Dinoflagellates – Are You Tired Of Battling Altogether?

bishoptf

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If your tank is new, most of that PO4 is getting bound to rocks and sand. The rest gets used up quickly by all the life in the tank.
Eh my tank is almost 2.5 years old and its a 29g nano, not a large tank and not a ton of rock...oh and its bare bottom, no sand. I have a small amount of sand in the sump for diversity but not a lot. So I do not think that explains it, if I dose I can keep it up but if I stop it goes to 0. I so have a bunch of ceramic rings in the sump and like I said some halimedia macro but just no idea whats soaking up the po4 and I think that may be part of my long standing issue.
 

ZombieEngineer

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Eh my tank is almost 2.5 years old and its a 29g nano, not a large tank and not a ton of rock...oh and its bare bottom, no sand. I have a small amount of sand in the sump for diversity but not a lot. So I do not think that explains it, if I dose I can keep it up but if I stop it goes to 0. I so have a bunch of ceramic rings in the sump and like I said some halimedia macro but just no idea whats soaking up the po4 and I think that may be part of my long standing issue.
Coral uses po4 too.
 

Aqua Man

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Eh my tank is almost 2.5 years old and its a 29g nano, not a large tank and not a ton of rock...oh and its bare bottom, no sand.
Still not surprised that you are limited on PO4. Rock stores a ton of PO4, so if a tank is limited, it takes awhile to fill up again. Same thing has happened to me and was shocked on how much I needed to dose to get my system on track.

Our tanks are similar too! Mine is a 20g, No sand and is 8 years old. I’ve dosed over 1000ml neophos over the last year!

My theory at this point is that I’m not adding PO4 all the time with food. So I add 1-2ml every few days to make sure PO4 is getting added. I was adding 6ml a day for months!
 

bishoptf

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Still not surprised that you are limited on PO4. Rock stores a ton of PO4, so if a tank is limited, it takes awhile to fill up again. Same thing has happened to me and was shocked on how much I needed to dose to get my system on track.

Our tanks are similar too! Mine is a 20g, No sand and is 8 years old. I’ve dosed over 1000ml neophos over the last year!

My theory at this point is that I’m not adding PO4 all the time with food. So I add 1-2ml every few days to make sure PO4 is getting added. I was adding 6ml a day for months!
No I get I've been dosing them for quite sometime, not so much nitrate any longer but even Nitrate I have to watch as it will come down over time, but po4 seems to go quicker. It's gotten much better but still if I let go for awhile it will trend back down, I also have some gha so I know I have it in the tank the gha seems to do just fine, lol. But its one rock and one patch, not enough to count for the reduction, but my tank is pretty odd.
 

bishoptf

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Given that I have a 29g +20g long sump what size UV should I go with to knock out the ostreo, been using a 25W Green Killing machine and its just not working. Aqua Ultraviolet has a 15w which should be enough but looking at the stainless Jebao 36w units which is serious overkill but just trying to find something that will actually kick them to the curb. Not heard to many good things about the Jebao plastic units but was thinking the stainless may be better long term. Just thought I would ask to see what folks have used.
 

ScottB

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Given that I have a 29g +20g long sump what size UV should I go with to knock out the ostreo, been using a 25W Green Killing machine and its just not working. Aqua Ultraviolet has a 15w which should be enough but looking at the stainless Jebao 36w units which is serious overkill but just trying to find something that will actually kick them to the curb. Not heard to many good things about the Jebao plastic units but was thinking the stainless may be better long term. Just thought I would ask to see what folks have used.
Over the years I have accumulated an Aqua UV 25, LifeGard 25, and Aqua UV 40. I prefer the Aqua UV brand. The GKM have a really bad reputation. They don't last, etc. I really think it comes down to the bulb quality.

Agree with the others about maintaining PO4 at all times. I have seen persistent Ostreos a couple times on the forum. Unusual, but it does happen.
 

bishoptf

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Over the years I have accumulated an Aqua UV 25, LifeGard 25, and Aqua UV 40. I prefer the Aqua UV brand. The GKM have a really bad reputation. They don't last, etc. I really think it comes down to the bulb quality.

Agree with the others about maintaining PO4 at all times. I have seen persistent Ostreos a couple times on the forum. Unusual, but it does happen.
I went with a 20w Danner unit, the only one I could afford from Aqua Ultraviolet was the 15w version and was concerned it wouldnt be large enough, here is the unit - https://dannermfg.com/collections/uv-clarifiers/products/submersible-ultraviolet-clarifiers I went back and forth between this model and the Aqua Ultraviolet 15w version they are both about the same price. I am going to keep an eye on my PO4 just not sure why I have the issue with it but watching more closely now.

Let me know your thoughts I can swap for the 15w Aqua unit but was trying to go for a little more power...:)

The other thing I need to figure out now is what size pump do I want to go with, really do not need a lot of flow with it being a nano but I need something that can overcome the head height of the 29g depth, still working on that.
 

Aqua Man

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The other thing I need to figure out now is what size pump do I want to go with, really do not need a lot of flow with it being a nano but I need something that can overcome the head height of the 29g depth, still working on that.
For best results, UV should be in the display. Pump and all. Can always move to the sump at a later date when the Dino have been beaten!

If the UV you have now is not in the display, it could account for your not having success beating Ostreo.
 

bishoptf

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For best results, UV should be in the display. Pump and all. Can always move to the sump at a later date when the Dino have been beaten!

