Help with my assasi trigger - is he sick?

McPuff

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I've got a strange situation with my assasi triggerfish and hoping someone might have a good suggestion. I've had him for 4 years and he's always been an aggressive feeder. Although he was thin when I first got him, he fattened up pretty quickly and has stayed that way. Just a couple weeks ago I noticed that he was not really eating much and seemed kind of "wobbly" in the water (kind of lethargic). This was a pretty rapid change, just a matter of days. He is still acting the same way but hasn't really lost much weight at all. He probably eats less now even when I throw in mysis. Raw shrimp usually gets most fish to eat and he does go after it. But he doesn't have that ferocity that the other trigger does. Just seems to weakly bite at the shrimp. Super strange for a trigger to show such disinterest in food of any type.

Is he blind? It kind of seems like his vision is lacking or he just doesn't react much to food or external stimuli. He still comes out when I'm in the room so I know he can see. The fact that he isn't just hiding all the time suggests that he's not sick or at least not seriously. His eyes do seem a little bulgy but I'm only comparing to the humu who is in the same tank. So I may be imagining this and triggers have bulgy eyes anyway. Regardless, it doesn't appear to be pop-eye and it hasn't changed in weeks. So probably nothing there.

Is it disease? The last time I added a new fish was over a year ago and that fish was fully QT'd (by me) so I don't think that disease or parasites are the cause of the odd behavior. I did do a freshwater dip two days ago just to rule out flukes. Oddly enough I was able to reach into the tank and pick up the trigger. It's not crazy to be able to touch or push the triggers normally because they are very curious. But it's another to be able to just pick one up and not have it go nuts. He was very calm. Anyway, there was NOTHING in the water after the dip. My LFS is equally stumped by the situation and now suggests doing a metronidazole QT for 2-3 weeks. It's easy enough to set up it up and this may be my next step.

Is he just old? As I stated earlier, I got the assasi 4 years ago and he was probably 3.5" at the time. That would suggest a relatively young fish but triggers don't grow super fast so who knows? For comparison, the humu was about 1" when I got him 5 years ago and is now ~4". Quick search shows a captive lifespan of 10-20 years so it's possible he's getting close to 10. Getting old doesn't really explain the relatively quick switch to intermittent fasting. This is usually more of a gradual process in my experience with other elderly reef fish and takes place over several months or a year.

Anyway, I'm stumped. He's a very cool fish and if you have triggers then you know they are just a blast to have in the reef. Hoping someone will have a good suggestion! Thanks!

FYI, I haven't included any pics because he looks totally normal. But I'll try to get one anyway just to share. :0)
 
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Here's a couple pics I just snapped.
assasi_trigger.jpg

assasi2.jpg
 

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Here's a couple pics I just snapped.
assasi_trigger.jpg

assasi2.jpg
This is either air embolism or eye injury based on one eye only
See if improvement in 24 hours or else treat in separate tank using Maracyn- not Maracyn oxy
 

Jay Hemdal

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Here's a couple pics I just snapped.
assasi_trigger.jpg

assasi2.jpg
Doesn’t sound like old age to me (but see below).

I don’t see any sign of damage/infection in the eyes, just bilateral exophthalmia, popeye. This can be a sign of mycobacterium infection (fish tuberculosis). This bacteria is found in every aquarium, but only causes symptoms in fish that have some lapse in their immunity - sometimes old age, other times there is no clear reason why the fish get this. There is no treatment. I can’t confirm it is this, but I can’t rule it out either.
 
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McPuff

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I think perhaps I have included a picture that makes the one eye look larger than the other. In reality both eyes are identical and neither has changed shape in the past two weeks. It is possible that both are slightly swollen but I don't have any good pics (or memory) to see what they looked like a month ago. As I stated earlier the fish looks to be in great health but it's behavior is just not normal. @HB AL have you ever seen any sudden behavior change like this?

p.s. I did feed them raw shrimp yesterday and the assasi went in pretty quick for a few bites. But still not the strong tear and suction you typically see from them. He didn't eat a lot but he did eat. The humu on the other hand...
 
