How to controll phosphates and nitrates

[Dalton Hunter]

So I currently have a 100 gallon mixed reef aquarium, and I am having a big problem keeping phosphates and nitrates down. I am currently running 1 bag of phosguard with 3 bags of fluval phosphate remover and still can not get the levels down even with water changes.

Before 25 gallon water change:
Nitrates 120
Ph 7.8
Amonia 0
Nitrites 0.2
Kh 11
Calcium 540
Phos 10
Salinity 1.030
Temp 82

After 25 gallon water change:
Nitrates 80
Ph 8.0
Amonia 0
Nitrites 0.1
Kh 13
Calcium 580
Phos 5
Salinity 1.030
Temp 82

The salt I am using is Redsea Coral Pro Salt

Skimmer is running fine. Have it running slow so thick skimate is produced rather than just dumping out a bunch of water every day.

Current bio-load factors:
Extremely large snowflake eel (when I say large, this thing eats 8 silver sides a day)
sapphire clown
platinum clown
fuzzy dwarf
5 damsels
melanurus wrasse
Target mandarin goby
Powder brown tang
Foxface
horseshoe crab

 

[Dalton Hunter]

This problem has been an issue since before most of the fish were added, just FYI.

 

[sc50964]

So I currently have a 100 gallon mixed reef aquarium, and I am having a big problem keeping phosphates and nitrates down. I am currently running 1 bag of phosguard with 3 bags of fluval phosphate remover and still can not get the levels down even with water changes.

Before 25 gallon water change:
Nitrates 120
Ph 7.8
Amonia 0
Nitrites 0.2
Kh 11
Calcium 540
Phos 10
Salinity 1.030
Temp 82

After 25 gallon water change:
Nitrates 80
Ph 8.0
Amonia 0
Nitrites 0.1
Kh 13
Calcium 580
Phos 5
Salinity 1.030
Temp 82

The salt I am using is Redsea Coral Pro Salt

Skimmer is running fine. Have it running slow so thick skimate is produced rather than just dumping out a bunch of water every day.

Current bio-load factors:
Extremely large snowflake eel (when I say large, this thing eats 8 silver sides a day)
sapphire clown
platinum clown
fuzzy dwarf
5 damsels
melanurus wrasse
Target mandarin goby
Powder brown tang
Foxface
horseshoe crab

Must be the rocks and substrate that has stored up a lot of the phosphate. Unless you have the patience to keep up with the WC and cleaning, it may be quicker to consider changing them out. You also don't want a sudden change if your corals have been at these levels for long.

 

[reeferfoxx]

How old is the tank?
Will coral be added?
How much rock(weight) is in the tank?
How quickly were fish added?

 

[terri_ann]

Oh my Dalton. Lots of questions come to me. How long has your tank been running? How much live rock are you using - any and approximately how many pounds? Do you have a sand bed- how deep? What does your maintenance routine entail? Are you using RO or RO-DI water? Are you replacing the evaporated water with RO or RO-DI water only ( not using SW)? Do you run a sump or a canister filter or power filter?

The water parameters are way off. The salinity is too high, as is the Alkalinity, Calcium and probably the Magnesium. Lower your salinity to 1.023, 1.024 or 1.025. If possible, use a salt mix that has lower Alk and calcium.

Has anything died recently? Are you having any algae, cyano or other problems? What amount of flow do you have?

The tank's nitrification cycle cannot handle the bioload. Too many inhabitants, overfeeding and other factors are at play. Please be prepared to work diligently, in a controlled manner and be prepared for emergencies. Hopefully you will manage it successfully and then keep everything in balance. Good luck! Others can help you as well.

 

[Dalton Hunter]

How old is the tank?
Will coral be added?
How much rock(weight) is in the tank?
How quickly were fish added?

2 years old
at least 60 lbs of live rock
fish were added over the course of the past year.

Oh my Dalton. Lots of questions come to me. How long has your tank been running? How much live rock are you using - any and approximately how many pounds? Do you have a sand bed- how deep? What does your maintenance routine entail? Are you using RO or RO-DI water? Are you replacing the evaporated water with RO or RO-DI water only ( not using SW)? Do you run a sump or a canister filter or power filter?

The water parameters are way off. The salinity is too high, as is the Alkalinity, Calcium and probably the Magnesium. Lower your salinity to 1.023, 1.024 or 1.025. If possible, use a salt mix that has lower Alk and calcium.

