Ticking time bombs in the living room: Is it time for kit aquarium manufactures to up their game?

[Karen00]

I bought an old school Oceanic 7'x2'x2' 210gal. from Craigslist for $200. It was in rough shape with the thick fake wood plastic trim and dried out silicone. I tore it down to just the panes of glass, cleaned all the seams, resealed with pencil glass on the bottom and sides for reinforcement, then framed. (bought a low iron front pane) It doesn't have the simplistic look of a rimless or the bulky glass braces of a Euro, more of a modern industrial look. Other than the endless nagging from the wife to get the tank out of the living room and garage (spent a couple months working on it) it came out extremely nice. Anything happens I can only blame myself.

Well done! I love the look and using cables for bracing adds to the look and is very creative!!

 

[Little c big D]

my personal advice, never buy a kit tank. I’m not saying they’re all bad, but they’re made for the average customer. This is a great thing, however you lose the ability to guarantee everything component by component. All of my builds I begin from the ground up, literally checking the floor, then building the stand from dimensional lumber and an oversized safety factor. Everything is furniture grade, no particle board, only stainless fasteners and traditional joints. Then thoroughly sealed. Then the tank, be it an old AGA or a new ADA or fully custom beauty is filled to test for level and adjustments can be made and additional support added (drain tank and modify stand in shop).

That’s all before the tank is plumbed! I’m also ignoring the actual tank design and engineering.

A major manufacturer is unable to do this, especially if they need to turn a profit.

I recently reviewed the water box systems in person. They’re great for what they are. They won’t last 40 years though. The stands are good enough, but are definitely not heirloom quality nor furniture grade.

Expecting heirloom grade or furniture grade construction for an inexpensive tank that if of a great value for the consumer is ignorant. It’s a lack of understanding, and it’s easy to learn about what you’re purchasing with a little bit of effort. When housing thousands of pounds of weight, most of water, one would expect a bit of extra scrutiny.

Custom tank costs can be very very reasonable, and you generally get a very high quality. The actual price may be higher than commercially available mass market units, but that’s what a one off creation entails. Obviously you are in charge of the design/engineering and what you purchase is on you. Of course not all tank builders are created equal, and mistakes happen. Going this way requires a bit of extra knowledge on your end.

I should state I have a mix of aquariums from big AGA ones older than me, to sexy rimless designer tanks, to custom 180g acrylics, to affordable $50 15” rimless cubes (aqueon) from Petco. They all have their own merits.

The liability discussion is a bit silly to me. I recommend insurance if the tank failing may cause damage of concern.

The discussion of vehicles in comparison to aquariums is silly. However I’ll join in. My daily driven vehicle is a 1987 Porsche 928s4, it’s old enough that is does not have airbags. At the time of manufacture it was the fastest production car, and I have met people who commuted to work over 100 miles each way in 45 minutes (it was an unusual situation, I can’t endorse regardless, it was essentially a private road that was built for them) I have been in three accidents, twice while parked. The third was on the highway. I’ve been safe each time, I knowingly purchased an old potentially extremely dangerous vehicle. Porsche isn’t liable for problems that happen. I am. If I drive recklessly and am I hired or die? That’s on me. Going 120mph is increased risk of major consequences just like placing a tank with lower tolerances on an improperly constructed stand in a space that may have more bumps and external forces.

Porsche has had issues in engineering that slips past them. Occasionally they do recall parts. IMS is a great example. The thing is, the risk is known and everyone purchasing those cars is advised to have it inspected prior to purchase.

Similarly, we need to be inspecting our tanks very carefully before accepting delivery/taking it home.

In short? Risks exist and you get what you ou for. Quick fixes incur greater risk than carefully calculated and constructed solutions. Insurance and floor drains are good investments for some people.

A great counter example to everything I just wrote would be the Visitherm Stealth heaters exploding. The manufacturer was quick to make things right with those who were affected. I know if tens of thousands of dollars being sent to affected customers. Granted, defective heaters are akin to pipe bombs...

-Andrew

PS. Reaching out calmly to the manufacturer, and their teams making the problem tanks with concern and questions and potential input is often well received. It can sometimes be difficult to get the right person on the phone, one it happens though, it usually is positive.

Hold up, you may be on an aquarium forum but you won't get me with that Porsche comment. You will need to trade that car in if you want to buy the fastest production car of 1987.

 

[chaostactics]

The aesthetics of a rimless aquarium are noteworthy. Clean lines, top-down views, and the compelling physics of silicone's holding capacity. It's no wonder people are drawn to this look. With this said.. Almost daily, there's a post of rimless tank disaster, often a seam failure manifesting as a small leak or a full blown panel rupture.

I write this sitting beside a large ~500L (insert common kit tank maker) peninsula aquarium. No bottom euro bracing, no armored seams, no corner reinforcement, and the likes. The stand has what many engineers would argue is on the lower threshold of acceptable load capacity... some 1/2'' plywood or so with minimal vertical supports.

