False API Ammonia result due to Coppersafe?

[sc50964]

My ammonia badge didn’t detect anything. It could be a bit old so I checked the QT water that has ~2.5ppm of coppersafe against an API ammonia test kit. The fish was a bit lethargic. The API kit showed 1ppm of ammonia. While I’m waiting for a new ammonia alert badge to arrive today, can someone tell me if this a false reading from API?

 

[twentyleagues]

I would retest and test a bit of new saltwater to see if test looks the same. I dont hate on api I think they are useful for some tests and got me through most of my previous reef life. But if not done 100% correct are easy to mess up and those colors are sometimes hard to read. I am not saying you messed up but if the dropper bottle allowed a smaller or larger drop of test solution, that type of thing.

 

[sc50964]

I would retest and test a bit of new saltwater to see if test looks the same. I dont hate on api I think they are useful for some tests and got me through most of my previous reef life. But if not done 100% correct are easy to mess up and those colors are sometimes hard to read. I am not saying you messed up but if the dropper bottle allowed a smaller or larger drop of test solution, that type of thing.

I did that too and it showed good results

 

[sc50964]

@Jay Hemdal ?

 

[vetteguy53081]

My ammonia badge didn’t detect anything. It could be a bit old so I checked the QT water that has ~2.5ppm of coppersafe against an API ammonia test kit. The fish was a bit lethargic. The API kit showed 1ppm of ammonia. While I’m waiting for a new ammonia alert badge to arrive today, can someone tell me if this a false reading from API?

designed also for freshwater, I have no confidence in the badge after two weeks and especially if exposed to medications. Hanna and Salifert is my confidence

 

[Garf]

My ammonia badge didn’t detect anything. It could be a bit old so I checked the QT water that has ~2.5ppm of coppersafe against an API ammonia test kit. The fish was a bit lethargic. The API kit showed 1ppm of ammonia. While I’m waiting for a new ammonia alert badge to arrive today, can someone tell me if this a false reading from API?

Yes, copper messes with all total ammonia tests, but not the alert badges.

 

[sc50964]

Yes, copper messes with in total ammonia tests, but not the alert badges.

how bad does it mess it up in your experience? Is it on the order of 0.1ppm or 1ppm?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

My ammonia badge didn’t detect anything. It could be a bit old so I checked the QT water that has ~2.5ppm of coppersafe against an API ammonia test kit. The fish was a bit lethargic. The API kit showed 1ppm of ammonia. While I’m waiting for a new ammonia alert badge to arrive today, can someone tell me if this a false reading from API?

About half of that ammonia reading is a false positive from the coppersafe, but anything above 0.5 ppm is from the tank itself. The API test is accurate, but tough to read visually.

 

[sc50964]

About half of that ammonia reading is a false positive from the coppersafe, but anything above 0.5 ppm is from the tank itself. The API test is accurate, but tough to read visually.

I already did a 100% WC and will continue to monitor. How long is too long for fish to be exposed to 0.5ppm of ammonia?

 

[MnFish1]

My ammonia badge didn’t detect anything. It could be a bit old so I checked the QT water that has ~2.5ppm of coppersafe against an API ammonia test kit. The fish was a bit lethargic. The API kit showed 1ppm of ammonia. While I’m waiting for a new ammonia alert badge to arrive today, can someone tell me if this a false reading from API?

first - the method API uses is very similar to what is used for other tests. The ammonia of 1 ppm should be fixed - whether false or not - by a water change - (large) - I don't know the type of fish - but it should not cause lethargy. A high PH would make the 1 ppm much more worrisome - a water change will fix it immediately

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I already did a 100% WC and will continue to monitor. How long is too long for fish to be exposed to 0.5ppm of ammonia?