Has anything died recently? Are you having any algae, cyano or other problems? What amount of flow do you have?

The tank's nitrification cycle cannot handle the bioload. Too many inhabitants, overfeeding and other factors are at play. Please be prepared to work diligently, in a controlled manner and be prepared for emergencies. Hopefully you will manage it successfully and then keep everything in balance. Good luck! Others can help you as well.

2 years old
at least 60 lbs of live rock
approx. 2 inch deep sand bed
I was using RODI water and still had the same problem. Started using well water straight from the aquifer (we live in the middle of BFE) and the problem hasn't escalated, just persisted as it did with RODI. I quit using RODI because the nearest place that sold it was 45 min away. Im going to be switching back since my neighbor just got an RODI unit. (I have tested the well water and it has 0 phos, 0 nitrates, 0 nitrites, and 0 ammonia.

Maintenance - 25 gallon water change every two weeks with fresh water top offs as needed. Only thing I add to the tank is 4 drops of lugol's iodine every week.

Currently I have a sump with a fuge. the water goes through two sock filters from the tank then to the skimmer which then passes to the fuge which has live rock, live sand, and chaeto with very slow flow and 3 LED for lighting. water flows through bio balls and a filter pad before moving to return pump.

I have not had anything die since the tank has been up except 1 hippo tang about two weeks ago, but that's to be expected.

I am having bad brown algae problems on the glass. I had a outbreak of red slime when the tank first started but the fox face nipped that in the bud.


EDIT: ADD FILE FISH TO BIO LOAD CONTRIBUTERS

 

[Dalton Hunter]

2 years old
at least 60 lbs of live rock
fish were added over the course of the past year.



2 years old
at least 60 lbs of live rock
approx. 2 inch deep sand bed
I was using RODI water and still had the same problem. Started using well water straight from the aquifer (we live in the middle of BFE) and the problem hasn't escalated, just persisted as it did with RODI. I quit using RODI because the nearest place that sold it was 45 min away. Im going to be switching back since my neighbor just got an RODI unit. (I have tested the well water and it has 0 phos, 0 nitrates, 0 nitrites, and 0 ammonia.

Maintenance - 25 gallon water change every two weeks with fresh water top offs as needed. Only thing I add to the tank is 4 drops of lugol's iodine every week.

Currently I have a sump with a fuge. the water goes through two sock filters from the tank then to the skimmer which then passes to the fuge which has live rock, live sand, and chaeto with very slow flow and 3 LED for lighting. water flows through bio balls and a filter pad before moving to return pump.

I have not had anything die since the tank has been up except 1 hippo tang about two weeks ago, but that's to be expected.

I am having bad brown algae problems on the glass. I had a outbreak of red slime when the tank first started but the fox face nipped that in the bud.


EDIT: ADD FILE FISH TO BIO LOAD CONTRIBUTERS

Nothing in the tank looks sick, everything is growing extremely quickly (coral wise), fish are extremely active and have incredible personality. I got a piece of acan from a friend that was thought to be dead and over the past two months the thing is developing crazy vibrant colors. Nothing is looking sick or distressed so I don't know whats going on.

 

[bif24701]

Cheato and a very powerful LED grow light

 

[Dalton Hunter]

How old is the tank?
Will coral be added?
How much rock(weight) is in the tank?
How quickly were fish added?

I currently have a lot of different corals. If you would like a list of everything I will be more than happy to post it.

 

[Dalton Hunter]

Cheato and a very powerful LED grow light

I thought about getting mangroves and putting in the sump. I cant keep chaeto in the DT because the fox face will mow through it in a matter of minutes. That stuff is like crack for him and the powder brown both. I have a HUGE ball of it in the sump. It started out very small about a month ago and is now the size of a large dinner plate.

That is why I was so shocked by my parameters. Everything is doing so well for everything to be so off kilter.

 

[Dalton Hunter]

Must be the rocks and substrate that has stored up a lot of the phosphate. Unless you have the patience to keep up with the WC and cleaning, it may be quicker to consider changing them out. You also don't want a sudden change if your corals have been at these levels for long.

To expensive of a fix for someone in pre-med and nursing school ;Inpain;Inpain;Inpain

 

[Skynyrd Fish]

Harvest some cheato once in a while. Sounds like that giant snowflake pig eel is the culprit. That's a lot of fish waste. Although it sounds like your tank is doing great. The cheato should out compete the other stuff. I had massive problems then decided to make the fuge the best place to grow algae. That we'll water sounds good. Test it with a Tds meter.

