Mysterious - 4 Dead Anthias in less than 12 hours

[Soup Sandwich]

Hello there,

In late April of 2024 I purchased 4 Dispar Anthias. They arrived in great condition, and took to acclimation very well. Knowing the challenges of keeping Anthias I readily fed them throughout the days and 4 out of the 5 put on good weight and looked very healthy. One of the 5 did not put on weight, got very skinny and eventually died, maybe about a month after arrival. The remaining 4 were incredibly healthy, and would readily eat out of my hand. They showed great colors and behaviors all the time.

Fast forward to yesterday morning - I did my normal routine which is putting in 2 cubes of frozen food (the type varied throughout the day, but these two cubes were PE Mysis shrimp) into a slow feeder/defroster for them to eat throughout the morning. I am near the end of this frozen blister pack, so they have been eating this exact food for about a month, in conjunction with other foods. All 4 Anthias were grouped up by the opening in the tank where I put their food in, as they have done every time I walk in the room. I spent the day on the road for work and went to do a water change when I got home last night, and found that all 4 anthias were dead. No other fish or corals in my tank are showing any sign of stress or illness.

My tank is a Waterbox Infinia Reef 230.6 which was setup in March. However, I had cured media from another system of mine that was ~3 years old. The stocking of the tank now consists of a 4.5" Kole tang, 2.5" Regal Tang, a 3" Yellow Tang, two juvenile Clown Fish and a Royal Gramma, along with a mixture of snails and hermits. None of these fish have shown any aggression, and I have a somewhat significant 'negative space' style aquascape for plenty of hiding. One of the anthia's bodies had been mostly stripped by the CUC that was piled on it, but the other bodies looked completely normal (almost still alive) with no sign of injury or disease.

I have recently been having a brown film issue (I think Diatoms, but not confirmed) which I believe was due to my low nutrients - 0 reading on my Hanna Phosphate Checker (not ULR) and around 2-3 on my Hanna Nitrate Checker with no green algae growth anywhere in the tank. In an attempt to fix this issue brown film issue, about 6 weeks ago I reduced my water change schedule to ~30% per month (down from 30% every 2 weeks) and turned off my skimmer. This has slowly brought up my phosphate which was at .06 when checked last night, and has significantly reduced the brown film, allowed small amounts of GHA growth and I am now seeing spots of calcareous algae growth. I regularly check my salinity, which sits right at 35 PPT. Aside from this reduction in water change schedule and turning off of my skimmer ~6 weeks ago, there have been no other changes and no new fish or corals added. All equipment is working as expected (redundant heater controllers, lights, return pump and circulation pumps are all monitored and alarmed remotely), and there was nobody in my home that could have tampered with or done anything to the tank.

The only variable I can think of is the PE Mysis shrimp, but even that feels like a stretch since they have been happily eating it for at least a month, and none of the other fish in the tank are showing any symptoms whatsoever. I am at a loss in trying to diagnose what happened, and I am open to any insights that the community may have. If I left out any pertinent information that would help diagnose please let me know and I will include it.

Much appreciated,

Soup

 

[Jekyl]

Reading through this and providing the additional information as well as posting white light pics and video of surviving fish may help this along

Some Helpful Hints When Posting or Responding to Threads in the Fish Disease Treatment and Diagnosis Section

Aquarium Fish Disease Problem Solving Determining the best course of action for a problem with your aquarium can be a difficult task. Even advanced aquarists will often need to seek the help of others for complicated or unique issues. Our intent here on Reef 2 Reef is to offer expert advice...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hello there,

In late April of 2024 I purchased 4 Dispar Anthias. They arrived in great condition, and took to acclimation very well. Knowing the challenges of keeping Anthias I readily fed them throughout the days and 4 out of the 5 put on good weight and looked very healthy. One of the 5 did not put on weight, got very skinny and eventually died, maybe about a month after arrival. The remaining 4 were incredibly healthy, and would readily eat out of my hand. They showed great colors and behaviors all the time.

Fast forward to yesterday morning - I did my normal routine which is putting in 2 cubes of frozen food (the type varied throughout the day, but these two cubes were PE Mysis shrimp) into a slow feeder/defroster for them to eat throughout the morning. I am near the end of this frozen blister pack, so they have been eating this exact food for about a month, in conjunction with other foods. All 4 Anthias were grouped up by the opening in the tank where I put their food in, as they have done every time I walk in the room. I spent the day on the road for work and went to do a water change when I got home last night, and found that all 4 anthias were dead. No other fish or corals in my tank are showing any sign of stress or illness.