Given the reality that seams fail, earthquakes happen, people don't always perfectly level their tanks, and kids (and cats) run around... Is it time to put some pressure (pun intended) on the Red Sea, Waterbox, Cade, Innovative Marine, and other kit makers of this world to further bolster the structural integrity of their systems?

I suggest the following becomes standard options in larger kit tanks:
-Bottom eurobracing
-Corner bracing (e.g., with another small piece of glass)
-80-20 anodized aluminum stands
-Top eurobracing
-Thicker glass
-Top cross supports
-Warranty lengths extended to 5 years (original buyer only) given the retail of these systems (I'd be happy to pay more)

We are seeing some positive changes - cue Innovative Marine's metal stand and euro-brace on larger systems... Waterbox has added a second plywood support on larger systems... etc. We know the big-dog companies who make custom tanks (e.g., Reef Savvy) tend to use thick glass and have a higher surface area over which silicone is applied (e.g., armored seams), metal stand options, etc.

Thanks for your thoughts.

I've never seen bottom euro bracing a rather interesting concept and like the idea. I've seen seam braced tanks and in a 3 side viewable tank I would find it truly a deal breaker. I'm not sure what armored seams are but sounds ok probably. Under utilized is the 45 degree bevel for tank corners I think that should be standard. While not a fan of the look of upper eurobracing I am leaning more towards the IM Nuvo 200 EXT for a future peninsula vs waterboy or red sea. I like the idea of more heavy duty stands and would be willing to pay for them especially if there was an option to buy a bare stand you panel yourself.

Cross bracing is an absolute hard pass for aesthetics and shadowing. Second only to glass braced corners.*

*Aside for like a minute/tiny 45 piece just to increase surface area but I'm not sure it would be any stronger than a wider bead of silicone.

 

[Frostblitz20]

i wouldnt mind bottom euro bracing being standard as its going to be pretty much hidden anyway.

I dont really care overly about aesthetics if it means my fish are going to be safe and i dont end up getting them killed due to i cared about the looks of bracing vs the lives of my fish.

 

[ReefNerd]

Check out the video I did recently on strengthening rimless tanks with an aftermarket laser cut eurobrace

 

[Ross Petersen]

Check out the video I did recently on strengthening rimless tanks with an aftermarket laser cut eurobrace

Beauty video. It would be awesome to have this (i.e., eurobracing) as an option in the future from some of the major kit companies.

 

[BTimms]

The aesthetics of a rimless aquarium are noteworthy. Clean lines, top-down views, and the compelling physics of silicone's holding capacity. It's no wonder people are drawn to this look. With this said.. Almost daily, there's a post of rimless tank disaster, often a seam failure manifesting as a small leak or a full blown panel rupture.

I write this sitting beside a large ~500L (insert common kit tank maker) peninsula aquarium. No bottom euro bracing, no armored seams, no corner reinforcement, and the likes. The stand has what many engineers would argue is on the lower threshold of acceptable load capacity... some 1/2'' plywood or so with minimal vertical supports.

Given the reality that seams fail, earthquakes happen, people don't always perfectly level their tanks, and kids (and cats) run around... Is it time to put some pressure (pun intended) on the Red Sea, Waterbox, Cade, Innovative Marine, and other kit makers of this world to further bolster the structural integrity of their systems?

I suggest the following becomes standard options in larger kit tanks:
-Bottom eurobracing
-Corner bracing (e.g., with another small piece of glass)
-80-20 anodized aluminum stands
-Top eurobracing
-Thicker glass
-Top cross supports
-Warranty lengths extended to 5 years (original buyer only) given the retail of these systems (I'd be happy to pay more)

We are seeing some positive changes - cue Innovative Marine's metal stand and euro-brace on larger systems... Waterbox has added a second plywood support on larger systems... etc. We know the big-dog companies who make custom tanks (e.g., Reef Savvy) tend to use thick glass and have a higher surface area over which silicone is applied (e.g., armored seams), metal stand options, etc.

Thanks for your thoughts.

this hurts my eyes.

 

[dwair]

You make some good points - if the customers shift their spending, big companies will adapt. We are seeing that with a few of the big companies... finally.

Custom tank makers, I have observed, are often comparable in cost to some of the big kit companies.

Depends on the maker, its not just cost too. For example to get a Reef Saavy tank, you are looking over a year wait. Its always been my dream tank, I think they are Flawless and Felix knows what he's doing, but even though they are pricey, thats not the reason I won't get one. I'm not willing to wait over a year for my tank. I have ZERO Idea what my life is going to be like in a year. So much can change and who knows for some reason I may not even be in the hobby in that year for some god awful reason and then I've payed for a tank that won't get used and reselling something like that, you never get your money back.

whereas you can buy a Cade/Waterbox, etc and get it usually within a month depending.

 

[Dom]

The aesthetics of a rimless aquarium are noteworthy. Clean lines, top-down views, and the compelling physics of silicone's holding capacity. It's no wonder people are drawn to this look. With this said.. Almost daily, there's a post of rimless tank disaster, often a seam failure manifesting as a small leak or a full blown panel rupture.

