Dinoflagellates – Are You Tired Of Battling Altogether?

[crispyreef]

Hi all, could anyone help me with an ID?

Dinos 1

www.youtube.com

Dinos 2

www.youtube.com

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi all, could anyone help me with an ID?

Dinos 1

www.youtube.com

Dinos 2

www.youtube.com

Look like ostreo
Easy method:
Prepare by blowing this stuff loose with a turkey baster and siphon up loose particles. Turn lights off (at least white and run blue at 10-15% IF you have light dependant corals) for 5 days and at night dose 1ml of 3% hydrogen peroxide per 10 gallons for all 5 nights. If you dont have light dependent coral- turn all lights off. During the day dose 1ml of liquid bacteria (such as micro bacter 7 or XLM) per 10 gallons. Clean filters daily and DO NOT FEED CORAL FOODS OR ADD NOPOX

 

[crispyreef]

Look like ostreo
Easy method:
Prepare by blowing this stuff loose with a turkey baster and siphon up loose particles. Turn lights off (at least white and run blue at 10-15% IF you have light dependant corals) for 5 days and at night dose 1ml of 3% hydrogen peroxide per 10 gallons for all 5 nights. If you dont have light dependent coral- turn all lights off. During the day dose 1ml of liquid bacteria (such as micro bacter 7 or XLM) per 10 gallons. Clean filters daily and DO NOT FEED CORAL FOODS OR ADD NOPOX

Thank you!

 

[Denisk]

Can someone ID these for me? My glass walls are literally brown and have yet to see this kind of Dino. Maybe someone can help as I had a club member use a microscope on a sample for me.



some screenshots as well.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Can someone ID these for me? My glass walls are literally brown and have yet to see this kind of Dino. Maybe someone can help as I had a club member use a microscope on a sample for me.

images small but looks like amphidium

 

[Denisk]

images small but looks like amphidium

Yeah I added some screenshots but it was the best we could get

 

[Denisk]

Couple extra screenshots

 

[vetteguy53081]

images small but looks like amphidium

amphidium small cell.... yep

 

[hiphop]

Ok. here's a version of a Dino testing protocol for those without microscope. I think it may be more helpful than flying blind. There's two version: first is just good for telling if you have mostly cyano or not (more helpful than it sounds). 2nd is a modified paper towel test to filter out cyano and distinguish between diatoms and dinos by the regrouping tendency of dinos.



anyway...



Test 1: Peroxide Test - dinos/diatoms don't bubble.



Do you see brown/rust/red colored strings or mats that lessen overnight and strengthen during the day? bubbles during lights on? Odds are 99% it's cyano or dinos. Here's how you can tell if it's mostly cyano...



Suck up some material. I didn't have much to work with, left is cyano, right is a few dinos in debris.







left pic: samples, center pic: cyano, right pic: detritus with Large Cell Amphidinium Dinoflagellates hiding in it. Note how those strands could be interpreted as cyano or dino mucus. Let's find out which...



Add water until you have 100mL of sample, then add 5mL of common 3% hydrogen peroxide.



The cyano starts showing bubbles at 3mL or so, but by 5mL of H2O2 it should become really clear...







All cyano strands developed lots of bubbles. Even the tiny ones. Some start floating up.











No bubble production at the site of dinos. Right pic, the brown patches are dino clumps. Only one very tiny bubble in the center of the pic.











Should be really clear where you have significant cyano present and where you don't.







2nd Test in another post....

 

[Denisk]

amphidium small cell.... yep

Thank you very much. Only Uv is the fix for this one?

 

[vetteguy53081]

Thank you very much. Only Uv is the fix for this one?