That is dependent on the pH of the water. Ammonia is much more toxic at a high pH. There is also some variability between fish species. I generally aim for less than 0.25 ppm ammonia if the pH is above 8

 

[sc50964]

That is dependent on the pH of the water. Ammonia is much more toxic at a high pH. There is also some variability between fish species. I generally aim for less than 0.25 ppm ammonia if the pH is above 8

Thanks it’s a puffer and I know they are even more sensitive. I got a new ammonia alert badge and did a 100% WC. I’m using CP so I will dose Prime or do more WC if the badge is showing something or if he is lethargic again.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Thanks it’s a puffer and I know they are even more sensitive. I got a new ammonia alert badge and did a 100% WC. I’m using CP so I will dose Prime or do more WC if the badge is showing something or if he is lethargic again.

There is some controversy about using Prime for ammonia control. I know you cannot use Prime and Cupramine. There is no good reference though, if it can be used with copper power or not. I prefer to use Amquel.

 

[sc50964]

There is some controversy about using Prime for ammonia control. I know you cannot use Prime and Cupramine. There is no good reference though, if it can be used with copper power or not. I prefer to use Amquel.

I’m using Chloroquine phosphate. Does that change your suggestion of Amquel over Prime?

In the event if there is ammonia poisoning, is Methylene Blue the way to detoxify? Thx

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I’m using Chloroquine phosphate. Does that change your suggestion of Amquel over Prime?

In the event if there is ammonia poisoning, is Methylene Blue the way to detoxify? Thx

That’s a problem with using acronyms - both chloroquine and copper power are referred to as CP.

I’ve used Amquel to control ammonia that can result after dosing a tank with chloroquine.

Methylene blue doesn’t have any real benefit for acute ammonia toxicity. The best way to manage ammonia is through water changes, pH control or ammonia binders.

 

[sc50964]

That’s a problem with using acronyms - both chloroquine and copper power are referred to as CP.

I’ve used Amquel to control ammonia that can result after dosing a tank with chloroquine.

Methylene blue doesn’t have any real benefit for acute ammonia toxicity. The best way to manage ammonia is through water changes, pH control or ammonia binders.

Why do you prefer Amquel over Prime?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Why do you prefer Amquel over Prime?

It is just based on personal preference - I know the inventor of Amquel and I trust his knowledge. I've also used it since the 1970s. Prime has taken a lot of hits over what it can and cannot do. I can't say if all of these criticisms are valid, but there are a lot of posts here against using Prime.

Jay

 

[sc50964]

It is just based on personal preference - I know the inventor of Amquel and I trust his knowledge. I've also used it since the 1970s. Prime has taken a lot of hits over what it can and cannot do. I can't say if all of these criticisms are valid, but there are a lot of posts here against using Prime.

Jay

Hi Jay, how long will the Amquel be good for once it’s in the water? Prime is 24 to 48 hours. Wonder if it’s the same.

The bottle says that it will deplete oxygen. Is that something you have experienced too?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hi Jay, how long will the Amquel be good for once it’s in the water? Prime is 24 to 48 hours. Wonder if it’s the same.

The bottle says that it will deplete oxygen. Is that something you have experienced too?

My understanding is that once bound up with Amquel, the ammonia is eventually removed through regular biofiltration. I've never seen cases where it subsequently released toxic ammonia back into a tank.

The trouble with Amquel is that it binds with ammonia to render it less toxic, but some ammonia tests continue to read it as "total ammonia", which makes things difficult in that you then don't know how much of the ammonia is safely bound up, and how much of it new ammonia that is still free to harm the fish. I've also seen (but cannot 100% verify) that subsequent additions of Amquel have less and less benefit. This means you must resolve the reason for the high ammonia.

As far as the oxygen scavenging, I can't speak to that directly - but copious aeration is always called for. Amquel contains a formaldehyde derivative, and that chemical is known to reduce dissolved oxygen.

Toxicity of ammonia with fish is completely dependent on the pH of the water. When I have a marine fish system that has ammonia in it, I try to keep the pH below 8, more like 7.7 or so.

 

[waterthatmakeu]

About half of that ammonia reading is a false positive from the coppersafe, but anything above 0.5 ppm is from the tank itself. The API test is accurate, but tough to read visually.

if it show 1.0ppm what dose that mean