HELP ! Trouble keeping fish alive

[Formulator]

Just saw this after I posted. It’s not an oxygen problem.

Not sure we can rule that out… fish need significantly more oxygen than inverts.

 

[mrupprcut]

Welcome to R2R. What’s your ammonia level? Should be one of the first things to check with sudden fish death.
Do you have any inverts in the tank other than the shrimp? Are the inverts okay? If so it’s probably not oxygenation.
How were the fish behaving before they died? Were they gulping air at the surface, were they swimming erratically , rubbing on glass or rocks or the sand, were they eating well?
Do you make your own saltwater, RODI or tap water?

Do you have pics of them just before or just after death?
Skimmer in a 2 month old nano isn’t necessary unless is just serving as an air stone and air stones are cheaper.

Ammonia is zero but I have not checked since it cycled but been using one of those hanging in the tank test. the fish always seem to die over night and always ate the day before when I have seen them. Only one fish which was the oldest in the tank I witnessed right before and he seemed drunk almost like he was going at that moment but that lasted an hour. The last fish I removed seem to have like a slime that took some sand up with it in the fish net and that seemed odd.

 

[Fish Fan]

Not sure we can rule that out… fish need significantly more oxygen than inverts.

The OP posted a video of the surface of the tank, and sure, there *could* be more circulation, but the water is moving pretty swiftly. Personally, I don't think this is a low oxygen issue either.

Personally, I am leaning toward this tank is not yet cycled. I agree with whomever said please check for ammonia again.

Cycling your tank with Dr.Tim's alone doesn't do it. You need to also add a source of ammonia, which the OP may or may not have done. Again, just my $0.02 ;-)

 

[NanoNana]

Not sure we can rule that out… fish need significantly more oxygen than inverts.

There isn’t anything in the post to suggest O2 deficiency over disease. Especially not with the first clown lasting nearly 2 weeks after the first death and frequently adding clowns that have not been QT’d. If it were oxygen the first clown should have died in closer proximity to the second.

 

[Formulator]

The OP posted a video of the surface of the tank, and sure, there *could* be more circulation, but the water is moving pretty swiftly. Personally, I don't think this is a low oxygen issue either.

Personally, I am leaning toward this tank is not yet cycled. I agree with whomever said please check for ammonia again.

Cycling your tank with Dr.Tim's alone doesn't do it. You need to also add a source of ammonia, which the OP may or may not have done. Again, just my $0.02 ;-)

Cool. I couldn’t watch the video because I’m on my phone and they don’t play unless I’m on a computer.

Sounds like we can drop the oxygen as a hypothesis.

 

[Fish Fan]

Ammonia is zero but I have not checked since it cycled but been using one of those hanging in the tank test. the fish always seem to die over night and always ate the day before when I have seen them. Only one fish which was the oldest in the tank I witnessed right before and he seemed drunk almost like he was going at that moment but that lasted an hour. The last fish I removed seem to have like a slime that took some sand up with it in the fish net and that seemed odd.

I'm sorry, how are you testing for ammonia? Are you using one of those test strips you stick in the water and wait for it to change color?

And either way, let's back up just a bit. How did you start this tank? Live rock and sand, or dead rock and sand? You used Dr. Tim's One and Only, but did you provide a source for ammonia?

 

[NanoNana]

Heavy slime coating on the clown probably velvet. I’d let the tank fallow for at least 45 days before adding more fish.

 

[Miami Reef]

Sounds like brook is it’s clownfish that are dying, and they are looking slimy.

Brook is a very deadly fish disease that mainly kills clownfish.

 

[Formulator]

In case the OP hasn’t heard the term, fallow = no fish

 

[NanoNana]

Sounds like brook is it’s clownfish that are dying, and they are looking slimy.

Brook is a very deadly fish disease that mainly kills clownfish.

Agreed, brook or velvet hard to say without pics but for definite OP needs to fallow the tank.

 

[Fish Fan]

I didn't realize the OP reported obvious signs of disease, such as the heavy slime coat. I must have missed that.

 

[Miami Reef]

Brooklynella

Brooklynella hostilis (updated 6-9-2023) What You Need To Know: * This is most often seen with clownfish, but it can afflict other fish (usually in the gills) as well. When a clownfish has Brook, the skin will appear to be peeling or sloughing off. Which is actually excess white mucous coming...

humble.fish

 

[mrupprcut]

I'm sorry, how are you testing for ammonia? Are you using one of those test strips you stick in the water and wait for it to change color?

And either way, let's back up just a bit. How did you start this tank? Live rock and sand, or dead rock and sand? You used Dr. Tim's One and Only, but did you provide a source for ammonia?

I started the tank with Dr Tims ...live sand...dry rock and a clown fish for the ammonia. I tested using API testers till my ammonia was zero and my nitrite was zero and nitrates were present. This whole process took about a month. I tested for a week did a water change and tested again. This is at the time I added my second clown and it lasted about ten days or two weeks. I do not test for ammonia anymore but do use a seachem alert tag in the tank that is only a month old.

 

[Fish Fan]

I started the tank with Dr Tims ...live sand...dry rock and a clown fish for the ammonia. I tested using API testers till my ammonia was zero and my nitrite was zero and nitrates were present. This whole process took about a month. I tested for a week did a water change and tested again. This is at the time I added my second clown and it lasted about ten days or two weeks. I do not test for ammonia anymore but do use a seachem alert tag in the tank that is only a month old.

Thanks for your reply, sounds like you are on the right track as far as the tank being cycled. Because you are seeing some obvious signs of disease, something I previously missed in your posts, I'm now with others that think that this is a pathogen of some kind, most likely Brooklynella (sometimes called "Brook" or even "Clownfish Disease", since Clowns seem to be very susceptible to it) or possibly Velvet.

Arguably, and as others have said, the best course of action or treatment at this point is to allow the tank to remain fishless (fallow) for at least 45 days, and some would advise even longer. What this does is it starves out any fish parasites that might be in your system over this time. Although this requires some patience, it's effective and easier than trying to treat with any kind of chemical, in my opinion.

Then, after your fallow period (or during, if you time it right), you may want to look into quarantining any new fish you get so they don't reinfect your main system. You can also look into buying fish that have been previously QT'd and treated for disease from places like Dr. Reef, which seems popular here, but I have never used them. I QT my own fish (I QT everything "wet" that comes into my systems, including fish, coral, and inverts like snails, crabs, etc.) by following the R2R approved method of quarantining found at the link bellow. This may sound extreme, it's a lot of extra tanks, work, money, etc., but I believe it's the best way to avoid the issues you're seeing now.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/current-quarantine-protocol.825055/

As always, best of luck with your tank!

 

[NanoNana]

This is such a hard hit for your first tank and I’m sorry you’re having to go through this.
I’m also sorry to tell you that 13.5 gallons is a small tank. Some clowns are going to be too big for this system and will likely be very aggressive toward anything you add after the fact. If you really want a pair of clowns make sure you stick to clowns that will stay smaller and I honestly wouldnt add additional fish. Stress in a small tank is asking for disease issues.
There is an LFS that does full quarantine on all fish called Reef Chasers and they ship. They always have tons of clowns in stock if you absolutely can’t quarantine your own. Many vendors do 14 day QT which isn’t a full QT.

 

[vetteguy53081]

only fish inverts are ok

If inverts are doing good, it often rules out water leaving disease as a likelihood. We would need with the fish gone, known symptoms such as loss of appetite, sudden darting or flashing, elevated breathing, loss of appetite, loss of color, gasping at surface, lethargic behavioral