ID Please - Clownfish

LBA · Mar 6, 2024

In all my years in the aquarium world, I've never struggled with fish disease like I am right now. I'm in unfamiliar territory right now.

My display tank has what I believe is a bad case of Ich. It's been coming and going over weeks. I thought it was reducing but came back with a vengeance. Took out a tang that was doing well overnight.

I've struggled with the decision, but tearing the tank apart to catch fish isn't something I want to do.

I tried a 15 day round of PolypLab Medic. Didn't work for me.

Currently going through Ruby Reef - Rally Pro / Kick Ich treatment. Day 3.

The clowns I was able to catch yesterday and setup a quarantine tank. Currently treating with Ich-X and Prazipro (together). Today the clown looks far worse and to me doesn't look like ich now.

I need real help at this point, please. Any ideas what this is and proper course of action.

Jay Hemdal · Mar 6, 2024

LBA said:
In all my years in the aquarium world, I've never struggled with fish disease like I am right now. I'm in unfamiliar territory right now.

My display tank has what I believe is a bad case of Ich. It's been coming and going over weeks. I thought it was reducing but came back with a vengeance. Took out a tang that was doing well overnight.

I've struggled with the decision, but tearing the tank apart to catch fish isn't something I want to do.

I tried a 15 day round of PolypLab Medic. Didn't work for me.

Currently going through Ruby Reef - Rally Pro / Kick Ich treatment. Day 3.

The clowns I was able to catch yesterday and setup a quarantine tank. Currently treating with Ich-X and Prazipro (together). Today the clown looks far worse and to me doesn't look like ich now.

I need real help at this point, please. Any ideas what this is and proper course of action.

The first step is to try and get an accurate diagnosis on the problem. From the picture, the clown looks more like it has Brooklynella. However, fish that have had ich for long term, will look less spotty and more mucosy like this.

Are you seeing rapid breathing in the fish?
Is this clownfish still eating?
Can you post a video of it?

Jay

LBA · Mar 6, 2024

Thank you for taking my case, Jay.

The clowns were the last to show issue with this ich (i think) outbreak in my tank. Unless they have something else going on in addition to ich.

I noticed it yesterday morning and caught them. Immediately went and bought a quarantine tank and set it up and treated. We're at about 21 hours into ich-x treatment.

This morning it looked much worse. And the breathing is heavier. (The tang also died with really heavy breathing).

I did a 30% water change matching PH, Salinity and temperature. Did another dose of the ich-x and a dose of prazipro. I feel like I'm panic treating at the moment. Because I just don't know. Which I don't like.

Is this video helpful? I can try again if not.

Jay Hemdal said:
The first step is to try and get an accurate diagnosis on the problem. From the picture, the clown looks more like it has Brooklynella. However, fish that have had ich for long term, will look less spotty and more mucosy like this.

Are you seeing rapid breathing in the fish?
Is this clownfish still eating?
Can you post a video of it?

Jay

Jay Hemdal · Mar 6, 2024

LBA said:
Thank you for taking my case, Jay.

The clowns were the last to show issue with this ich (i think) outbreak in my tank. Unless they have something else going on in addition to ich.

I noticed it yesterday morning and caught them. Immediately went and bought a quarantine tank and set it up and treated. We're at about 21 hours into ich-x treatment.

This morning it looked much worse. And the breathing is heavier.

I did a 30% water change matching PH, Salinity and temperature. Did another dose of the ich-x and a dose of prazipro. I feel like I'm panic treating at the moment. Because I just don't know. Which I don't like.

Is this video helpful? I can try again if not.

It looks like you may have multiple issues here. I can see distinct ich spots in the video, but the fish is breathing faster than a simple ich infection would cause.
Ich-X is malachite green and formalin. It does not work well for marine ich.
The water seems yellowish in the video, any idea why?

Jay

LBA · Mar 6, 2024

Jay Hemdal said:
It looks like you may have multiple issues here. I can see distinct ich spots in the video, but the fish is breathing faster than a simple ich infection would cause.
Ich-X is malachite green and formalin. It does not work well for marine ich.
The water seems yellowish in the video, any idea why?

Jay

It could be the yellow light and also left over from the Rally Pro that turned the display tank green. About half of the water came from a acclimating the fish from that display tank.

LBA · Mar 6, 2024

I have copper power arriving in the mail today. Would you recommend stopping the current treatments and ramping up a copper treatment? Thank you.

Jay Hemdal · Mar 6, 2024

LBA said:
It could be the yellow light and also left over from the Rally Pro that turned the display tank green. About half of the water came from an acclimating the fish from that display tank.

Yep - that would be the acriflavine in the rally pro.

O.k., then the next step is to decide if you want to stay the course with the ich-x or change the treatment up? It takes up to 3 days for an anti protozoan medication to work. Ich-x should help against brooklynella, just not ich. Copper works for ich and velvet, but not brooklynella.

Jay

Jay Hemdal · Mar 6, 2024

LBA said:
I have copper power arriving in the mail today. Would you recommend stopping the current treatments and ramping up a copper treatment? Thank you.

Yes, that’s the question - you can’t use copper and ich-x at the same time. I don’t have a good answer for you as to which direction to go. My gut would say copper….

LBA · Mar 6, 2024

Does the combination of Prazipro help us here?

Jay Hemdal · Mar 6, 2024

LBA said:
Does the combination of Prazipro help us here?

No - I don’t see using Prazipro in this case, it is unlikely to be flukes.

LBA · Mar 6, 2024

At the moment my store was sold out of a copper treatment and I am using what they had. If the fish lasts. I'll try and change up to a copper treatment when it arrives.

Thank you for sharing your knowledge

LBA · Mar 6, 2024

Fish declined super fast. It's gone.

vetteguy53081 · Mar 6, 2024

LBA said:
Thank you for taking my case, Jay.

The clowns were the last to show issue with this ich (i think) outbreak in my tank. Unless they have something else going on in addition to ich.

I noticed it yesterday morning and caught them. Immediately went and bought a quarantine tank and set it up and treated. We're at about 21 hours into ich-x treatment.

This morning it looked much worse. And the breathing is heavier. (The tang also died with really heavy breathing).

I did a 30% water change matching PH, Salinity and temperature. Did another dose of the ich-x and a dose of prazipro. I feel like I'm panic treating at the moment. Because I just don't know. Which I don't like.

Is this video helpful? I can try again if not.

I dont need to add anything to Jay's comments as he has a handle on this but agree fish seems to have ich and also brook especially based on swimming pattern and hanging at surface

LBA · Mar 6, 2024

Which is deadlier ich or brook? As I have his mate in quarantine that still needs to be treated. I will need to choose a course or action.

LBA · Mar 6, 2024

For anyone interested in following along in the future, or for anyone to chime in.

The first clown passed shortly after this thread. Attributing it to Brooklynella + ich which is also what I think killed my tang.

To be frank, the tang looked more powder coated, like it had velvet too but I can't confirm that diagnosis.

No idea how my tank had such parasite activity so fast. I keep an OCD tank.

The second clown in quarantine definitely had ich like spots this morning. Not sure about Brooklynella but I'm treating as if it has both.

90 minute Rally PRO bath. My understanding is that the Formalin in Rally will treat the Brooklynella. Im mixing 1.5 ML to 1 gallon new saltwater. Temperature, Salinity and PH match. Aerated, water movement and heater.

Quarantine tank currently has ich-x and remains of a previous Rally PRO treatment, by the label. Will probably continue for 1 more day and then change out the water and start Copper Power.

Any thoughts are welcome.