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The past few days I've fed the fish LRS fish frenzy and the assasi has gone after it pretty good (by his latest standards). He's still not even close to 100% normal behavior though. I'm putting together a QT tank and he'll go in there for a couple weeks. Worst case is that he'll at least have no food competition. Best case is that his eyes get back to 100%.
 
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The assasi is now sitting in QT and seems to be doing just fine. He eats pretty well but still seems like his vision is not great. I feed him with tongs to make it easier on him and to keep mess to a minimum. Treating with metronidazole and will keep him in there for about 2.5 more weeks. At that time, I may actually put him into the DT instead of the lagoon. We'll see how he's doing.
 
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Somebody, anybody, Bueller?

The trigger is still eating small amounts of food every day but he must be pretty badly backed up/constipated. I'm honestly not sure if he's pooped since I put him in QT and likely for some time before that. He's very fat which doesn't make sense given the smaller amount of food he's been eating.

My guess is either constipation or some type of organ failure. Given the no poop situation on the bottom of the tank, I'm leaning way towards the former. But not sure how to actually fix this. Epsom salt-laced food? Brine shrimp? Nori hasn't seemed to help.

Hoping for some input here. Thanks!
 

Jay Hemdal

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Somebody, anybody, Bueller?

The trigger is still eating small amounts of food every day but he must be pretty badly backed up/constipated. I'm honestly not sure if he's pooped since I put him in QT and likely for some time before that. He's very fat which doesn't make sense given the smaller amount of food he's been eating.

My guess is either constipation or some type of organ failure. Given the no poop situation on the bottom of the tank, I'm leaning way towards the former. But not sure how to actually fix this. Epsom salt-laced food? Brine shrimp? Nori hasn't seemed to help.

Hoping for some input here. Thanks!

Sorry - I've got nothing. An intestinal blockage would be one guess, but you said this fish has been "fat" for quite some time, so that doesn't make sense. Organ failure causes ascites (fluid in the abdomen) or edema (fluid filling all tissues). I don't see edema here. Ascites is possible.....
 
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Sorry - I've got nothing. An intestinal blockage would be one guess, but you said this fish has been "fat" for quite some time, so that doesn't make sense. Organ failure causes ascites (fluid in the abdomen) or edema (fluid filling all tissues). I don't see edema here. Ascites is possible.....
Thanks Jay. It's puzzling for sure. LFS can't figure it out either. At this point I've ruled out internal and external parasites. The bulging eyes must be a symptom of whatever the root problem is. If there's a blockage I'm not sure how to help it pass (if it's even possible). If it's ascites, it seems like I'm already following the treatment protocol. If it's not that, I don't know what could be done. Just more watching and waiting? Should I just put him back into the display since the QT doesn't seem to be necessary?
 

Jay Hemdal

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Thanks Jay. It's puzzling for sure. LFS can't figure it out either. At this point I've ruled out internal and external parasites. The bulging eyes must be a symptom of whatever the root problem is. If there's a blockage I'm not sure how to help it pass (if it's even possible). If it's ascites, it seems like I'm already following the treatment protocol. If it's not that, I don't know what could be done. Just more watching and waiting? Should I just put him back into the display since the QT doesn't seem to be necessary?
I do think that at this point, the QT isn’t necessary, as long as it can still get food.
 
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McPuff

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2 days ago the trigger was still eating. Yesterday he seemed to be really different and wouldn't take food and seemed really sluggish. Today he was lying on his side and dead. :0( Whatever the problem, it was internal but I really don't feel like doing any sort of autopsy. Total bummer. At least the rest of the fish seem completely fine.
 

Jay Hemdal

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2 days ago the trigger was still eating. Yesterday he seemed to be really different and wouldn't take food and seemed really sluggish. Today he was lying on his side and dead. :0( Whatever the problem, it was internal but I really don't feel like doing any sort of autopsy. Total bummer. At least the rest of the fish seem completely fine.

Sorry to hear, I'm still not sure what was going on there.....
 

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