A very stupid and embarrassing question… is my cat causing ammonia in my tank?

[FlyingJenn]

Long story short, got a new tank, purple life rock, and aragonite substrate. I tested my ammonia to get a base reading and I was showing 1.0 ppm on the api test and .8 on the Red Sea ammonia test. I was puzzled to why I’m showing ammonia within a few hours of setting up my new tank (20g nano).

The only thing I could think of is maybe my cat and his litter box? I’m a couple of days overdue for changing his box so maybe that’s it? I tested my tap water straight from the faucet and rodi water and they were the same yellowish with slight green (api). I decided to dose my tank with some pns pro bio and opened my window. Any advice besides cleaning the crap out of my apartment? Sorry if this a stupid question

Pic of my cat showing no remorse.

 

[brandon429]

I asked Randy that recently for ails going on in my tank it’s valid question

 

[brandon429]

Post a pic of your display and I’ll show you a neat trick regarding ammonia control in reefing

 

[ShakeyGizzard]

Well, If it was you could easily smell it, not saying that it is your ammonia issue. Not just the regular "I can tell you have a cat in your house smell" but very strong. Have never heard of or think its possible with you staying alive inside your house but I could be very wrong

 

[brandon429]

Nobody has studied it yet with a seneye to have the definitive answer

@Dan_P aerosolized transfer of ammonia is an excellent study. Can it be done to harm a reef?

Even though there isn’t direct charting we do have studies like these: seneye tanks who dose loads of liquid ammonia right into the tank and the tanks eat up that ammonia in ten mins.

Does anyone dose ammonia and/or how would one try?

So, after an interesting discussion on nitrate dosing and looking at my Walt Disney coral and seeing it slightly less colorful than I have seen it in others tanks, I have decided I want to learn about and then try dosing ammonia instead of buying 20 damsels. Nitrate additives I see abound and...

www.reef2reef.com

It’s hard to imagine aerosol transfer outpacing direct addition they are doing. I bet the pic of your reef tank looks fine and normal like theirs do even without the precision measurement in place

Reef tanks are hungry for ammonia and use up quickly extra amounts given, that’s what all current threads show so far.

 

[brandon429]

If your tank is on day 2 of cycling that’s one thing

But if your test kits are showing high levels of ammonia and it’s post cycle, with animals in tow always doing fine, then this misread thread applies

Sustained Ammonia spikes are misreads

The reason you think your reef tank can’t control its ammonia is due to false training from old cycling science. That and you don’t own a seneye on the tank in question: if you did, you wouldn’t ever think your ammonia was out of control...

www.reef2reef.com

So your pics will decide your ammonia status, not the test kits, that’s nine pages of those two test kits causing false ammonia alerts.

Key detail: the post titles are about a test reading not about losses in the tank, so far that’s this thread too.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Long story short, got a new tank, purple life rock, and aragonite substrate. I tested my ammonia to get a base reading and I was showing 1.0 ppm on the api test and .8 on the Red Sea ammonia test. I was puzzled to why I’m showing ammonia within a few hours of setting up my new tank (20g nano).

The only thing I could think of is maybe my cat and his litter box? I’m a couple of days overdue for changing his box so maybe that’s it? I tested my tap water straight from the faucet and rodi water and they were the same yellowish with slight green (api). I decided to dose my tank with some pns pro bio and opened my window. Any advice besides cleaning the crap out of my apartment? Sorry if this a stupid question

Pic of my cat showing no remorse.

Some sea salts contain ammonia as a trace contaminant, not quite at these levels, but it will show up on test kits.

 

[exnisstech]

How long has the tank been running and how are you cycling? What all are you testing?
I cycle tanks a bit different than most. I don't own an ammonia or nitrate test test. I test for nitrate and once I see that I call it cycled and begin slowly adding livestock.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

A cat peeing directly into the tank will boost ammonia, but I'd expect ammonia from the air should be able to be processed by a reef tank as it enters.

FWIW, cat urine, like human urine, contains little ammonia. Most of the N present is urea. The urea can break down in the litter box (or a reef tank) to produce ammonia.

 

[FlyingJenn]

Post a pic of your display and I’ll show you a neat trick regarding ammonia control in reefing

Here is what it looks like right now. The aragonite is probably still settling and the protein filter isn’t running since the bacteria stuff said to stop it. I am planning on buying a mesh top and the Red Sea ato+ but besides that this is it!

My goal is to also just have a few anemones, clownfish, choco chip star, urchin and a cleaning crew. Not really into corals juuuust yet.

 

[FlyingJenn]

How long has the tank been running and how are you cycling? What all are you testing?
I cycle tanks a bit different than most. I don't own an ammonia or nitrate test test. I test for nitrate and once I see that I call it cycled and begin slowly adding livestock.

The tank hasn’t even been running for a full 24 hours yet and right now I just did an ammonia test nothing else besides add PNS pro bio

 

[GlassMunky]

its just doing the initial cycle, nothing out of the ordinary for a brand new tank

 

[Sleeping Giant]

new tank issue, it'll subside soon

 

[FlyingJenn]

Nobody has studied it yet with a seneye to have the definitive answer

@Dan_P aerosolized transfer of ammonia is an excellent study. Can it be done to harm a reef?

Even though there isn’t direct charting we do have studies like these: seneye tanks who dose loads of liquid ammonia right into the tank and the tanks eat up that ammonia in ten mins.

Does anyone dose ammonia and/or how would one try?

