Automated Water Changers (AWC's) - Use One? DIY or Commerical Offering? What Scale (AWC tankage and aquarium tankage)? -

[Iwannaflyguy]

Automated Water Changers (AWC's) - Use One? DIY or Commerical Offering? What Scale (AWC tankage and aquarium tankage)?

I am back into reef-keeping after over 10 years of being away from that particular science. In that time there has been quite an explosion of methodology, technology and product offerings to simplify and remove manual steps. One that I am very interested in is automated water changing systems. I have seen some DIY systems and a few Commerical systems out there. I would like to know how many of us in the R2R community use AWC's and thoughts on the following:

1. usability
2. risks associated with AWC systems
3. labor savings over manual weekly water changes
4. what size/volumes are you employing
5. data comparing water chemistry stability
6. Any other feedback you are wiling to share

I appreciate your sharing of any insights. Happy reef-keeping!

 

[Montiman]

I currently don't run an AWC but I did run one when I used to work at an LFS. I used the spectrapure litermeter to change 10 gallons a day on a 500 gallon coral system.

My experience was that it did positively effect the corals and helped to even out trace elements. In a store system element usage varies alot because corals are constantly going in and out of the system.

My disappointment was that the AWC could never replace manual waterchanges because it would not remove detritus. Despite the daily AWC detritus still accumulated and manual water changes were still needed on a weekly basis to keep the bare bottom clean. Since this experience I have never done another AWC system because the biggest selling point was less work and I found that this just isn't the case.

 

[Rudzbrewski]

I run AWC on my Reefer 425 because one of my times for getting into the hobby and planning my build was that my tank had to be able to go virtually I maintained for a 2 week span. I did not want to have to worry about a knowledgeable tank sitter or hiring an LFS to do anything if I wanted to go on a trip.

I run mine using Neptune Dos. I have a mixing station with 40 gallon brute cans one floor below my tank, so I can go 2-4 weeks depending on AWC volume without having to mix salt or touch any water. This has met my goal and is one of the many things I have automated to decrease regular maintenance and time requirements.

 

[willieboy240]

I run a Neptune dos for water change. I do about 1-2 gallons a day. I run a 2 55 gallon containers. 1 for salt and 1 for ro/di water. The ro/di is also my make up water thru a Litermeter via kalk reactor. My system is about 250 gallons total water volume.
I’ve been reefing since 2000. I can honestly say. This is the best system that I’ve used so far. I’ve tried quite a few. The tech has help a lot. I find that little water changes help way more than the old once a week deal.

 

[alysak6075]

I DIYed an AWC.
The tank is 54 gallons, the container is 32 gallons (brute trashcan).
Mixed water is 1.023 water in tank is 1.024
I turn on the ingress pump to the tank until my skimmer starts overflowing. Cup is plumbed into the drain and has an ANC. This way I get a water change, the skimmer gets a washdown, the slightly less concentrated water also takes care of top off water and while the skimmer is overflowing it eventually slows down and starts being more effective so i in theory pull out slightly dirtier water than normal. Been running this 4 in 1 system for years, no issues whatsoever.

Implementing this on my 220 as well now.

 

[a.t.t.r]

I use a dosing pump to pump in water and a second dosing pump to start a siphon to drain I do 0.7 gallons per day tank is rapidly looking better.

 

[RobB'z Reef]

DIY is always cool, depending on your skills, time and setup that can be a very cool route! Commercial wise I only have experience with one and it's recently installed so I can't speak to performance over longevity just yet. With all the commercial ones (even DIY) considerations whether or not you have a controller often comes into play and if you do, do you want everything tied to it or are you a fan of distributed control or a mix there in? Finally budget or price tolerance is definitely a factor as well. I'm sure you're aware of many options out there, if not I can list the ones I know of. Personally I am currently trying out a Kamoer X2S AWC, which is a stand alone unit that I purchased for $278 usd. It has pros and cons for sure. It also has a bigger brother (the X2SR) which is $450 usd. The one I'm using supports a 200 gallon system and I am doing a little over 3 gallon changes a day with it (all at once).

