month old tank. Clown lives, but new fish dont... Sorry its long

everpresentnoob

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new to saltwater, but had fresh water for 20 plus years. realizing I really dont know to much about this.... lol This is a long post as im trying to say everything that has happened and been done to this tank so you can hopefully help and tell me where I went wrong and how to fix it.

Bought a 75 gallon tank from a guy with Current USA orbit marine lights, Reef Octo classic 150 int skimmer, 30 ish gallon sump. added a reefmat 500 and a Jaebao return pump. also have two Jaebao MOW-8 powerheads. 70 pounds or so of rock, and fiji pink sand to a depth of 1 inch. Hygger heater that is maintaining 78.5 in the DT.

I know this next part is a bad thing and I apologize to the fish gods for it...

bought premixed water from the LFS, which is the same water they use in their tanks in the shop. added a bottle of Fritz Turbo 900 and added a Clown fish. I wont get into the discussions from the little kids that just HAD TO HAVE NEMO rather than an empty tank... I tested with an API kit and saw ammonia get up to .08 ish. But the little clown seemed to be ok. loved to hide in the rocks but wasnt breathing heavy or scraping or anything. Lots of reading on here about API kits not being accurate so I bought a Hanna checker. then realized that in order to use it you have to have the PH reading and temp and then do some math. Bought a decent PH tester and did the math. Ammonia was at .05. next day tested again ammonia was lower. Clown still doing fine and the kids have named him Dreamsicle after their favorite popsicles.


Started hearing about the salifert test kits so I bought that to compare to the Hanna as well as bought one of the SeaChem ammonia alert badges to hang in the sump. salifert read the same as the hanna, while the API started reading higher. i stopped using the API... Seachem badge turned green, for alert at first. kept checking everything and the ammonia dropped to .02 and the seachem badge turned yellow saying safe.


This whole time I have been running the reefmat only as Im not sure my skimmer is working right, but that's another discussion. I have been feeding the Clown fish frozen Brine shrimp and he eats it. mostly...


due to the alert badge saying safe I added two small firefish gobys. beautiful fishies and I loved the tall fin that popped up off their backs! :) they liked to come to the front of the tank and watch me as I messed with the tank and sump. after a week I wok up to one of them dead on teh bottom of the tank. when I fed them the night before they both were active and fine. Ate well. then boom. one gone. The other fire fish was still acting fine, watching me, swimming around and ate that night, but I never saw him again. Havent even found the body.

tested water again, ammonia still at safe range on badge, PH around 7.8, salinity still at 1.02, temp at 78. Wife didn't realize I was concerned and she bought two blue and yellow Azure Damsels that she thought were pretty to surprise me with. they were introduced on Saturday, ate well that night, then in the morning one was dead. I went to take off my long sleeve shirt (had just got home from church) and by the time I got back to the tank his body had floated away and I haven't found it. the second damsel died that afternoon and was promptly removed.


But the CLOWNFISH LIVES!! although he has stopped eating for the last two days... I honestly don't know what to do at this point. I wont put anything else in this tank until I know it has a good chance of surviving... LFS says all their stock are quarantined and don't need to be again... But at this point I'm not sure. Thinking about changing the clowns name to Marcus Luttrell.....

I have done 10 gallon water changes each weekend, and plan on doing a large 30-50 gallon tonight. Ive noticed in the last few days that I am starting to get a light coating of brownish algae growth on my rocks and back of the sand bed. I thought this might mean my tank is starting the ulgy phase, but Im not sure now...

What should I test for? what should I do next? Im totally at a loss, and the LFS guru has bacically told me that everything Ive done is right and my tank should be good to go...
 
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Jekyl

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Welcome to R2R!

Can you please include some white light pics and a 20 second video?

As far as the LFS doing quarantine, I'm skeptical to say the least. Most just keep low levels of copper or slight hyposalinity to trick the customers, not treat the issues.
 

Uncle99

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new to saltwater, but had fresh water for 20 plus years. realizing I really dont know to much about this.... lol This is a long post as im trying to say everything that has happened and been done to this tank so you can hopefully help and tell me where I went wrong and how to fix it.

Bought a 75 gallon tank from a guy with Current USA orbit marine lights, Reef Octo classic 150 int skimmer, 30 ish gallon sump. added a reefmat 500 and a Jaebao return pump. also have two Jaebao MOW-8 powerheads. 70 pounds or so of rock, and fiji pink sand to a depth of 1 inch. Hygger heater that is maintaining 78.5 in the DT.