 

[Dalton Hunter]

Harvest some cheato once in a while. Sounds like that giant snowflake pig eel is the culprit. That's a lot of fish waste. Although it sounds like your tank is doing great. The cheato should out compete the other stuff. I had massive problems then decided to make the fuge the best place to grow algae. That we'll water sounds good. Test it with a Tds meter.

Thanks man, Like I said, I was really surprised to see those values giving the way the tank is doing.

 

[terri_ann]

I understand the school however, your tank and the inhabitants will crash and die, just like the Tang did. The eel sounds way too much/big for the tank and 60 lbs of rock isn't enough for what the tank size is and inhabitants. Don't want to stir the pot but it is a disaster waiting to happen to everything unless changes are made asap. IMO, the eel needs to go-1 year ago. Provide what is needed for the inhabitants, including the corals. If you cannot because of expense, time and just life, respect those inhabitants and sell/give them away to someone who can. You have a lifetime ahead of you and can always reef keep in the future...the inhabitants do not have the luxury in their current environment. I wish all the best...

 

[Cory]

What is your phosphate level?

Are you using ro/di to water or tap?

 

[Dalton Hunter]

I understand the school however, your tank and the inhabitants will crash and die, just like the Tang did. The eel sounds way too much/big for the tank and 60 lbs of rock isn't enough for what the tank size is and inhabitants. Don't want to stir the pot but it is a disaster waiting to happen to everything unless changes are made asap. IMO, the eel needs to go-1 year ago. Provide what is needed for the inhabitants, including the corals. If you cannot because of expense, time and just life, respect those inhabitants and sell/give them away to someone who can. You have a lifetime ahead of you and can always reef keep in the future...the inhabitants do not have the luxury in their current environment. I wish all the best...

I understand what your saying, and your not stirring the pot. I am open to all kinds of advice/criticism. I can add more live rock, I was talking about replacing all the rock with new live rock (at least that what I thought they meant by that). Buying more live rock isn't an issue. As far as the eel, I've been trying to sell him and had a couple of bites but they backed out so still looking for a new home for him.

 

[Dalton Hunter]

What is your phosphate level?

Are you using ro/di to water or tap?

Im using tap water that comes straight from the aquifer with no additives. My phos level was more than 10 to begin with but Ive finally gotten it to about 5. the phos level in my tap water is 0. However, Now that my neighbor has gotten a RO/DI unit I will be using RODI water.

 

[terri_ann]

Good that you understand. Several approaches can be taken Dalton. For the time being, try to relocate the eel, do the WC'S with a lower Alk & Ca salt mix. Go slow to not cause a big problem as everything will need to adjust. Do WC'S at least weekly though. Lots of factors and potential factors involved (well water can have pesticides, plumbing, ...too many to list) so go slow but try to get things done. If consistent, eel is gone, etc...you may not need to add rock right away(lower cost, going slower with stocking,etc) and if PO4 is bound to rock, an acid bath may be what the Dr orders[emoji6] Good luck!

 

[Cory]

Im using tap water that comes straight from the aquifer with no additives. My phos level was more than 10 to begin with but Ive finally gotten it to about 5. the phos level in my tap water is 0. However, Now that my neighbor has gotten a RO/DI unit I will be using RODI water.

The problem is tap water has minerals that algae use, even if po4 is low or zero.

As fsr as phosphate removers the only one ive seen kick algaes butt is rowaphos.

 

[Dalton Hunter]

Good that you understand. Several approaches can be taken Dalton. For the time being, try to relocate the eel, do the WC'S with a lower Alk & Ca salt mix. Go slow to not cause a big problem as everything will need to adjust. Do WC'S at least weekly though. Lots of factors and potential factors involved (well water can have pesticides, plumbing, ...too many to list) so go slow but try to get things done. If consistent, eel is gone, etc...you may not need to add rock right away(lower cost, going slower with stocking,etc) and if PO4 is bound to rock, an acid bath may be what the Dr orders[emoji6] Good luck!

Thank you so much! I will definitely keep you all posted on what happens! I am also looking into investing into a media reactor over the summer. I am also going to change my salt this week. The red sea says it doesn't have any phos in it. I just finished off the last little bit of this bucket so going to try and change it up a bit.