My tank is a Waterbox Infinia Reef 230.6 which was setup in March. However, I had cured media from another system of mine that was ~3 years old. The stocking of the tank now consists of a 4.5" Kole tang, 2.5" Regal Tang, a 3" Yellow Tang, two juvenile Clown Fish and a Royal Gramma, along with a mixture of snails and hermits. None of these fish have shown any aggression, and I have a somewhat significant 'negative space' style aquascape for plenty of hiding. One of the anthia's bodies had been mostly stripped by the CUC that was piled on it, but the other bodies looked completely normal (almost still alive) with no sign of injury or disease.

I have recently been having a brown film issue (I think Diatoms, but not confirmed) which I believe was due to my low nutrients - 0 reading on my Hanna Phosphate Checker (not ULR) and around 2-3 on my Hanna Nitrate Checker with no green algae growth anywhere in the tank. In an attempt to fix this issue brown film issue, about 6 weeks ago I reduced my water change schedule to ~30% per month (down from 30% every 2 weeks) and turned off my skimmer. This has slowly brought up my phosphate which was at .06 when checked last night, and has significantly reduced the brown film, allowed small amounts of GHA growth and I am now seeing spots of calcareous algae growth. I regularly check my salinity, which sits right at 35 PPT. Aside from this reduction in water change schedule and turning off of my skimmer ~6 weeks ago, there have been no other changes and no new fish or corals added. All equipment is working as expected (redundant heater controllers, lights, return pump and circulation pumps are all monitored and alarmed remotely), and there was nobody in my home that could have tampered with or done anything to the tank.

The only variable I can think of is the PE Mysis shrimp, but even that feels like a stretch since they have been happily eating it for at least a month, and none of the other fish in the tank are showing any symptoms whatsoever. I am at a loss in trying to diagnose what happened, and I am open to any insights that the community may have. If I left out any pertinent information that would help diagnose please let me know and I will include it.

Much appreciated,

Soup

This is a scenario where Pics will/would be of great assistance.
By any chance was there bruising on their bodies?
Any raised scales?
When discovered, were their mouths wide open?

 

[Soup Sandwich]

This is a scenario where Pics will/would be of great assistance.
By any chance was there bruising on their bodies?
Any raised scales?
When discovered, were their mouths wide open?

Thank you for reaching out. On the 3 bodies that were not touched by the CUC, no bruising, raised scaled, discoloration or anything out of the ordinary stood out - even specifically noting that all of the fins were still fully intact and not torn. I did notice that the mouth of one was wide open - looking just like they do when they would 'stretch' their mouths when they were calmly swimming in view. The other two had their mouths closed. The 4th was mostly a skeleton and some skin when I got to it so I can not be sure how that one looked.

Unfortunately I did not take any pictures of the deceased, but I will follow up later on with photos of the tank and its other inhabitants.

 

[Soup Sandwich]

Reading through this and providing the additional information as well as posting white light pics and video of surviving fish may help this along

Some Helpful Hints When Posting or Responding to Threads in the Fish Disease Treatment and Diagnosis Section

Aquarium Fish Disease Problem Solving Determining the best course of action for a problem with your aquarium can be a difficult task. Even advanced aquarists will often need to seek the help of others for complicated or unique issues. Our intent here on Reef 2 Reef is to offer expert advice...

www.reef2reef.com

Much appreciated - I will update with additional information and pictures later on this afternoon.

 

[saltytanked]

That particular blister you fed could have held some kind of toxin or hazardous substance in it.

 

[Soup Sandwich]

That particular blister you fed could have held some kind of toxin or hazardous substance in it.

That was my initial thought as well. However, with all of the fish eating from the water column, I would expect additional fish to be having an issue, particularly the two juvenile Clowns due to their small size (~1").

 

[Soup Sandwich]

Hello there,

In late April of 2024 I purchased 4 Dispar Anthias. They arrived in great condition, and took to acclimation very well. Knowing the challenges of keeping Anthias I readily fed them throughout the days and 4 out of the 5 put on good weight and looked very healthy. One of the 5 did not put on weight, got very skinny and eventually died, maybe about a month after arrival. The remaining 4 were incredibly healthy, and would readily eat out of my hand. They showed great colors and behaviors all the time.