I know this next part is a bad thing and I apologize to the fish gods for it...

bought premixed water from the LFS, which is the same water they use in their tanks in the shop. added a bottle of Fritz Turbo 900 and added a Clown fish. I wont get into the discussions from the little kids that just HAD TO HAVE NEMO rather than an empty tank... I tested with an API kit and saw ammonia get up to .08 ish. But the little clown seemed to be ok. loved to hide in the rocks but wasnt breathing heavy or scraping or anything. Lots of reading on here about API kits not being accurate so I bought a Hanna checker. then realized that in order to use it you have to have the PH reading and temp and then do some math. Bought a decent PH tester and did the math. Ammonia was at .05. next day tested again ammonia was lower. Clown still doing fine and the kids have named him Dreamsicle after their favorite popsicles.


Started hearing about the salifert test kits so I bought that to compare to the Hanna as well as bought one of the SeaChem ammonia alert badges to hang in the sump. salifert read the same as the hanna, while the API started reading higher. i stopped using the API... Seachem badge turned green, for alert at first. kept checking everything and the ammonia dropped to .02 and the seachem badge turned yellow saying safe.


This whole time I have been running the reefmat only as Im not sure my skimmer is working right, but that's another discussion. I have been feeding the Clown fish frozen Brine shrimp and he eats it. mostly...


due to the alert badge saying safe I added two small firefish gobys. beautiful fishies and I loved the tall fin that popped up off their backs! :) they liked to come to the front of the tank and watch me as I messed with the tank and sump. after a week I wok up to one of them dead on teh bottom of the tank. when I fed them the night before they both were active and fine. Ate well. then boom. one gone. The other fire fish was still acting fine, watching me, swimming around and ate that night, but I never saw him again. Havent even found the body.

tested water again, ammonia still at safe range on badge, PH around 7.8, salinity still at 1.02, temp at 78. Wife didn't realize I was concerned and she bought two blue and yellow Azure Damsels that she thought were pretty to surprise me with. they were introduced on saturday, ate well that night, then in the morning one was dead. I went to take off my long sleve shirt (had just got home from church) and by the time I got back to the tank his body had floated away and I havent found it. the second damsel died that afternoon.


But the CLOWNFISH LIVES!! although he has stopped eating... I honestly dont know what to do at this point. I wont put anything else in this tank until I know it has a good chance of surviving... LFS says all their stock are quarantined and dont need to be again... But at this point Im not sure. Thinking about changing hte clowns name to Marcus Luttrell.....

I have done 10 gallon water changes each weekend, and plan on doing a large 30-50 gallon tonight. Ive noticed in the last few days that I am starting to get a light coating of brownish algae growth on my rocks and back of the sand bed. I thought this might mean my tank is starting the ulgy phase, but Im not sure now...

What should I test for? what should I do next? Im totally at a loss, and the LFS guru has bacically told me that everything Ive done is right and my tank should be good to go...

Welcome to R2R!

If you had an constant ammonia problem, the clownfish would be dead.

You say the clownfish is now not eating. That’s a immediate problem that needs to be addressed now.

Two sets of fish dying and now a fish stopping eating makes me think parasite, maybe ick which is common, or velvet which is a fast killer.

Other than not eating, is that clown doing anything like being lethargic, swimming into current, scratching or rubbing, any white/greyish dots?

Is there anything else in the tank except the clown, like corals or other inverts?
 
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everpresentnoob

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here is a pic of the tank. Ill have to get a video tonight...
 

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everpresentnoob

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The clown is acting like he always has. finds a cave in teh rocks to hide in, moves cave to cave, or sometimes likes to hang out at the top of the tank by the return wier. No spots on him, fins arent tucked against his body. No scratching or banging into things. when I feed i use a turkey baster, thaw a partial cube of frozen brine shrimp in a little bit of tank water then cut the powerheads and return pump, let the tank settle and gently squeeze the baster bulb to squirt food in. He will swim into the cloud of stuff, but the last two days hasn't eaten any. He has always been rather skittish since going into my tank.

And no, he is the only thing in the tank other than water, rock and sand.
 
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MnFish1

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new to saltwater, but had fresh water for 20 plus years. realizing I really dont know to much about this.... lol This is a long post as im trying to say everything that has happened and been done to this tank so you can hopefully help and tell me where I went wrong and how to fix it.