So, after an interesting discussion on nitrate dosing and looking at my Walt Disney coral and seeing it slightly less colorful than I have seen it in others tanks, I have decided I want to learn about and then try dosing ammonia instead of buying 20 damsels. Nitrate additives I see abound and...

www.reef2reef.com

It’s hard to imagine aerosol transfer outpacing direct addition they are doing. I bet the pic of your reef tank looks fine and normal like theirs do even without the precision measurement in place

Reef tanks are hungry for ammonia and use up quickly extra amounts given, that’s what all current threads show so far.

I just posted a pic of the tank right now. I should have posted it before but I thought it it was too cloudy from the aragonite settling.

 

[brandon429]

Keeping anemones is harder than corals, that’s a tall goal above but attainable. You’d be better off having thriving corals first, at least a few, before inputting any anemones.

At the starting point of a reef you’re going to get endless recommendations on how to proceed. Here’s mine based on prior tanks like yours

Add in one ground up pinch of fish food into a small sample of extracted tank water stir it up well, add that water into the tank as it sits right now with your given additives

Let the tank sit running as normal each day, adding nothing else but keeping it topped off, until March 19th

Change all the water out, you’re cycled.

Between now and the 19th choose a specific disease control plan selected from the disease forum and enact that, before making use of your ready reef. Given your goals that’s the approach you want, 1% effort on cycling and 99.999% effort on self guided study in the disease forum here plus a selected stocking rate coming from such a plan.

Fish Disease Treatment and Diagnosis

A forum for discussing treatment and diagnosing saltwater reef fish.

www.reef2reef.com

The cat box isn’t a factor in any step listed to get you the tank you want, actually quite close to the day you want it.

 

[randomfishdude]

I never thought ammonia could get into the tank from the cat box.

My cats litter box is in my bedroom along with the tank.
I never had problem

 

[brandon429]

That remains to be tested, how close the source has to be for ammonia to travel by air AND overcome the rapid processing ability of any reef tank. It’s a 30+ year whispered risk in reefing.


Cat box concerns were present in 2001 Randy’s seen them all this time I saw him work cat box help posts at reefcentral back in the gladiator days with Borneman.









When the seneyes come, the myth will be tested in 2024 and beyond, closure is coming.


People played pin the tail on the donkey to explain api misreads, is where the myth occurred that’s my bet.

However

It wasn’t so unbelievable that I didn’t just ask Randy the same thing three months ago to try and pinpoint some bleaching in my tank heh. I was willing to forego a multi decade soapbox run if it could save my old corals

Turned out to be too bright lights and an alk shift.

 

[FlyingJenn]

Keeping anemones is harder than corals, that’s a tall goal above but attainable. You’d be better off having thriving corals first, at least a few, before inputting any anemones.

At the starting point of a reef you’re going to get endless recommendations on how to proceed. Here’s mine based on prior tanks like yours

Add in one ground up pinch of fish food into a small sample of extracted tank water stir it up well, add that water into the tank as it sits right now with your given additives

Let the tank sit running as normal each day, adding nothing else but keeping it topped off, until March 19th

Change all the water out, you’re cycled.

Between now and the 19th choose a specific disease control plan selected from the disease forum and enact that, before making use of your ready reef. Given your goals that’s the approach you want, 1% effort on cycling and 99.999% effort on self guided study in the disease forum here plus a selected stocking rate coming from such a plan.

Fish Disease Treatment and Diagnosis

A forum for discussing treatment and diagnosing saltwater reef fish.

www.reef2reef.com

The cat box isn’t a factor in any step listed to get you the tank you want, actually quite close to the day you want it.

Very true for some reason I thought the opposite but I’m still learning A LOT.

I do like your plan of action so I’ll pick up some food today when I go out. Any certain type you recommend or just get whatever pellets/flakes

 

[exnisstech]

Keeping anemones is harder than corals, that’s a tall goal above but attainable. You’d be better off having thriving corals first, at least a few, before inputting any anemones.

I agree but personally I would not mix nems and coral in a tank that small. I have nems in a 6ft tank and they can be a pain when they decide to move.
To the OP having a plan is great and part of the fun but hopefully you realize nems do not do well in young tanks? Not saying it's impossible just not recommended unless you have experience with nems already.
I apologize if your already aware. I just read about too many failures which usualy do not end well.

 

[brandon429]

Cheap flakes are ok, part of that study in the forum shows feeding approaches and some of that will be high quality pellets or flakes, any will work

Bio-spira works great

I just started a new tank a little over a week ago. I started with all dry rock and new sand. I added a bottle of Bio-Spira and put fish and coral the same day. Never saw any ammonia and fish and coral seem healthy.

www.reef2reef.com

That reef is a day one dry start with anemones corals and fish

But that’s Ike who was reefing long before that new tank + anemone+ 1 years tracking thread. The reason I recommended a few corals first, before anemone was because if basic montipora will grow then an anemone won’t be a stretch, and because as learning progresses a dead montipora won’t crash the tank. A dead anemone sure can

The time taken to produce working corals is precisely how long I think it’ll take to build up anemone skills here. There are nanos right now at my pet store in Austin that have corals, clown fish and anemones it’s not a tall order depending on species but I think the main downfall here will not be the cycle it’ll be anemones juiced in the tank or velvet disease/crypto wipeouts from preventable diseases.


All negative outcome examples I can find for new tanks falls into those risk groups, getting an exact cycle end date doesn’t mean an aquarist is ready to keep a given animal. It’s just my prediction of the date the system would do what Ike’s did above.