20 ppm Nitrate/0.06 ppm Phosphate - Cure my analysis paralysis!

[pluikens]

Tank Info:
40 gallon DT
20 gallon sump
Salinity: 1.025 SG
Alk: 9 dKH
Calc: 490 ppm
Mag: 1480 ppm
Ammonia: 0 ppm
Nitrite: 0 ppm
Nitrate: 20 ppm
Phosphate: 0.06 ppm

Mag, alk, calc tested with Red Sea Foundation Pro test kit. Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate tested with Red Sea Marine Pro test kit. Phosphate tested with Hanna Phosphorous tester.

Filtration:
Filter sock on water coming into sump. Baseball-sized piece of chaeto in first sump section with small 14 watt LED grow light running 24/7. No noticeable growth from the chaeto. Second section fo the sump has a Vertex Omega 130 skimmer which pulls dark skimmate that I have to empty every weekend. Return section of the sump has my return pump and a secondary pump to feed a BRS GFO reactor. I use 5 tbsp of BRS GFO and 5 tbsp of 0.8 ROX carbon in the reactor that I replace every 2 weeks.

Water change: I'm changing 5 gallons of water every 2 weeks using hw-Marinemix Reefer salt. Admittedly, water changes are sometimes 3 weeks apart depending on ym schedule but I can get better about that.

Feeding: I have an auto feeder the drops 10-15 pellets of Hikari Marine S into a feeding ring at noon and 3 pm every day. Every other day I feed a cube of frozen food, rotating PE mysis, Hikari Spirulina Brine Shrimp, and Hikari Mega Marine Angel. The pellet food is to get my fish feeding on that for when I add 3 anthias and need to feed throughout the day. Am I feeding too much?

My tank has been up and running for a little over three months. Started with dry live rock and live sand plus a couple piece of wet live rock from LFS. There was a two-week cycling phase before I consider the tank "running" where I used DrTim's Ammonium Chloride and One & Only Live Nitrifying Bacteria according to their fishless cycling schedule.

Problem: I've noticed growth on some of my corals like blastomussas and clove polyps. Other corals are surviving but don't seem to be as happy as they could be. To correct this, I'm focusing on my nitrate levels which are at 20 ppm. My current plan is to add a biopellet reactor and run either BRS biopellets or DrTim's NP-Active Pearls. I'm also considering just trying Red Sea NO3: PO4-X (NoPox) or Brightwell Aquatics MicroBacter7 (MB7). I'm a little nervous about these two chemicals as I think they'll also affect my phophate levels. I'd like to get some opinions on what others would do in my situation. I'd like to not have to put a doser for NoPox on the tank as I'm occasionally away from home for work or vacations so I like the idea of the biopellets just working in the tank as long as I keep them topped up. Lastly, I've looked into the Brightwell Xport NO3 brick seeded with MB7. There's just so many options! I can get the biopellet reactor and necessary pump at the beginning of February (going on vacation next week) but NoPox or MB7 as soon as today so I'd like ideas for short-term solutions to get the nitrate down to 1-2 ppm and then methods of keeping it there.

Thank you!

 

[pluikens]

All opinions welcomed and I'm really hoping @Randy Holmes-Farley has a suggestion. Thank you!

 

[EmdeReef]

FWIW I think your nitrates are fine and shouldn't bother any corals at that level. I would be cautious dosing NOPOX in your situation as it will deplete nitrates in a small tank rather quickly and then you could have other issues. Perhaps look for other problems like flow, lights, anything picking at your corals etc at this point. Also, some corals take much longer to acclimate and grow in a new tank.

 

[pluikens]

I didn't mention my stocking list:

2x Percula Clownfish
3x Pajama Cardinal
Orange Stripe Prawn Goby and Snapping Shrimp
Coral Beauty Angelfish
Yellow (Coris) Wrasse

The only guy I'm worried about is the CB. I've seen him go after food that lands on my zoas and blastos but not actually going after coral. I can't speak for what happens when I'm not watching though.

 

[pluikens]

FWIW I think your nitrates are fine and shouldn't bother any corals at that level. I would be cautious dosing NOPOX in your situation as it will deplete nitrates in a small tank rather quickly and then you could have other issues. Perhaps look for other problems like flow, lights, anything picking at your corals etc at this point. Also, some corals take much longer to acclimate and grow in a new tank.