Fast forward to yesterday morning - I did my normal routine which is putting in 2 cubes of frozen food (the type varied throughout the day, but these two cubes were PE Mysis shrimp) into a slow feeder/defroster for them to eat throughout the morning. I am near the end of this frozen blister pack, so they have been eating this exact food for about a month, in conjunction with other foods. All 4 Anthias were grouped up by the opening in the tank where I put their food in, as they have done every time I walk in the room. I spent the day on the road for work and went to do a water change when I got home last night, and found that all 4 anthias were dead. No other fish or corals in my tank are showing any sign of stress or illness.

My tank is a Waterbox Infinia Reef 230.6 which was setup in March. However, I had cured media from another system of mine that was ~3 years old. The stocking of the tank now consists of a 4.5" Kole tang, 2.5" Regal Tang, a 3" Yellow Tang, two juvenile Clown Fish and a Royal Gramma, along with a mixture of snails and hermits. None of these fish have shown any aggression, and I have a somewhat significant 'negative space' style aquascape for plenty of hiding. One of the anthia's bodies had been mostly stripped by the CUC that was piled on it, but the other bodies looked completely normal (almost still alive) with no sign of injury or disease.

I have recently been having a brown film issue (I think Diatoms, but not confirmed) which I believe was due to my low nutrients - 0 reading on my Hanna Phosphate Checker (not ULR) and around 2-3 on my Hanna Nitrate Checker with no green algae growth anywhere in the tank. In an attempt to fix this issue brown film issue, about 6 weeks ago I reduced my water change schedule to ~30% per month (down from 30% every 2 weeks) and turned off my skimmer. This has slowly brought up my phosphate which was at .06 when checked last night, and has significantly reduced the brown film, allowed small amounts of GHA growth and I am now seeing spots of calcareous algae growth. I regularly check my salinity, which sits right at 35 PPT. Aside from this reduction in water change schedule and turning off of my skimmer ~6 weeks ago, there have been no other changes and no new fish or corals added. All equipment is working as expected (redundant heater controllers, lights, return pump and circulation pumps are all monitored and alarmed remotely), and there was nobody in my home that could have tampered with or done anything to the tank.

The only variable I can think of is the PE Mysis shrimp, but even that feels like a stretch since they have been happily eating it for at least a month, and none of the other fish in the tank are showing any symptoms whatsoever. I am at a loss in trying to diagnose what happened, and I am open to any insights that the community may have. If I left out any pertinent information that would help diagnose please let me know and I will include it.

Much appreciated,

Soup

Additional Information:

Aquarium type: Reef, Fish-only, Quarantine tank - Display Mixed Reef
Aquarium water volume - ~230 Gallons
Filtration type - Sump through Bio Media and rock rubble, 2 Ecotech MP40
Lighting 3x AI Hydra 32
How long has the aquarium been established? 5 Months but seeded with established media.
Digital image of the whole aquarium under white light Attached, along with some close-ups of fish. GHA appearing a bit worse than I realized under White light compared to blues.

Water quality (be sure to indicate what measurement units you are using, as well as the test kit brand)
Temperature 78-79F - measured with 2 inkbird controllers and a third high accuracy digital thermometer
pH: 7.8 (measured at time of posting, not time of discovering deaths) - Salifert liquid pH Test
Salinity / specific gravity 35PPT (measured at time of posting, not time of discovering deaths) - Milwaukee MA887 Digital Salinity Refractometer verified accuracy using Tropic Marin High Precision Hydrometer.
Ammonia - Unsure - Historically I do not test Ammonia after cycle and my Ammonia kit is far expired.
Nitrite - Unsure - Historically I do not test Nitrite after cycle and my Nitrite kit is far expired.
Nitrate - 3 PPM using Hanna Checker HR Nitrate (measured immediately after discovering deaths, before water change)
Phosphorus .06 PPM using Hanna Checker (measured immediately after discovering deaths, before water change)

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Thank you for reaching out. On the 3 bodies that were not touched by the CUC, no bruising, raised scaled, discoloration or anything out of the ordinary stood out - even specifically noting that all of the fins were still fully intact and not torn. I did notice that the mouth of one was wide open - looking just like they do when they would 'stretch' their mouths when they were calmly swimming in view. The other two had their mouths closed. The 4th was mostly a skeleton and some skin when I got to it so I can not be sure how that one looked.