If the UV you have now is not in the display, it could account for your not having success beating Ostreo.
Yeah no I've been doing this unfortunately for some time and I know all the rules, the 25w GKM has been in the main tank the whole time. What I was referring to is I have purchased yet another UV unit and now I need to figure out and size a pump to feed it, my DT is 29G nano with a 20g long sump, maybe 35-40g total. I have a Sicce Syncra Nano that best case is rated for 110 gph but I know I will not get that but if I go by the slower is better of 1-3x turnover per hour for my DT that would me 30-90gph unless I need to base it on total water volume then I would need a bigger pump. I am just trying to figure out what pump to match up to the 20 UV unit that I have coming in today...
 

bishoptf

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Well the UV unit came in and it has 1" barb fittings, lol. They used to have 3/4" barb fittings and I guess at some point increased them now I need to figure out how I am going to connect things up and transition to a smaller hose, just more crap to deal with, I have a 3d printer and can make something up but starting to think if I should do something different, 1" hoses are such a pain to work with, grumble grumble...
 

bishoptf

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This is what I have spitball'd in cad and came up with, need to do some prints to see what I need to modify, 1" to 1/2" barb fittings, probably should chamfer the inside when going from 1" to 1/2" but not sure it matters much, I can upsize it to 3/4" if I want to plumb it to my return in the future etc but 1/2" is plenty for in the DT.

Screenshot at 2022-11-01 15-50-52.png
 

doubleshot00

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Trying to figure out what i should add to my tank to knock my SCA dinos back. I ordered pods, phyto and waterglass. Should be here any day.

But what else are guys doing? More live rock, more bacteria (pns probio), miracle mud?
 

Steve2020

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Trying to figure out what i should add to my tank to knock my SCA dinos back. I ordered pods, phyto and waterglass. Should be here any day.

But what else are guys doing? More live rock, more bacteria (pns probio), miracle mud?
I had LCA. I added pods to an already established pod population, phyto daily, increased NO3 and PO4, alternated daily between MB7 and MB Clean. Once I started to see the Dino's reduce I added waterglass to promote a Diatom outbreak and this did the trick for me. Dino's and Diatoms are completely gone. I have continued to add phyto every other day because it seems my tank really likes it and I am adding MB7 once a week now. Tank has been free of Dino's and Diatoms for almost 4 weeks now.
 

doubleshot00

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I had LCA. I added pods to an already established pod population, phyto daily, increased NO3 and PO4, alternated daily between MB7 and MB Clean. Once I started to see the Dino's reduce I added waterglass to promote a Diatom outbreak and this did the trick for me. Dino's and Diatoms are completely gone. I have continued to add phyto every other day because it seems my tank really likes it and I am adding MB7 once a week now. Tank has been free of Dino's and Diatoms for almost 4 weeks now.
How long did that process take?
 

Steve2020

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How long did that process take?
Once I started the complete regiment they where gone in about 6 weeks. 4 weeks prior to the complete regiment I was only dosing MB7 and phyto and added more pods to the tank and the Dino population slowed down but were still spreading. Only when I increased my nutrients and adding MB Clean alternating with the MB7 did I start seeing a reduction. Then I added waterglass the last few weeks and BOOM they were gone.
Prior to increasing my nutrients my NO3=10.5ppm and PO4 was at 0.05-0.07ppm. I topped out my NO3 at 19.6ppm and my PO4 to 0.29ppm. I built a Donavan's Nitrate Destroyer to bring down my NO3 and they are now at 8.6ppm and steady and I am doing Lanthanum drips to slowly bring down the PO4 which it looks like I PO4 saturated my 250lbs of rock. My PO4 today is at 0.22ppm and coming down slowly. Whatever PO4 I remove lets say 0.08ppm then in two days it goes up about .04-.06ppm I believe because the rock is releasing PO4. Eventually it should balance out.
Believe it or not but my corals seem to like the higher nutrients including the few SPS I have. Tank is predominant LPS and Softies but plan on many more SPS.
 

doubleshot00

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Once I started the complete regiment they where gone in about 6 weeks. 4 weeks prior to the complete regiment I was only dosing MB7 and phyto and added more pods to the tank and the Dino population slowed down but were still spreading. Only when I increased my nutrients and adding MB Clean alternating with the MB7 did I start seeing a reduction. Then I added waterglass the last few weeks and BOOM they were gone.
Prior to increasing my nutrients my NO3=10.5ppm and PO4 was at 0.05-0.07ppm. I topped out my NO3 at 19.6ppm and my PO4 to 0.29ppm. I built a Donavan's Nitrate Destroyer to bring down my NO3 and they are now at 8.6ppm and steady and I am doing Lanthanum drips to slowly bring down the PO4 which it looks like I PO4 saturated my 250lbs of rock. My PO4 today is at 0.22ppm and coming down slowly. Whatever PO4 I remove lets say 0.08ppm then in two days it goes up about .04-.06ppm I believe because the rock is releasing PO4. Eventually it should balance out.
Believe it or not but my corals seem to like the higher nutrients including the few SPS I have. Tank is predominant LPS and Softies but plan on many more SPS.
What did you do to increase no3 and po4? Im dosing neonitro and ohos but just got some sodium phosphate.
 

Steve2020

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What did you do to increase no3 and po4? Im dosing neonitro and ohos but just got some sodium phosphate.
Dosed Trisodium Phosphate and Sodium Nitrate I had on hand from Loudwolf. Used James' Planted Tank Website for dose calculations and increased nutrients over a 10 day period which required testing every day. Used Hanna Nitrate and ULR Phosphate checker and did a rough double check on NO3 with API Nitrate checker.
 

bishoptf

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Almost have the new UV unit ready to go, this is a 20w Danner unit, actually looks really nice and I think it may be one of the few that is fully submersible. I'm not doing that but thought it was interesting, the barbs on the end are 1" and thats way bigger than I needed so I 3d printed some 1" to 1/2" reducers and connected them up, see pics below. Tomorrow I will purchase some more silicon hose and hopefully get it in the tank, really hoping this finally kicks them in the tail and gets them on the go...

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