Are there some referenceable member tanks running nitrates around 20 ppm? From everything I've seen that would be OK for FOWLR but my mixed reef should be closer to 1-2 ppm. The imbalance of NO3/PO4 may also be of concern.

 

[anthonys51]

I think you got too much going on way to fast. Your aren’t suppose to use Gfo and nopox at the same time. First in that small of a tank just do wAter changes. No dosing no carbon no Gfo no nopox. Good old fashion water changes. Little more work but nothing beats a little hard work. Also you never said how many fish you have but yes I would probably cut your feeding in half. Do not add anymore fish until you get nutrients under control. At those levels of nitrate and phosphate your cheato should be growing. So something else is going on there. I would do 10 gallon water changes once a week. Make sure to clean your sump if any detritus settles. I currently don’t run filter socks so tired of cleaning them. I just clean my sump once a week. This might sound bad but not a poet so will just say it. All you people who are new in this hobby stop using several product especially at once to lower this to cure this. These products are bandaids to the bigger problem. Plus when ever you dose you run the risk of causing your tank to be out of balance.
So just step up your water changes and clean your sump and make sure you clean your socks every 4 -5 days any longer abd they actually become nitrate traps

 

[Lasse]

I would not panic with these figures. The NO3 level could be a little bit lower - my goal is normally around 2-10 ppm. Are you sure for the NO3 level? Can you check it up with another test?
Is your Chaeto green and in rather good shape but with slow growth? If that´s the case - I would concentrate my effort to have it to grow. It could be lack of trace elements like iron or not enough of light (I doubt that in this case) To be honest - the first thing I´m thinking of according slow growth of Chaeto is lack of nitrogen (NO3 is a nitrogen species) Therefore - bes sure of your NO3 level. The best thing to see if your measurements is right (and lower the NO3 level for the moment) is to do a 50% WC with a good salt. (it will give you some trace elements too). If you do that - your NO3 level should be around 10 ppm after the WC.

And I have run mixed reefs with much higher NO3 levels than 20 ppm.

anthonys51 was faster with the same advices

Sincerely Lasse

 

[pluikens]

Thank you @anthonys51 I replace my filter sock on Wednesdays and Saturdays so twice a week. Last week I cleaned out my sump of any detritus as it hadn't been done since setting the tank up. I've now added my stocking list. One of my concerns with the NoPox and MB7 was that I'm running GFO. That's what made the NO3 Xport brick and biopellet reactor attractive, they seemed to mostly reduce nitrate and leave phosphate alone. I am trying to take things slow and not just throw everything in the tank to meet some levels that a manufacturer has printed. That's why I'm probably overthinking this and posted to the forums to get others opinions before changing anything in the tank. Thanks again for your comments.

 

[pluikens]

I would not panic with these figures. The NO3 level could be a little bit lower - my goal is normally around 2-10 ppm. Are you sure for the NO3 level? Can you check it up with another test?
Is your Chaeto green and in rather good shape but with slow growth? If that´s the case - I would concentrate my effort to have it to grow. It could be lack of trace elements like iron or not enough of light (I doubt that in this case) To be honest - the first thing I´m thinking of according slow growth of Chaeto is lack of nitrogen (NO3 is a nitrogen species) Therefore - bes sure of your NO3 level. The best thing to see if your measurements is right (and lower the NO3 level for the moment) is to do a 50% WC with a good salt. (it will give you some trace elements too). If you do that - your NO3 level should be around 10 ppm after the WC.

Sincerely Lasse

Thanks @Lasse The chaeto is a light green color and I haven't noticed it growing in the three weeks that it's been in the tank. I was considering a higher power fuge light like one of the UFO LED grow lights on Amazon to see if I could more naturally reduce nitrates. That would probably be the best scenario for my nitrate control if I could just trim chaeto rather than adding more reactors or chemicals. As for the 50% WC, would you consider hw-Marinemix Reefer "good salt"? I can do the WC this week and retest.

 

[anthonys51]

Nitrate levels are ok I would get your Phosphates down. You want .02-.1. But simple adding Gfo doesn’t do anything in solving the problem in your case because all it will do is lower it then once depleted your tank will simple go up and the seesaw is worse then those level fir your corals.