No- this works:
Prepare by starting with a water change and blow this stuff loose with a turkey baster and siphon up loose particles. Turn lights off (at least white and run blue at 10-15% IF you have light dependant corals) for 5 days and at night dose 1ml of 3% hydrogen peroxide per 10 gallons for all 5 nights. If you dont have light dependent coral- turn all lights off. During the day dose 1ml of liquid bacteria (such as micro bacter 7 or XLM) per 10 gallons. Clean filters daily and DO NOT FEED CORAL FOODS OR ADD NOPOX

 

[Denisk]

No- this works:
Prepare by starting with a water change and blow this stuff loose with a turkey baster and siphon up loose particles. Turn lights off (at least white and run blue at 10-15% IF you have light dependant corals) for 5 days and at night dose 1ml of 3% hydrogen peroxide per 10 gallons for all 5 nights. If you dont have light dependent coral- turn all lights off. During the day dose 1ml of liquid bacteria (such as micro bacter 7 or XLM) per 10 gallons. Clean filters daily and DO NOT FEED CORAL FOODS OR ADD NOPOX

Ok got it. Do I have to use the liquid bacteria during the day? Can I skip that part or does it make a significant difference to either working or not? Only since I don’t know if I’ll find any in the area.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Ok got it. Do I have to use the liquid bacteria during the day? Can I skip that part or does it make a significant difference to either working or not? Only since I don’t know if I’ll find any in the area.

Bacteria during the day - yes as it competes with any bad bacteria

 

[DarkReefer]

Day 1- 5 kills the cells - I personally go another 5 days on bacteria during the day and I do .5ml per 10 gal of peroxide at night to assure the cells are all gone and as you ramp the lights back up any stray flagellates are addressed

So now finished day 5 of the .5ml per 10 gal.
Yesterday noticed some algae over the sandbed, possibly a little more than I've been seeing recently. Rockwork still looked alright though. Turned the sand over with the turkey baster.

Now that I've finished about 10 days of the h202 should I perform a water change or will I be asking for trouble ?

 

[Brad4Life]

I`m on my third bout with Dino's and Cyano. I have had everything go wrong with this tank since I started it in February last year. Ich, Dino's, Cyano, green hair algae, red turf algae, parameter swings. LFS services it twice a week except when I was battling Dino's. Even he is at a loss with this tank. It`s a WaterBox 220.6. I`m at my wits end with this tank. I've lost over 2K in fish and coral this past year alone. Upgraded from a 90-gallon canister filter system and never dealt with the issues I have had with this tank. I`m debating on nuking it and starting over or selling it.

Should I nuke it and start over or try to recover from this latest episode yet again? What would be your recovery recommendations?

Current parameters:
Nitrate .11
Phosphate - 0
Alkalinity - 8.6
Calcium - 542
PH - 8.2
Ammonia - .2
Magnesium - 1620

4 hydra 32's
2 MP40's
Skimmer
fleece roller
Pentair 40 watt UV sterilizer

 

[Brad4Life]

I`m on my third bout with Dino's and Cyano. I have had everything go wrong with this tank since I started it in February last year. Ich, Dino's, Cyano, green hair algae, red turf algae, parameter swings. LFS services it twice a week except when I was battling Dino's. Even he is at a loss with this tank. It`s a WaterBox 220.6. I`m at my wits end with this tank. I've lost over 2K in fish and coral this past year alone. Upgraded from a 90-gallon canister filter system and never dealt with the issues I have had with this tank. I`m debating on nuking it and starting over or selling it.

Should I nuke it and start over or try to recover from this latest episode yet again? What would be your recovery recommendations?

Current parameters:
Nitrate .11
Phosphate - 0
Alkalinity - 8.6
Calcium - 542
PH - 8.2
Ammonia - .2
Magnesium - 1620

4 hydra 32's
2 MP40's
Skimmer
fleece roller
Pentair 40 watt UV sterilizer

 

[DarkReefer]

I`m on my third bout with Dino's and Cyano. I have had everything go wrong with this tank since I started it in February last year. Ich, Dino's, Cyano, green hair algae, red turf algae, parameter swings. LFS services it twice a week except when I was battling Dino's. Even he is at a loss with this tank. It`s a WaterBox 220.6. I`m at my wits end with this tank. I've lost over 2K in fish and coral this past year alone. Upgraded from a 90-gallon canister filter system and never dealt with the issues I have had with this tank. I`m debating on nuking it and starting over or selling it.

