Dead Cleaner Shrimp

Razorbacks · May 10, 2023

Yup I have flow from the uv and when it's not running I have a wavemaker. However ordered a small power head to point at surface. Issue I've run into with wavemaker at same time as uv is the fish cant even hold position its blown around.

Razorbacks · May 12, 2023

Update: I'm seeing some signs of improvement. However, I won't add any more inverts for at least another week and I'll run Cuprisorb in between just in case. Won't risk another cleaner shrimp until after tank upgrade.

Actions Taken: significantly increased flow, added carbon this morning, and turned off whites today. Don't think that last one does much but doesn't hurt.

My best hypothesis of what's been going on is insufficient flow reducing O2 coupled with some excess dissolved organic contaminants that are probably fueling my bacteria/algae problems and further depleting O2. I don't have a skimmer and I don't use carbon or chemical filtration other than some polyfilter occasionally but that doesn't last long. I always assumed if nitrate/phosphate were low I had nothing to export and water changes had me covered but after reading Randy Holmes writeup on how little we really know about dissolved organics I've decided I need more backups and will implement some additional export options beyond water change.

Also my extra power head came in that's aimable and I aimed it at the surface. It's making a huge difference. My surface was not "still" before but it was nothing like my LFS where I have to use a viewing tool to look at frags from the top. Now my surface is much closer to LFS in that regard.

Still I was noticing odd behavior from my clown even after 24 hours of running the powerhead. He's been hanging out at the surface far too much. No heavy breathing but keeps going up to the top.

So I took additional steps: I dropped in a bag of carbon this morning and reduced the lights (no white). Also turned on the wavemaker so flow is the highest it's ever been (HOB, UV, powerhead, and wavemaker). Strangely enough he seems to be able to hold his position without struggling which he could not when it was just wavemaker + UV.

Within a few hours I noticed the clown started to behave more normal. Not roaming a lot but no more surfacing. Just kind of chilling in the middle. Hoping the positive trend continues.

Microscope arrives tomorrow so I can confirm whether I have dinos or not.

Razorbacks · May 13, 2023

HOLY COW. I uncovered a thread and some research that has me convinced my oxygen hypothesis is accurate. It might not be the only problem, but it's probably the biggest and the powerhead is going to help but it's not enough. I've ordered a skimmer immediately and I plan to start running an air stone every night until it arrives.

I found this thread where @Randy Holmes-Farley had some extremely interesting information to share. It seems there was an actual study done all the way back in 2005 with a tank exactly like mine (10 gallon with clown fish) and it was clearly shown that oxygen levels were tanking in the evening even with two powerheads running. Worse, even during the day they were no where near the levels they should be.

What Randy described makes perfect sense. In the early days of my tank I didn't have algae, corals, etc. Now that I do and they're consuming O2 at night the levels are so low at night that things are dieing. The clown can at least swim up to and stay at the surface but some of the other creatures would have a hard time doing so. It was also very interesting that the study showed an air stone to be significantly more effective than the powerheads in oxygenating the study tank. I'm kind of shocked this study was done back in 2005 and yet this doesn't seem to be common knowledge. I actually hear people not advising protein skimmers for nanos because they're only focused on the nutrient export angle. I hear a lot of statements thrown around about what kind of things do what for oxygen but this is the only place I've found where someone actually studied and measured them. In my opinion based on this data it would be advisable for all nano owners to either run an airtstone at night every night or just run a skimmer 24/7 simply for the oxygenation aspect as Randy said in his post.

Articles: https://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-08/eb/index.php

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-07/eb/index.php

iamacat · May 13, 2023

This is why all reply’s have been recommending an air stone, asking about a skimmer, improving flow, and ditching the lids. It’s not new, it’s foundational to keeping a stable reef environment. I’m glad you found an article to trust with your experience. It takes time to digest all the details that interconnect in the hobby

Razorbacks · May 13, 2023

I feel I may have offended and that was not my intention. I apologize if that is the case. I was not attempting to discredit your advice or the advice of others. You've been very helpful and I appreciate that. I'm also not disputing that anyone would argue oxygenation is important or that surface agitation is important. Agreed that is foundational and frankly I was not even close to having enough. I'm the beginner and I own my mistakes. Agreed it's a learning curve in the hobby and painful one at times. Information and understanding is rapidly changing to the point that there's really not even an up to date book available on a shelf somewhere that teaches you the ins and outs.

I spend hours weekly reading, listening to podcasts, and watching YouTube videos in an attempt to learn and improve. It has not been my experience that the study findings are foundational. I have had the same experience as the 2005 author which is to say that I see people often say one thing or another, but they don't back it up with data and it has to be taken at face value. Sadly the consensus advice I find I've found is that at most you need a few powerheads pointed at the surface which perhaps works for some or many tanks. I've never come across a reefer who is running an air stone everyday or night. I'm not saying they are not out there, I just haven't come across it. Similarly when it comes to protein skimmers I find a lot of love for them, but it's all based around their core function of removing dissolved organics. I don't find them being pitched as a live saving necessary device for nano tanks. I find them being called out as great optional upgrades to cutdown on water changes.

The finding that air stones and skimmers both out performed a powerhead in terms of increasing oxygen are also contrary to what I've read. I'm not saying no one says it, but I am saying it's not the consensus that I've run into. Air stones are typically called out as emergency measures for power outages, during a QT, etc. Basically solving a short term problem not a long term one. I've also seen quite a few people argue their relative ineffectiveness in comparison a powerhead for oxygenation.

I'm not saying you or anyone else who has chimed in to help me does or doesn't know these things. What I am saying is that if these things are true they are not being broadcasted widely enough to the point that they're covered in a basic setup guide for a nano tank and I would argue they should be if the study findings are accurate. I would love to see this information shared more broadly so that amateurs like myself can benefit from it.