Unfortunately I did not take any pictures of the deceased, but I will follow up later on with photos of the tank and its other inhabitants.

The open mouth is key here - marine fish die in that position when oxygen levels are low, or the fish has some issue extracting oxygen. Anthias have high oxygen requirements compared to many fish.

So - one possible diagnosis would be a gill disease like Amyloodinium (velvet) - but that would soon spread to all the other fish.

Flukes will cause fish to die open-mouthed, but seeing all fish in a group to die at once doesn’t happen with flukes - the loss's would be spread out over days/weeks.

A transient low oxygen issue is more likely, but that can be ruled out if your tank has good aeration (not just circulation). A skimmer or an airstone is the best way to accomplish that. I’ve had a couple of issues where the loss of oxygen was short-lived, a pump going off and then back on, things like that. In a couple of cases, people didn’t realize that the oxygenation was coming from their HOB filter - then, they topped the tank up a bit too high, stopping the cascading bubbles, and fish died.

Supersaturation can also cause sudden loss of fish in a matter of hours, and fish will died open-mouthed, but you will see tiny silver air bubbles in the gills and sometimes in the fins. Anthias are also very prone to this issue.

 

[Soup Sandwich]

The open mouth is key here - marine fish die in that position when oxygen levels are low, or the fish has some issue extracting oxygen. Anthias have high oxygen requirements compared to many fish.

So - one possible diagnosis would be a gill disease like Amyloodinium (velvet) - but that would soon spread to all the other fish.

Flukes will cause fish to die open-mouthed, but seeing all fish in a group to die at once doesn’t happen with flukes - the loss's would be spread out over days/weeks.

A transient low oxygen issue is more likely, but that can be ruled out if your tank has good aeration (not just circulation). A skimmer or an airstone is the best way to accomplish that. I’ve had a couple of issues where the loss of oxygen was short-lived, a pump going off and then back on, things like that. In a couple of cases, people didn’t realize that the oxygenation was coming from their HOB filter - then, they topped the tank up a bit too high, stopping the cascading bubbles, and fish died.

Supersaturation can also cause sudden loss of fish in a matter of hours, and fish will died open-mouthed, but you will see tiny silver air bubbles in the gills and sometimes in the fins. Anthias are also very prone to this issue.

Thank you very much for your detailed input.

My initial thoughts were something with the food, and then something along the lines of Velvet/brook/ich but with the other inhabitants currently at 100%, and no signs of any infections on the deceased bodies I ruled this out.

Of the 4 that passed, one was confirmed mouth open, two were mouth closed, and one was unable to tell.

On the topic of the low oxygen - one thing worth noting is that when I do water changes I turn off all forms of circulation, which remain off for upwards of an hour (with the exception of the refill which takes about 15-20 minutes and is obviously aerating during that time) and have not had any issues with the health of the fish doing things this way. When the system is in normal operation, which it was all day yesterday, I have the two return nozzles from the Syncra SDC 9.0, directed outward and pointed slightly upward towards the surface which breaks the water tension, along with one MP40 on each end pointed inward also located in the upper 1/3 of the tank which help with aeration/disturbing surface tension.

Regarding Supersaturation - that is not something I am familiar with and will have to do a bit more research. Knowing that Anthias are prone to this, would this likely impact an entire group at one time, and no other fish in the tank? Unfortunately I did not closely inspect the one body with the open mouth for any tiny bubbles, so I will never be able to confirm.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Thank you very much for your detailed input.

My initial thoughts were something with the food, and then something along the lines of Velvet/brook/ich but with the other inhabitants currently at 100%, and no signs of any infections on the deceased bodies I ruled this out.

Of the 4 that passed, one was confirmed mouth open, two were mouth closed, and one was unable to tell.

On the topic of the low oxygen - one thing worth noting is that when I do water changes I turn off all forms of circulation, which remain off for upwards of an hour (with the exception of the refill which takes about 15-20 minutes and is obviously aerating during that time) and have not had any issues with the health of the fish doing things this way. When the system is in normal operation, which it was all day yesterday, I have the two return nozzles from the Syncra SDC 9.0, directed outward and pointed slightly upward towards the surface which breaks the water tension, along with one MP40 on each end pointed inward also located in the upper 1/3 of the tank which help with aeration/disturbing surface tension.