 

[R-balljunkie]

Here's my AWC setup. I was going to use level sensors, pumps timers, etc but at the end of the day, decided to go with something more dummy-proof and less prone to failure. It's easy. The same amount of water in/ water out. The top-off tank is 15 gallons. I change about 1 1/4 gallons every night at 3:00 am, when I'm sound asleep thru my controller...setup to run xx minutes. The pump is a Stenner Double Head Metering Model 170 DM5 I picked up for around $280 used. These are used for pump chemical service. I refurbished it with new lube and hoses...works like a charm. The AWC reservoir is a 15-gallon Innovative Marine that has a pull-out tray that I load with +- 10 cups of salt every two weeks. The mixing pump turns on twice a day. I'm also fortunate enough to have both running water and a drain underneath where my tank sits. My house is older, back in the 80's you had to have a wet bar in your house!!

I also was out of reef keeping for a few years. After starting a new tank, decided to not cut any corners and to splurge as much as i could on automation. Also, have a filter roller which I really enjoy. I still run a mag pump in the sump every two months to blow out stuff but find myself enjoying my tank more, maintaining less which was my goal.

 

[WVNed]

3 pumps, 1 level sensor and a Hydros. It does AWC and ATO. The pumps are AC 10 amps max so that would be almost any volume you would want I think.
I am doing 6 gallons a day on a 400 gallon system using Maxijet 1200s.

 

[R-balljunkie]

3 pumps, 1 level sensor and a Hydros. It does AWC and ATO. The pumps are AC 10 amps max so that would be almost any volume you would want I think.
I am doing 6 gallons a day on a 400 gallon system using Maxijet 1200s.

Hydros controllers are amazing! So happy to switch.....they added the AWC logic in a recent update. All these other controller companies should be weary of the new kid on the block.

 

[Rundmc2016]

I really liked the genesisreefsystems.com product but put off the purchase for too long and they closed. I'm working on a diy version. I like the preset reservoirs for their system since I wouldn't have to worry about differing volumes from separate peristaltic pumps.

 

[Iwannaflyguy]

I currently don't run an AWC but I did run one when I used to work at an LFS. I used the spectrapure litermeter to change 10 gallons a day on a 500 gallon coral system.

My experience was that it did positively effect the corals and helped to even out trace elements. In a store system element usage varies alot because corals are constantly going in and out of the system.

My disappointment was that the AWC could never replace manual waterchanges because it would not remove detritus. Despite the daily AWC detritus still accumulated and manual water changes were still needed on a weekly basis to keep the bare bottom clean. Since this experience I have never done another AWC system because the biggest selling point was less work and I found that this just isn't the case.

That is a good point. Detritis removal through siphoning would not be accomplished by an AWC. Thank you for sharing your experience!

 

[Iwannaflyguy]

DIY is always cool, depending on your skills, time and setup that can be a very cool route! Commercial wise I only have experience with one and it's recently installed so I can't speak to performance over longevity just yet. With all the commercial ones (even DIY) considerations whether or not you have a controller often comes into play and if you do, do you want everything tied to it or are you a fan of distributed control or a mix there in? Finally budget or price tolerance is definitely a factor as well. I'm sure you're aware of many options out there, if not I can list the ones I know of. Personally I am currently trying out a Kamoer X2S AWC, which is a stand alone unit that I purchased for $278 usd. It has pros and cons for sure. It also has a bigger brother (the X2SR) which is $450 usd. The one I'm using supports a 200 gallon system and I am doing a little over 3 gallon changes a day with it (all at once).

Thank you for sharing what you use. What would you say the pros and cons with the X2S are? Does the X2SR address any of the cons?

 

[Iwannaflyguy]

I run AWC on my Reefer 425 because one of my times for getting into the hobby and planning my build was that my tank had to be able to go virtually I maintained for a 2 week span. I did not want to have to worry about a knowledgeable tank sitter or hiring an LFS to do anything if I wanted to go on a trip.

I run mine using Neptune Dos. I have a mixing station with 40 gallon brute cans one floor below my tank, so I can go 2-4 weeks depending on AWC volume without having to mix salt or touch any water. This has met my goal and is one of the many things I have automated to decrease regular maintenance and time requirements.

Thank you. This is a key factor for me too - being able to do a vacation without requiring someone as passionate about reefing as I am to take care of things. Glad it has worked well for you.

