Palytoxin

[jeeper07]

Ok, so I’ll change 50% out tonight and then add the 60ml. How long do I leave that in there?

It is but I realize now, tank is empty. With that, you can apply 60ml

Are you sure 60 ml is correct? 800 gallon tank, probably 70-100 gallon sump. I don’t want to be disrespectful but that still seems like a drop in the bucket for that much water? Someone was saying 5-6 gallons of bleach would be needed if I bleached the entire system which I won’t do. Seems as though I would need a lot more vinegar? Again I don’t mean to be disrespectful at all but I want to make sure I dose enough.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Ok, so I’ll change 50% out tonight and then add the 60ml. How long do I leave that in there?

24-48 hrs

 

[The_Paradox]

Are you sure 60 ml is correct? 800 gallon tank, probably 70-100 gallon sump. I don’t want to be disrespectful but that still seems like a drop in the bucket for that much water? Someone was saying 5-6 gallons of bleach would be needed if I bleached the entire system which I won’t do. Seems as though I would need a lot more vinegar? Again I don’t mean to be disrespectful at all but I want to make sure I dose enough.

That was when you were trying to sterilize it not sanitize it.

You have been messing with it a ton the last few days? Any reoccurrence of symptoms? If not it’s probably fine. Drain it and refill with salt water and start cycling.

 

[jeeper07]

That was when you were trying to sterilize it not sanitize it.

You have been messing with it a ton the last few days? Any reoccurrence of symptoms? If not it’s probably fine. Drain it and refill with salt water and start cycling.

Not that I can tell but I spent a ton of time around it. Think I’ll add the vinegar and flush a few times just to be safe. Would there be any adverse affects if I added more than 60ml?

 

[Falreef]

Hello all, first post here and unfortunately it has to do with palytoxin. I’ll try to keep it short but I feel like I need to explain in detail to give a full scope of what I’m experiencing. Around may-June last year I broke down a tank that had a lot of live rock, some soft coral, some zoas, palythoas and some anemones. I placed everything in a large horse trough in the basement until I could get the tank up and running again. Well fast Foward to about 2 weeks ago, and I finally stated aquascaping, life got in the way and delayed the tank by several months. During that time most of the coral/poly’s and zoas died off. About 2 weeks ago I took out the majority of the rock to rinse some of the cyno off and let sit out on a tarp in the basement to dry off enough to let the reef mortar set up. Later that night I came down with a bad cold, or so I thought. Came out of nowhere, coughing,sneezing and tons of mucus. Within a couple days I felt better but still had symptoms. The tank took about a week to fill, I just let the ro fill directly into the tank and added salt directly to the tank daily. last Thursday the tank was finally full enough to kick in the return pumps, within 5 minutes of the return pumps running BOOM the “cold” comes back again. 2nd time in two weeks that I got sick like this. The tank did have a ton of aeration from the splashing in the sump as I had the pumps running at full tilt. I was completely miserable that day. Then I came home to our little yorkie breathing heavily that night. Cleaned her up and let her sleep up stairs and she was fine the next day.That should have been a sign that something was up. My family and I left town the next day for 1 night and came back home to all 3 of our dogs soughing/hacking. Did I have a run in with palytoxin? If so what do I do to get rid of it? Tonight I made the decision to drain out half of the tank and replace it with just regular tap water and do another 50% water change tomorrow with tap water too. I also added a bunch of carbon. I plan on doing 50% water changes for the next few days unless advised differently. I’m still coughing and that was 4 days ago and anytime I’m down stairs for a bit it gets worse. Please help.

Yes. You have an issue with palytoxin and other coral toxins.
You likely now have the toxin aerosolized throughout the house.
Hazmat and a thorough cleaning will now be the only way to resolve this. Probably on the surfaces of everything, floors, carpets. This can be a very serious problem. Often can have bad chills , occasionally fevers, headaches and body aches. Has potential to be life threatening.