Bought a 75 gallon tank from a guy with Current USA orbit marine lights, Reef Octo classic 150 int skimmer, 30 ish gallon sump. added a reefmat 500 and a Jaebao return pump. also have two Jaebao MOW-8 powerheads. 70 pounds or so of rock, and fiji pink sand to a depth of 1 inch. Hygger heater that is maintaining 78.5 in the DT.

I know this next part is a bad thing and I apologize to the fish gods for it...

bought premixed water from the LFS, which is the same water they use in their tanks in the shop. added a bottle of Fritz Turbo 900 and added a Clown fish. I wont get into the discussions from the little kids that just HAD TO HAVE NEMO rather than an empty tank... I tested with an API kit and saw ammonia get up to .08 ish. But the little clown seemed to be ok. loved to hide in the rocks but wasnt breathing heavy or scraping or anything. Lots of reading on here about API kits not being accurate so I bought a Hanna checker. then realized that in order to use it you have to have the PH reading and temp and then do some math. Bought a decent PH tester and did the math. Ammonia was at .05. next day tested again ammonia was lower. Clown still doing fine and the kids have named him Dreamsicle after their favorite popsicles.


Started hearing about the salifert test kits so I bought that to compare to the Hanna as well as bought one of the SeaChem ammonia alert badges to hang in the sump. salifert read the same as the hanna, while the API started reading higher. i stopped using the API... Seachem badge turned green, for alert at first. kept checking everything and the ammonia dropped to .02 and the seachem badge turned yellow saying safe.


This whole time I have been running the reefmat only as Im not sure my skimmer is working right, but that's another discussion. I have been feeding the Clown fish frozen Brine shrimp and he eats it. mostly...


due to the alert badge saying safe I added two small firefish gobys. beautiful fishies and I loved the tall fin that popped up off their backs! :) they liked to come to the front of the tank and watch me as I messed with the tank and sump. after a week I wok up to one of them dead on teh bottom of the tank. when I fed them the night before they both were active and fine. Ate well. then boom. one gone. The other fire fish was still acting fine, watching me, swimming around and ate that night, but I never saw him again. Havent even found the body.

tested water again, ammonia still at safe range on badge, PH around 7.8, salinity still at 1.02, temp at 78. Wife didn't realize I was concerned and she bought two blue and yellow Azure Damsels that she thought were pretty to surprise me with. they were introduced on Saturday, ate well that night, then in the morning one was dead. I went to take off my long sleeve shirt (had just got home from church) and by the time I got back to the tank his body had floated away and I haven't found it. the second damsel died that afternoon and was promptly removed.


But the CLOWNFISH LIVES!! although he has stopped eating for the last two days... I honestly don't know what to do at this point. I wont put anything else in this tank until I know it has a good chance of surviving... LFS says all their stock are quarantined and don't need to be again... But at this point I'm not sure. Thinking about changing the clowns name to Marcus Luttrell.....

I have done 10 gallon water changes each weekend, and plan on doing a large 30-50 gallon tonight. Ive noticed in the last few days that I am starting to get a light coating of brownish algae growth on my rocks and back of the sand bed. I thought this might mean my tank is starting the ulgy phase, but Im not sure now...

What should I test for? what should I do next? Im totally at a loss, and the LFS guru has bacically told me that everything Ive done is right and my tank should be good to go...
SO - just to make a quick comment - with an API test there is no way to measure 0.08 Ammonia level. The lowest level is 0.25 - so this may be a case of incorrectly reading your API test. FWIW - according to the directions for that ammonia test is if the reading falls between two colors, you don't guesstimate a number, instead the result of the test is the color that most closely matches - so - that would effectively mean that your ammonia by the API kit was actually 0.
 
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everpresentnoob

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So I just looked online at the color chart for the API kit... Im thinking I totally mispoke earlier. with the API test the vial turned green. so around 2.0, Maybe a touch darker... when i got the hanna checker its first test read .09, then .08 then .06 and .02... Meanwhile every time I tested with the Hanna I also tested with API and it continuously gave the same green to dark green results, around 2.0.

Does that make any more sense? thankfully the calculator on my phone saves the history when I use it so I can go back and see what the results were from doing the math on the hanna checker....
 

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Hi, welcome to R2R

Is your salinity exactly 1.02? How did you measure it (refractometer/hydrometer/hanna)? Seems a little low usually needs to be 1.023-1.026, also how are you acclimating the new fish?
 
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everpresentnoob

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I just double checked my tank Salinity. it is 1.02 or 1.021. Kinda hard to read those little lines...