I write this sitting beside a large ~500L (insert common kit tank maker) peninsula aquarium. No bottom euro bracing, no armored seams, no corner reinforcement, and the likes. The stand has what many engineers would argue is on the lower threshold of acceptable load capacity... some 1/2'' plywood or so with minimal vertical supports.

Given the reality that seams fail, earthquakes happen, people don't always perfectly level their tanks, and kids (and cats) run around... Is it time to put some pressure (pun intended) on the Red Sea, Waterbox, Cade, Innovative Marine, and other kit makers of this world to further bolster the structural integrity of their systems?

I suggest the following becomes standard options in larger kit tanks:
-Bottom eurobracing
-Corner bracing (e.g., with another small piece of glass)
-80-20 anodized aluminum stands
-Top eurobracing
-Thicker glass
-Top cross supports
-Warranty lengths extended to 5 years (original buyer only) given the retail of these systems (I'd be happy to pay more)

We are seeing some positive changes - cue Innovative Marine's metal stand and euro-brace on larger systems... Waterbox has added a second plywood support on larger systems... etc. We know the big-dog companies who make custom tanks (e.g., Reef Savvy) tend to use thick glass and have a higher surface area over which silicone is applied (e.g., armored seams), metal stand options, etc.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Aesthetically, I get the rimless tank concept. And for smaller tanks, I think it is a design that works well.

But when you begin getting into the 300 gallon and above range, rimless tanks make me nervous.

Much of it comes down to application. And when you start getting into larger tank sizes whose plan is, for example, to be installed in-wall, tanks with plastic trim reinforcement (Aqueon) are perfectly fine as the application permits hiding the trim that so many of us find unattractive.

 

[Pntbll687]

Aqueon and marineland offer lifetime. 5 years is pathetic even though it'd be an improvement.

This is exactly the reason I went with aqueon when seeing up my peninsula 180.

Also aqueon does custom drilling, so I had then put a single overflow on the short side, and still have a LIFETIME warranty.

The vertical seams are beautiful, but the silicone that is hidden by the brace isn't the cleanest.

I agree with OP that manufactures need to step it up with warranty and robustness of larger tank construction. I've seen some nice rimless tanks that have white anodized frame on the bottom, those look pretty nice.

Stands, I think 80/20 is only needed because the construction of the tank is suspect long term. If you look at marineland stands in most stores you say " that's gonna hold a 180g tank????" But it does, and holds for a long time as long as it stays dry.

I just don't think people are getting their money's worth when buying some of these "premium" kits. But the price floor has been established and won't move much. If WB, or RedSea were to implement all the "upgrades" OP suggested (because that's how it will be marketed) the price will only move up.

 

[paintman]

Well boys look on the bright side. Your Apex or GHL will send you a text when your tank explodes and takes out the cherry hardwood floors.

 

[Ross Petersen]

This is exactly the reason I went with aqueon when seeing up my peninsula 180.

Also aqueon does custom drilling, so I had then put a single overflow on the short side, and still have a LIFETIME warranty.

The vertical seams are beautiful, but the silicone that is hidden by the brace isn't the cleanest.

I agree with OP that manufactures need to step it up with warranty and robustness of larger tank construction. I've seen some nice rimless tanks that have white anodized frame on the bottom, those look pretty nice.

Stands, I think 80/20 is only needed because the construction of the tank is suspect long term. If you look at marineland stands in most stores you say " that's gonna hold a 180g tank????" But it does, and holds for a long time as long as it stays dry.

I just don't think people are getting their money's worth when buying some of these "premium" kits. But the price floor has been established and won't move much. If WB, or RedSea were to implement all the "upgrades" OP suggested (because that's how it will be marketed) the price will only move up.

My original post was quite forward for sure… The list of options provided originally to increase structural support was more of a this or that list. Certainly every single option would be overkill.

But if kit tank makers had a check box on the order form for bottom eurobracing, top eurobracing, armored seams, or an extra cross support panel etc., I think a healthy proportion of people would use it. Stronger seams for an extra $100 or so? Sign me up.

 

[Pntbll687]

My original post was quite forward for sure… The list of options provided originally to increase structural support was more of a this or that list. Certainly every single option would be overkill.

But if kit tank makers had a check box on the order form for bottom eurobracing, top eurobracing, armored seams, or an extra cross support panel etc., I think a healthy proportion of people would use it. Stronger seams for an extra $100 or so? Sign me up.

Oh, got it! I thought you wanted all of that.

But al la carte options would be awesome.

 

[Cool tangs]

Its actually cheaper to custom build and you can build it to your taste. Much better then paying some crazy amount for generic box.

I guess they have there place though, quick out the box experience.

I guess rimless if just the current fashion. What the old saying "looking good is pain" I guess thats the pain of not know when that things going to give.

 

[CanuckReefer]

As I sit down for my Sunday night movie, I see this.... ticking time bomb with my pre made kit in front of my face... hope it keeps holding up lol!

 

[c_healy]

This is why I went with glass cages. Got a rimless 80 and the bottom is eurobraced.
I am so freaking happy with this tank. They did amazing work and I have zero worries about it’s integrity.