 

[jeeper07]

Yes. You have an issue with palytoxin and other coral toxins.
You likely now have the toxin aerosolized throughout the house.
Hazmat and a thorough cleaning will now be the only way to resolve this. Probably on the surfaces of everything, floors, carpets. This can be a very serious problem. Often can have bad chills , occasionally fevers, headaches and body aches. Has potential to be life threatening.

Yes. You have an issue with palytoxin and other coral toxins.
You likely now have the toxin aerosolized throughout the house.
Hazmat and a thorough cleaning will now be the only way to resolve this. Probably on the surfaces of everything, floors, carpets. This can be a very serious problem. Often can have bad chills , occasionally fevers, headaches and body aches. Has potential to be life threatening.

Symptoms are slowly getting better, wouldn’t you think the worst of it is over with? I’ve done a 100% water change and filled with tap water and added a bunch of carbon. Agree on the cleaning part.

 

[jeeper07]

My question is this. I was planning on making this tank into a fowlr tank with just real basic easy to take care of corals here and there that don’t require perfect stability. With that being said, can this happen again?? If I have an issue with cyno or Dino’s in the future can it get into the air?

 

[jeeper07]

My first thought would be bleach, but - with the other thread you have about that - I don't know enough about chemistry to say if that would be a good idea for you or not. I know hydrogen peroxide in highly concentrated amounts can be used as well, but - again - I don't know if that would be a good idea or not.

Personally, I'd say to ask @Randy Holmes-Farley if he has any thoughts on how to safely and effectively sterilize your tank.

How do I ask him about that? I clicked on the link to his name but I don’t see a option to send a message

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

My question is this. I was planning on making this tank into a fowlr tank with just real basic easy to take care of corals here and there that don’t require perfect stability. With that being said, can this happen again?? If I have an issue with cyno or Dino’s in the future can it get into the air?

If it's from cyano, dinos, or bacteria, then yes, it could potentially happen again (it's unlikely, but possible).

If you're concerned, then a solid lid to contain any spray may be a good idea.

How do I ask him about that? I clicked on the link to his name but I don’t see a option to send a message

You'd probably have to make a thread in the Chemistry forum to specifically ask him. Some of the other chem forum regulars would likely be good to ask about this anyway, so a thread there may be a good choice.

 

[Poseidon03]

24-48 hrs

Isn't the halflife of palytoxin something like 60 minutes? Wouldn't it degrade in the water?

 

[jeeper07]

If it's from cyano, dinos, or bacteria, then yes, it could potentially happen again (it's unlikely, but possible).

If you're concerned, then a solid lid to contain any spray may be a good idea.

You'd probably have to make a thread in the Chemistry forum to specifically ask him. Some of the other chem forum regulars would likely be good to ask about this anyway, so a thread there may be a good choice.

Makes sense, does cyno/ Dino’s contain palytoxin? I hate to do this but maybe I’ll make it a freshwater tank.

 

[twentyleagues]

Makes sense, does cyno/ Dino’s contain palytoxin? I hate to do this but maybe I’ll make it a freshwater tank.

Like I was let know on page 2 cyantoxins. Also most dont think it was palytoxin. The whole thing seems weird and unfortunate. Have you checked the house for black mold? May be that large volume of water being open to the atmosphere for however long caused some issues you were not aware of? I am not a doctor so I am not ruling anything out.

 

[jeeper07]

Like I was let know on page 2 cyantoxins. Also most dont think it was palytoxin. The whole thing seems weird and unfortunate. Have you checked the house for black mold? May be that large volume of water being open to the atmosphere for however long caused some issues you were not aware of? I am not a doctor so I am not ruling anything out.

Yeah I checked everywhere. I don’t understand it at all. I’ve owned reef tanks in the past, had cyno and Dino’s before and never had a reaction like this.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Isn't the halflife of palytoxin something like 60 minutes? Wouldn't it degrade in the water?

That I’m not positive on but not convinced on paly toxin

 

[twentyleagues]

That I’m not positive on but not convinced on paly toxin

Isn't the halflife of palytoxin something like 60 minutes? Wouldn't it degrade in the water?

I just googled it.....
Multiple sources say 55-80 min. Although faster in acidic or very alkaline situations. Take that for what it is. A google search.