Top Down Tutorial?

[Kigs!]

Can one of R2R's photo gurus do a tutorial on top down photography and how to properly use a topdown box?

I was trying out a photobox for the first time last night and the whole time I was very frustrated, not able to play with the lens, frantically grabbing the box from floating away while being paranoid of the camera dropping in the water. Everything came out so blurry, and I had a hard time taking pics of what I really wanted to. After about 80 ~90 shots, these are the ones that came out decent but still not too happy with them. I was using the standard stock lens, canon 300d. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[gparr]

Interesting this post didn't get a response. Looks like we'll be waiting until Jan. 1 to see the images again.

I don't use a photo box for top-down shooting. I've tried one (not Melev's) and found that it was one more thing to juggle, I couldn't hold it and the camera steady and was always afraid I was going to swamp the thing and soak my camera.

I use a large tripod and a horizontal arm that hangs the camera over the water. All flow goes off and, once the water is still, I fire away. The face of the lens must be parallel to the water surface.

Light reflection is usually the biggest problem. If you can, tilt the light away from you to get rid of the reflection. This makes for slower shutter speeds because the light intensity is reduced, but top-down images with light reflections aren't any good, anyway. Most of the time I move the corals to the edge or a quiet corner. Then I don't have to move the lights and usually the water surface is calmer for longer periods of time.

Another factor that ruins shots is surface dust/debris that tends to float by. It'll create a haze look to the image. Always keep an eye open for surface dust before exposing the shot.

Gary

 

[Mr.Firemouth]

That's funny, I called gary about this very topic today!
I am going to try some on Sunday.
Kigs, I can't see your pics, says upgrade to pro bandwidth exceeded.

 

[Kigs!]

Using a 100mm lens with the flow turned off makes it significantly easier than using a photobox and a stock lens, but still doesn't produce anything to write home about. Maybe you guys can do a quick tutorial on tips and tools used for good top down shots in gary's thread "peering through the surface"?

And yeah...photobucket...I have to sift through and relocate all my pics. grr >=(

 

[gparr]

Kigs, in addition to what I wrote a couple of posts ago, the flow must be off and the water surface still. I assume you're using manual focus? Autofocus is too easily fooled. In addition to shooting RAW, I suggest you bracket three shots--one that is one stop over-exposed, acccording to the camera meter, one that is the exposure the meter suggests, and one that is underexposed by one stop. Remote release or timer is also essential. Also, if you have it, use mirror lockup. You must eliminate all movement/vibration. Your tripod also must be sturdy. You don't need the horizontal arm I use. I've shot many by moving the coral to the side of the tank and leaning the tripod against the tank so the camera can be aimed straight down. In the two shots you posted, there is too much movement or the focus is off. They're also overexposed and probably need a little more color temp. adjustment.
Gary

 

[Saltysteele]

Hey, Gary-

What is mirror lockup? I just bought the Canon remote release (rs80 or something like that). It's got where you can push the button half, and then full, but also has where it you push the button and it slides to the front and locks. Is this mirror lock up, and what does it do?

 

[gparr]

Assuming your camera has the function, and not all do, mirror lockup is a custom function that makes shooting a two-step process. The first time you push the shutter button, either on the camera or the remote release, the mirror is lifted. The second time you push the button, the shutter is released and the exposure made.

Here's why it's important in macro photography. DSLRS use a mirror to reflect the image your lens sees through a prism so you can see, through the eyepiece, what the lens sees. In normal shooting, when you release the shutter, the mirror is lifted and the shutter released immediately afterward. Needless to say, this happens very quickly.

However, the lifting of the mirror causes camera vibration as it bangs against the prism housing. At shutter speeds of 1/30 sec. and faster, the small amount of vibration doesn't matter in terms of image sharpness. But at 1/15 sec. and slower, and particularly with macro/closeup images, that small amount of vibration can cause blurring in the image. Mirror lockup allows you to raise the mirror, pause for the vibration to dissipate, then release the shutter. This eliminates one more source of vibration/image blur.

In Canon cameras, mirror lockup is a custom function that you activate/deactivate in the Custom Function menu.

Gary

 

[Saltysteele]

oh, okay, cool! i've got a 20D, not sure if it does it or not, but i'm going to look it up Thanks, gary!
Bret

 

[gparr]

I use 20D bodies, so you do have the function. Look in the menu under Custom Functions.
Gary

 

[kerrysroxy]

Well here is a run down on how I take some of my top downs.