Regarding Supersaturation - that is not something I am familiar with and will have to do a bit more research. Knowing that Anthias are prone to this, would this likely impact an entire group at one time, and no other fish in the tank? Unfortunately I did not closely inspect the one body with the open mouth for any tiny bubbles, so I will never be able to confirm.

I don’t think it is the food - acute deaths from food just doesn’t happen, food poisoning takes time to develop. Then, other fish would be affected.

Oh - maybe I misunderstood, I thought the fish loss happened prior to the planned water change?

Supersaturation in home aquariums is almost always related to an air leak on the suction side of a pump.

Your pH of 7.8 is a bit low - not harmful in itself, but it can be a symptom of high CO2 / low dissolved oxygen.

 

[Soup Sandwich]

Here to provide an unfortunate update on this issue.

I have had a near total loss, with only two fish remaining - the Regal Tang and the Kole Tang.

About a week after posting, I noticed some white spots on my Royal Gramma and some odd behavior. The remaining fish showed no signs of illness - clear skin, eating, behaving normally.

The next afternoon I found my Yellow Tang (thought to be the healthiest) dead on the bottom. Just like the anthias - it had no signs of illness. Later that night I found the Royal gramma dead.

The next day I noticed some white spots on the Regal Tang and Kole Tang, however they were very slight.

That night I noticed one of the two clowns had spots, that quickly spread - looking more like Brooklynella than anything else. Both clowns had passed by the next morning.

In the midst of all of this, I have also lost 2 cleaner shrimp, a pincushion urchin, ~15 trochus snails, and a handful of my corals are in rough shape but seem to be stabilizing, while others are still at 100% healthy.

My parameters have all held constant, with the exception of my phosphates dropping below detection on my Hanna Checker, and I have had no equipment failures.

As of today the Regal Tang is looking okay at best - but does not come out into the open any more so it is hard to tell. The Kole Tang is looking very rough when I do catch a glimpse, but I am unable to remove it to attempt treatment without a total breakdown of my tank.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Here to provide an unfortunate update on this issue.

I have had a near total loss, with only two fish remaining - the Regal Tang and the Kole Tang.

About a week after posting, I noticed some white spots on my Royal Gramma and some odd behavior. The remaining fish showed no signs of illness - clear skin, eating, behaving normally.

The next afternoon I found my Yellow Tang (thought to be the healthiest) dead on the bottom. Just like the anthias - it had no signs of illness. Later that night I found the Royal gramma dead.

The next day I noticed some white spots on the Regal Tang and Kole Tang, however they were very slight.

That night I noticed one of the two clowns had spots, that quickly spread - looking more like Brooklynella than anything else. Both clowns had passed by the next morning.

In the midst of all of this, I have also lost 2 cleaner shrimp, a pincushion urchin, ~15 trochus snails, and a handful of my corals are in rough shape but seem to be stabilizing, while others are still at 100% healthy.

My parameters have all held constant, with the exception of my phosphates dropping below detection on my Hanna Checker, and I have had no equipment failures.

As of today the Regal Tang is looking okay at best - but does not come out into the open any more so it is hard to tell. The Kole Tang is looking very rough when I do catch a glimpse, but I am unable to remove it to attempt treatment without a total breakdown of my tank.

Can you post a video of either fish?

 

[Soup Sandwich]

I was able to get the Kole tang out for a few seconds with some garlic nori. Much more grim than I was expecting.

From what I can tell - the Regal Tang looks a lot better than this, but it is remaining wedged in a small cave in the rocks so I can not get an image or video.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I was able to get the Kole tang out for a few seconds with some garlic nori. Much more grim than I was expecting.

From what I can tell - the Regal Tang looks a lot better than this, but it is remaining wedged in a small cave in the rocks so I can not get an image or video.

Sorry - the Kole tang has end stage ich. You will have difficulty saving this fish, but if you can move it immediately to a stable quarantine tank and dose with 2.5 ppm coppersafe, you might be able to. It is also breathing fast - that is sometimes seen with ich, but there could be a secondary infection of velvet or even flukes.