 

[RUNVS]

Nitrates and Phosphates at that level really arent an issue in my opinion, you may just see increased algae growth that may be competing with your Cheato. Do you use RO water with 0 TDS? you say your corals look unhappy what do you mean? I wouldn't be too quick to start adding things to your tank as generally changing things too quick can do more harm than good.

 

[SPR1968]

I’m in a similar position (but older and larger system) in that my nitrates are 12-16ppm and I think they should be lower. Why, because that’s seems to be what the ‘normal’ recommendations are.

However my corals ‘glow’ with life at these levels, no algea or anything, so why do I feel the need to get them lower.

The article Tanks Of The Masters on R2R is very interesting because most run at Nitrate around our levels. It’s well worth reading if you haven’t already. So again why do we feel we must lower it.

I don’t actually now other than maybe I’m afraid of the unknown! It drives me mad sometimes.

I’ve used NoPox for 18 months and it works on Nitrate very well, and you can dose manually but you really need a daily dosage so an auto doser if your away. It is less effective at reducing phosphate I’ve found but i also have a high bioload.

I’ve also got 2 Brightwell Xport NO3 Bricks you mention, which seem to work as well, and I also seeded them with the microbacter 7. With your water volume you might get away with just trying one of these before NoPox.

If your going away, I wouldn’t start NoPox until you get back, and also the Brightwell NO3 Bricks ‘can’ cause the skimmer to overskime when you first install them so just bear this in mind if your not there.

 

[pluikens]

Nitrate levels are ok I would get your Phosphates down. You want .02-.1. But simple adding Gfo doesn’t do anything in solving the problem in your case because all it will do is lower it then once depleted your tank will simple go up and the seesaw is worse then those level fir your corals.

Phosphates are 0.06 ppm.

 

[anthonys51]

His tank is 3 months old. He probably added too much to soon. I would advise anyone who wants to keep corals to not add Fish fir the first 6 months. It’s hard to do but let your rock age before adding the nutrient machines. Bet we all would have less problems

 

[anthonys51]

Oh I read it wrong thought it was .6. .06 is ok. Don’t think those levels are affecting your corals. Probably the new tank and instability

 

[pluikens]

Nitrates and Phosphates at that level really arent an issue in my opinion, you may just see increased algae growth that may be competing with your Cheato. Do you use RO water with 0 TDS? you say your corals look unhappy what do you mean? I wouldn't be too quick to start adding things to your tank as generally changing things too quick can do more harm than good.

I have the BRS 6 stage RO/DI system. Water out of DI is 0 TDS. I do have algae growth on the top of my rocks in my DT and also on my sandbed. That was one reason why I thought I should get a higher power LED grow light in the fuge.

 

[anthonys51]

I have the BRS 6 stage RO/DI system. Water out of DI is 0 TDS. I do have algae growth on the top of my rocks in my DT and also on my sandbed. That was one reason why I thought I should get a higher power LED grow light in the fuge.

Try adding more cuc. I have 5 tanks in my system. I added a new one In my other 4 tanks there isn’t a drop of algae but in the new tank I didn’t add fish or cuc yet and it got covered in algae. Algae is resilient it will grow in almost any conditions.

 

[pluikens]

Try adding more cuc. I have 5 tanks in my system. I added a new one In my other 4 tanks there isn’t a drop of algae but in the new tank I didn’t add fish or cuc yet and it got covered in algae. Algae is resilient it will grow in almost any conditions.

CUC is 8 trochus, 3 nassarius, 5 cerith, and 1 conch snails. 1 scarlett skunk cleaner, 1 blood red fire, and a snapping shrimp. Do you think that's sufficient?

 

[RUNVS]

I have the BRS 6 stage RO/DI system. Water out of DI is 0 TDS. I do have algae growth on the top of my rocks in my DT and also on my sandbed. That was one reason why I thought I should get a higher power LED grow light in the fuge.

I agree with Anthony your tank is very new and not all that stable just yet, adding a bit stonger light to the fuge wont hurt you, but I wouldnt worry too much about chasing these level just yet, just perform regular water changes and monitor the levels for now, Most importantly keep your Alk stable, constant fluctuations of Alk is generally the cause or coral problems aside from pests.

 

[pluikens]

Here's an FTS and some close ups. Some of my zoas don't ever open. That's my biggest concern and I understand it may not be related to nitrate level. My duncan had a big die off after adding to the tank but you can see some new heads that I see grow every day. Am I just being paranoid?