First I do no have a photobox so its more difficult for me not , to get a white cast on my photos ( i have examples if any one wants to see)

I might buy a photo box from melev but have to wait for next year.

My tank is 20x20x12 so I get a chair and have my camera on a strap ( this is almost a must ). I wrap my camera around my arm to make my arm stiff. Scott Kelby mention this move in his book. I do have a tripod but it does not get tall enough so I use the camera strap method.

I have t5's and they sit on the edges of my rimless tank , I just slide them back and forth depending on what shot I will take.

My equipment is 20D canon , Kenko tubes , sigma 105mm lens.

So anyways I get on my chair and have strap around arm etc..
My camera is set in M and I have screen set on info ( I know how to read histogram some what) My ISO is usually from 800-1600 or some times 400. I guess I have a steady hand because my shutter speed is 1/ 40-60ish the strap is 90% the reason. Since I have a lot of refection from t5's I learned the best pics for my tank lighting is to stop down -2. My AWB is auto but I am going to try to do custom AWB soon. My pumps are off , this takes a lot of patients so my photo sessions are like 20-30 mins. If I think I got at least 5 good shots I stop turn pumps on and upload them on my comp if i am not satisfied I shoot some more.

here is a before picture see the white cast this pic was taking going by the camera meter

Here is a pic stoping down -2 and using my histogram judgement there is some noise but what do you expect with iso up at 800-1600 lol , but pic is much nicer no more white cast.

another pic

I use photoshop to sharpen images and thats it , sometimes fix a few color problems if any , but since I am getting better at reading the cameras histogram less color problems are occuring

This pic is older and I forgot if I use AV mode or M

 

[gparr]

Roxy,
When shooting top-downs try angling the light away or moving it away from the coral you're shooting to get rid of reflections. It'll look like you're shooting in shadows, but most corals aren't going anywhere and if the flow is turned off you can use slower shutter speeds to compensate.

The shots you posted are quite good. They just need a levels adjustment and the colors will pop right out. I did a quick-and-dirty job and there are a lot of artifacts because I was working with what you posted. You'll get better results working with the RAW file.

Gary

 

[kerrysroxy]

Roxy,
When shooting top-downs try angling the light away or moving it away from the coral you're shooting to get rid of reflections. It'll look like you're shooting in shadows, but most corals aren't going anywhere and if the flow is turned off you can use slower shutter speeds to compensate.

The shots you posted are quite good. They just need a levels adjustment and the colors will pop right out. I did a quick-and-dirty job and there are a lot of artifacts because I was working with what you posted. You'll get better results working with the RAW file.

Gary

i always shoot in raw and mode and the light away from corals.......... i had people alter the first pic for me and they make the picture look worst imo. the color and coral do not look like that in real life(once alter) so i deem that pic a bad pic. i think the pic with lors zoas looks a too bright the protopalys look way too saturated with color. i use photoshop on all pics to match what they look like in real life. not sure what method you use to change them?

 

[gparr]

The lack of contrast in your first image suggests that you were getting surface glare from the lights. As I stated, you'll get better results from the original. I was limited with the jpg you posted and didn't work at it very hard.

I used Levels in Photoshop on each of the images, adjusting Levels using the white and black droppers. I did add 10 points of saturation to each image. That probably wasn't needed. Regardless, your levels needed significant adjustment in each image.

Gary

 

[kerrysroxy]

The lack of contrast in your first image suggests that you were getting surface glare from the lights. As I stated, you'll get better results from the original. I was limited with the jpg you posted and didn't work at it very hard.

I used Levels in Photoshop on each of the images, adjusting Levels using the white and black droppers. I did add 10 points of saturation to each image. That probably wasn't needed. Regardless, your levels needed significant adjustment in each image.

Gary

My work flow is usually using the levels and another method ( forgot the name or tool) I need to look in my books since mac is down. The orginals are on my mac also.

I have them posted on zenfolio does this photo website keep original files ? if so I can post originals through the site. LMK

I been needing more help on adjusting the pics.

 

[gparr]

On my website, bottom left corner of the home page, you can find a link to a Word document that lays out the steps I use to process photos from RAW files. Maybe that will help you? www.gparr.com
gary