Should I nuke it and start over or try to recover from this latest episode yet again? What would be your recovery recommendations?

Current parameters:
Nitrate .11
Phosphate - 0
Alkalinity - 8.6
Calcium - 542
PH - 8.2
Ammonia - .2
Magnesium - 1620

4 hydra 32's
2 MP40's
Skimmer
fleece roller
Pentair 40 watt UV sterilizer

I feel you. My tank has been terrible the past 6 months so I know where you're coming from. I'm hoping to upgrade my tank in the next 6 months to something like yours actually, but having to look at the dinos every day for months has put a dampener on things.

Looks like your Mag and calcium are high, are you dosing these? If so you may need to fine tune that.
Are you running any GFO to drop the phosphates?

Have you tried vetteguy's h202 method (he posted above for someone else)? After doing all sorts of things for months, this alone has helped clear everything in just a couple of weeks. For me it's not 100% gone yet after 10 days, but it's 1000 times better than it was when I started out. Rockwork is mostly clean (there's some kind of hair algae tufts here and there), and the sand is the whitest I've seen in months.
If you've not tried it perhaps give it a go and see what it can do for you. Maybe wait for him to check your photos to recommend it perhaps.

I think the trick is to try and make sure things stay stable once you've done the h202 method and come out of it slowly (I'm trying it myself now).
Good luck and hopefully we can all be more successful !

 

[vetteguy53081]

So now finished day 5 of the .5ml per 10 gal.
Yesterday noticed some algae over the sandbed, possibly a little more than I've been seeing recently. Rockwork still looked alright though. Turned the sand over with the turkey baster.

Now that I've finished about 10 days of the h202 should I perform a water change or will I be asking for trouble ?

Yes, yiou can change water and slow on the white light increase. If its green algae you see, not a problem as cleaner crew can tend to that

 

[vetteguy53081]

Good pics and it is Dino
Prepare by blowing this stuff loose with a turkey baster and siphon up loose particles.
Turn lights off (at least white and run blue at 10-15% IF you have light dependent corals) for 5 days and at night dose 1ml of 3% hydrogen peroxide per 10 gallons for all 5 nights. If you dont have light dependent coral- turn all lights off.
During the day dose 1ml of liquid bacteria (such as bacter 7 or XLM) per 10 gallons.
Clean filters daily and DO NOT FEED CORAL FOODS OR ADD NOPOX as it is food for dinos.
Day 5,, you can start with blue lights - ramping up and work your white lights up slowly

 

[ggNoRe]

I`m on my third bout with Dino's and Cyano. I have had everything go wrong with this tank since I started it in February last year. Ich, Dino's, Cyano, green hair algae, red turf algae, parameter swings. LFS services it twice a week except when I was battling Dino's. Even he is at a loss with this tank. It`s a WaterBox 220.6. I`m at my wits end with this tank. I've lost over 2K in fish and coral this past year alone. Upgraded from a 90-gallon canister filter system and never dealt with the issues I have had with this tank. I`m debating on nuking it and starting over or selling it.

Should I nuke it and start over or try to recover from this latest episode yet again? What would be your recovery recommendations?

Current parameters:
Nitrate .11
Phosphate - 0
Alkalinity - 8.6
Calcium - 542
PH - 8.2
Ammonia - .2
Magnesium - 1620

4 hydra 32's
2 MP40's
Skimmer
fleece roller
Pentair 40 watt UV sterilizer

Just chiming in for moral support. I'm in the exact same boat in many ways. 2 year system, 3rd round with dinos, 2 rounds with cyano, 2 rounds gha outbreak, 1 long hard battled round of turf algae, and a round of brooklynella. But I'm stubborn and I love my fish and the tank so keep fighting the good fight. I will say the Elegant Corals Dinoflagellates Regimen has been proven to work for the most difficult of cases which is what got me through the first round which was a very severe case of dinoflagellates. And this time thankfully I'm just battling dinos on the sand that I have been keeping in check. Also worth noting is Vetteguy's method is very similar to the aforementioned regimen.