I'm currently mixing a batch of saltwater to do a water change. using Red Sea Coral pro. my new batch is 1.027 or so. ill add it into the sump so that it gets disbursed via the return pump and bump up the power on my powerheads. Currently they are running at about 20% strength.

I've been trying all evening during breaks from hanging new ceiling fans to get a picture of my lone survivor clown fish, but he is hiding on the bottom rear of the rocks. I can see him moving through a small crack.

one odd thought i had, perhaps he just doesn't like brine shrimp for what ever reason. if there was a dead firefish goby or azure damsel back there, would he nibble on it? Because somewhere in the tank are those fish that i cant find. I thought very briefly today about getting some sort of clean up guy from the LFS tonight to hopefully find and dispose of those missing bodies, but opted to not put anything more in here until i know what's going on...
 
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everpresentnoob

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here is a pic of the SeaChem alert badge... Says the tank is fine as far as ammonia... Although i kow there are plenty of other things to look at than just this.
 

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MnFish1

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So I just looked online at the color chart for the API kit... Im thinking I totally mispoke earlier. with the API test the vial turned green. so around 2.0, Maybe a touch darker... when i got the hanna checker its first test read .09, then .08 then .06 and .02... Meanwhile every time I tested with the Hanna I also tested with API and it continuously gave the same green to dark green results, around 2.0.

Does that make any more sense? thankfully the calculator on my phone saves the history when I use it so I can go back and see what the results were from doing the math on the hanna checker....
No - not really - however, if the hanna checker is going down - that makes more sense than continually giving you total ammonia near 2. It would be interesting to troubleshoot why it seems like your API test is not reading correctly - but - in any case - when 2 tests do not match - IMHO, the solution is taking a 3rd test.
 
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everpresentnoob

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did a 10 gallon water change and raised the tank salinity to 1.022. i don't want to make a drastic change quickly. My poor little clown didn't come out from under his rock to even look at the food....
 

brandon429

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Hey can you do me a favor pls since you have three ammonia tests

I can use your thread big time in other examples for sure

Can you post in clear light a recent api ammonia test, and the Hanna one/let’s see the actual display reading and the actual color vial for api compared to that seachem disk above

That triple pic is big time helpful in cycle analysis threads
 

littlefoxx

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I used to use the ammonia badge but it isnt the best in catching shifts, just really large swings. But sounds like you have other tests and are checking those so that makes sense. How big is the little clown? Also damsels tend to be really aggressive, especially to other damsels. So they might have attacked each other. Firefish too if they were the same sex. But I dont think thats a huge issue, but could have been possible. I do think something else is going on with the water or illness possibly! Whats your pH at, nitrate and nitrite levels?
 
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everpresentnoob

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Just ran all the tests.

tank temp is 78
Salinity is 1.022 via refractometer

PH is 7.78 this is a vivo sun hand held wand

Ammonia
API= .25
Salifert = .15 or .25 My old eyes have a hard time with the really light colors
Hannna = .015 (readout is .43 so the math is .43 x (3.7/100)
no change on the SeaChem badge from the earlier pic. Still showing yellow = safe.

I will say, it has been a few days since I tested this, and this is the lightest I have seen any of the tests...

Nitrite = 20ppm via API

Nitrate = 2ppm via API


this is about three hours after I did a 10 gallon water change. Display tank holds 70 and my sump has 20. So somewhere around an 11% water change. fresh water was from my RO/DI system, then mixed with Red Sea Coral Pro salt.
 

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everpresentnoob

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I used to use the ammonia badge but it isnt the best in catching shifts, just really large swings. But sounds like you have other tests and are checking those so that makes sense. How big is the little clown? Also damsels tend to be really aggressive, especially to other damsels. So they might have attacked each other. Firefish too if they were the same sex. But I dont think thats a huge issue, but could have been possible. I do think something else is going on with the water or illness possibly! Whats your pH at, nitrate and nitrite levels?

The clown is little more than an inch. not to big. when had the damsels and the firefish they were not aggressive at all with each other. no nipping or chasing at all. Seemed rather friendly.
 

littlefoxx

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The clown is little more than an inch. not to big. when had the damsels and the firefish they were not aggressive at all with each other. no nipping or chasing at all. Seemed rather friendly.
Lots of times the fish are not aggressive when you are watching the tank… yes they know. One big thing I learned in saltwater fish was they are way smarter and have more personality than freshwater!
 

Jekyl

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Can we have a pic of the tank also?
 

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