an indicator of a healthy large Squamosa clam. They sent pictures of many without any white shell growth.

They are blaming my water quality, siting algae growth, changing parameters, and high alkalinity. I plan on letting my alkalinity drop back down to 9.
I'll admit they need to be more stable, and of course that's my primary goal. I'm still dialing the system in.

If that's true, and it's simply unhappy because of some parameter shifting, it shouldn't die right?

I am slightly disappointed in their response, I am not sure them having lots without growth is a good thing, but yes, if that is true just get the system stable and don’t mess around with the clam. It should recover, if what they say is true.

 

[Macdaddynick1]

My PAR is around 550-600. I'm going to check it for snails, but if I don't find any pyramid snails I won't mess with it more.

I got it from @PacificEastAquaculture
I emailed them asking for some help, we'll see what the response is. From what I've been told the best place to get healthy clams.
I know things happen, but I'm really bummed out, I hate to watch this one die. Although I made this post knowing there isn't much that can be done, worth reaching out for sure.

In all honesty, I think there’s some serious issue with your system that’s causing the clam to do this unhappy. Additionally, the clam shell grew so much algae within two weeks is a good indicator that there’s a problem. You might want to do a couple of large waterchanges and check for the source of phosphates or iron in the system. If you’re making water yourself, it’s time to replace membranes and DI. Double check your salinity. Make sure your light spectrum isn’t too red causing all that algae to take over. Throw in some carbon, it always helps IMO.

 

[LagoonReefLife]

In all honesty, I think there’s some serious issue with your system that’s causing the clam to do this unhappy. Additionally, the clam shell grew so much algae within two weeks is a good indicator that there’s a problem. You might want to do a couple of large waterchanges and check for the source of phosphates or iron in the system. If you’re making water yourself, it’s time to replace membranes and DI. Double check your salinity. Make sure your light spectrum isn’t too red causing all that algae to take over. Throw in some carbon, it always helps IMO.

My source water is good. 0 TDS with double resin chambers and dual membranes. I replace the resin around every 2 weeks.

Now that I think about it, I maybe overdosing trace elements. I’m keeping Goniopora as my main coral which I’ve read everywhere need/like iron. Plus I have a good size refugium with chaetomorpha.

But the gonis haven’t been that happy either, probably my fluctuating nitrate/phosphates.
I have a bio pellet reactor that I think has been lowering the nitrates the past month.

I don’t run any filter floss, partially because I want to organics in the water column for coral. Basically how the tritan method does it, no particulate filter and let it hit the algae bed. Clean/rotate algae regularly.
Plus it’s a huge pain to reach my filter sock chamber now with my ATO directly above it.
I may have to start using them again though.
I have a reef octopus 200 skimmer that is pulling out tons of gunk a week.
I have been doing 2% daily auto changes everyday.

I’m going to pause the trace element and iron dosing for a good while and do some water changes this week.
Just did about a 20% change. I’ll do probably 2 more over the next few days. That will help lower my alkalinity, phosphates and nitrates more too.