 

[Iwannaflyguy]

Here's my AWC setup. I was going to use level sensors, pumps timers, etc but at the end of the day, decided to go with something more dummy-proof and less prone to failure. It's easy. The same amount of water in/ water out. The top-off tank is 15 gallons. I change about 1 1/4 gallons every night at 3:00 am, when I'm sound asleep thru my controller...setup to run xx minutes. The pump is a Stenner Double Head Metering Model 170 DM5 I picked up for around $280 used. These are used for pump chemical service. I refurbished it with new lube and hoses...works like a charm. The AWC reservoir is a 15-gallon Innovative Marine that has a pull-out tray that I load with +- 10 cups of salt every two weeks. The mixing pump turns on twice a day. I'm also fortunate enough to have both running water and a drain underneath where my tank sits. My house is older, back in the 80's you had to have a wet bar in your house!!

I also was out of reef keeping for a few years. After starting a new tank, decided to not cut any corners and to splurge as much as i could on automation. Also, have a filter roller which I really enjoy. I still run a mag pump in the sump every two months to blow out stuff but find myself enjoying my tank more, maintaining less which was my goal.

This is great, thank you for sharing. I have also thought through all of the valves, pumps, level meters, etc. and have been concerned over reliability. I like the simplistic design you've achieved. I also use a filter roller system and like it for the most part. I have had some issues with the water level sensors to where the twice the roller has erroneously rolled up 1/2 a roll of filter membrane overnight. I don't want something like that to happen with a AWC.

 

[Iwannaflyguy]

I really liked the genesisreefsystems.com product but put off the purchase for too long and they closed. I'm working on a diy version. I like the preset reservoirs for their system since I wouldn't have to worry about differing volumes from separate peristaltic pumps.

Yes, I saw this system too and noticed that it was no longer available. I wonder if they didn't have enough interest or if users had problems.

 

[bobnicaragua]

I use 2 versa pumps to change a gallon a day on my 135. I use the same 15gal resovoir as Rballjunkie above. I ran the export line along the baseboard, then through the wall into the utility room, and then down the washing machine drain.

The export tubing on the versa failed once, so a gallon of saltwater was being imported, but nothing exported. It took a couple days for me to catch it. That’s the only issue Ive had and there was no impact to the tank.

 

[Spieg]

I don't do AWC. Have the equipment to be able to set it up, but believe it's too wasteful. I actually go the other direction and only do 20-30% water change about twice a year. I use dosing and filtration to maintain water parameters.

 

[bobnicaragua]

Here's my AWC setup. I was going to use level sensors, pumps timers, etc but at the end of the day, decided to go with something more dummy-proof and less prone to failure. It's easy. The same amount of water in/ water out. The top-off tank is 15 gallons. I change about 1 1/4 gallons every night at 3:00 am, when I'm sound asleep thru my controller...setup to run xx minutes. The pump is a Stenner Double Head Metering Model 170 DM5 I picked up for around $280 used. These are used for pump chemical service. I refurbished it with new lube and hoses...works like a charm. The AWC reservoir is a 15-gallon Innovative Marine that has a pull-out tray that I load with +- 10 cups of salt every two weeks. The mixing pump turns on twice a day. I'm also fortunate enough to have both running water and a drain underneath where my tank sits. My house is older, back in the 80's you had to have a wet bar in your house!!

I also was out of reef keeping for a few years. After starting a new tank, decided to not cut any corners and to splurge as much as i could on automation. Also, have a filter roller which I really enjoy. I still run a mag pump in the sump every two months to blow out stuff but find myself enjoying my tank more, maintaining less which was my goal.

Nice system, I see you have the pump to get your new water in. How do you get the same amount of old water out?

 

[bobnicaragua]

I currently don't run an AWC but I did run one when I used to work at an LFS. I used the spectrapure litermeter to change 10 gallons a day on a 500 gallon coral system.

My experience was that it did positively effect the corals and helped to even out trace elements. In a store system element usage varies alot because corals are constantly going in and out of the system.

My disappointment was that the AWC could never replace manual waterchanges because it would not remove detritus. Despite the daily AWC detritus still accumulated and manual water changes were still needed on a weekly basis to keep the bare bottom clean. Since this experience I have never done another AWC system because the biggest selling point was less work and I found that this just isn't the case.

My rock structure only touches on a few points, so the power heads on top are angled down and blow all the detritus out from under the rock. The MP40s on the front bottom kick up everything into the overflow.

It works, no detritus accumulation on the bottom. I only do auto water changes. Downside is a filter sock lasts 2 days at best.