Suddly agressive pair of clowns.

[AliceInCloud]

So I have a pair of clowns. They are already paired and have been existing well together for months now. Recently the bigger of the two has started to bully the small one. His fins have been ripped up and his chin looks shredded. Thus has been going on for awhile now. I didn't think much of it at first and contributed it to the fact that I added some new coral that the big one became extreamly possessiveness over. But I'm also not sure if this is the reason because the two would often share anemones but not it's like they have unpaired? Can this happen?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

So I have a pair of clowns. They are already paired and have been existing well together for months now. Recently the bigger of the two has started to bully the small one. His fins have been ripped up and his chin looks shredded. Thus has been going on for awhile now. I didn't think much of it at first and contributed it to the fact that I added some new coral that the big one became extreamly possessiveness over. But I'm also not sure if this is the reason because the two would often share anemones but not it's like they have unpaired? Can this happen?

Welcome to Reef2Reef!

Yes, clownfish compatibility is really dynamic and can change rapidly. Depending on the level of damage, you may need to separate them.

If you can post a video of their interactions, we might be able to assess it further.

 

[Jekyl]

Adding to Jay above sometimes the best way to get a video is when we're not in the room. Fish behave when being watched. Separation can be done with an acclimation box right in the tank. Put the bully in time out for 2 weeks. Allowing the injured free roam and time to heal.


Welcome to R2R!

 

[AliceInCloud]

The damage is pretty bad he is gasping and all his fins are torn. He also has a white patch on his chin which I'm nor sure if he hit something and got an infected wound or maybe the other one bit him.

I'm not home right now but was planning on separating them tonight. Was going to take the bigger one out I thought moving the small one may just make his condition worse? I'm just don't understand why they would suddenly clash like this. Will it hurt to separate a pair? Can they unpair and repair with other clowns? Is this normal?

 

[Jekyl]

The damage is pretty bad he is gasping and all his fins are torn. He also has a white patch on his chin which I'm nor sure if he hit something and got an infected wound or maybe the other one bit him.

I'm not home right now but was planning on separating them tonight. Was going to take the bigger one out I thought moving the small one may just make his condition worse? I'm just don't understand why they would suddenly clash like this. Will it hurt to separate a pair? Can they unpair and repair with other clowns? Is this normal?

Unfortunately the main opinion of clowns come from Disney movies. In reality they are nasty little jerks. Posting some white light photos and a video will help ensure best course of action.

 

[exnisstech]

Just because they've been together does not mean they are a bonded pair. Do a search and you'll see many people have the same issue when they add two at the same time and assume they will form a pair. In my limited experience the best way to pair clowns is put one in alone and wait a year or so to be sure that one has transitioned to female then add the smallest male you can find. I've had 100% success doing it that way even with maroons which can be difficult to pair.

 

[AliceInCloud]

Just because they've been together does not mean they are a bonded pair. Do a search and you'll see many people have the same issue when they add two at the same time and assume they will form a pair. In my limited experience the best way to pair clowns is put one in alone and wait a year or so to be sure that one has transitioned to female then add the smallest male you can find. I've had 100% success doing it that way even with maroons which can be difficult to pair.

I'm not sure how to know for sure that they bonded but yes the larger one was in the tank first for a few months then we got the smallest we could find. He is half her size that said they did fight at first for about half a week then got along really well. They would swim right next to each other and sleep in the same spot and share anemones without an issue for about half a year I think until a week ago. I just don't know if it's something I did like putting in some new fluffy coral or if the big one just suddenly got moody enough to kill. I'm baffled. Ik clowns are aggressive and when putting two together there's a chance of losing one or both I just thought I had gotten past that stage. I will try to get some Pics or a video if I can when I get home later today. If there's anything yall can think of that could of led to this or if it's just how it is let me know. If I separate them with glass instead of moving them to different tanks would they get along again? Do they just have mood swings? I have a puffer and angel in the tank as well and these clowns are still very young. The clowns leave the other fish alone. It's only the small one that gets attacked

 

[Jekyl]

I'm not sure how to know for sure that they bonded but yes the larger one was in the tank first for a few months then we got the smallest we could find. He is half her size that said they did fight at first for about half a week then got along really well. They would swim right next to each other and sleep in the same spot and share anemones without an issue for about half a year I think until a week ago. I just don't know if it's something I did like putting in some new fluffy coral or if the big one just suddenly got moody enough to kill. I'm baffled. Ik clowns are aggressive and when putting two together there's a chance of losing one or both I just thought I had gotten past that stage. I will try to get some Pics or a video if I can when I get home later today. If there's anything yall can think of that could of led to this or if it's just how it is let me know. If I separate them with glass instead of moving them to different tanks would they get along again? Do they just have mood swings? I have a puffer and angel in the tank as well and these clowns are still very young. The clowns leave the other fish alone. It's only the small one that gets attacked

Putting the bully in an acclimation box for a couple weeks or rescaping their home area can help.

 

[exnisstech]

No way to no for sure but I sounds like they may have been bonded. I've just read too many reports of incidents like yours where things are fine for a few months and then the fighting starts. That's why I choose such long time before I add the second. I'm far from an expert but I've never had a pair of clowns decide to unpair once I've paired them. I have had some that did not pair but that occurs soon not months later IME. Seperating them may help but if the smaller one has decided it wants to transition I know of no way to stop that and it usually ends up in a death unless they are permanently seperated.

EDIT : I've never had adding coral or rearranging the tank cause a bonded pair to start fighting. Again this is JME

 

[AliceInCloud]

Putting the bully in an acclimation box for a couple weeks or rescaping their home area can help.

I will try this before completely switching the tanks of the two. Thank you for your suggestion I hadn't thought about mixing up the landscape. I had saw someone else on another thread suggestion to someone with a similar problem to get some more anemones to drink the aggressor clowns territory also could this possibly help?

 

[fish farmer]

Putting the bully in an acclimation box for a couple weeks or rescaping their home area can help.

Just be mindful of rescaping.

My 16+ year old mating clowns threw me for a loop last year. I pulled their rock out, I believe it did have eggs on it. Even with a new rock/coral in the same place the female got VERY aggressive with the male....like it was his fault. He got pushed to a far corner of the tank under rocks, beat up fins, wouldn't come out to eat. Always got chased when he came out. This was going on for about a week, but I was able to get some food in him and eventually the female started to take a liking to my frammer, eventually the male followed. I didn't have any issues when I broke their frammer apart BUT did replace most of the pieces in the same spot.

They are a happy couple again...whatever that means.

 

[AliceInCloud]

No way to no for sure but I sounds like they may have been bonded. I've just read too many reports of incidents like yours where things are fine for a few months and then the fighting starts. That's why I choose such long time before I add the second. I'm far from an expert but I've never had a pair of clowns decide to unpair once I've paired them. I have had some that did not pair but that occurs soon not months later IME. Seperating them may help but if the smaller one has decided it wants to transition I know of no way to stop that and it usually ends up in a death unless they are permanently seperated.

So there is no way to know if two have bonded for sure? What happens when you separate two that have bonded? Will they unbond or get depressed? If they hadn't bonded after all, then there shouldn't be any issues separating them i would think. I just don't know if there's any repercussions to separation after they bond. If they did that is. And if they are bonded I would rather sove the issue without permanent separation.

 

[exnisstech]

Sorry I have never seperated a bonded pair. I have had one of a pair die. If female dies the male transitions to female. If a male dies I can't say if it bothers the female because they don't really show emotions as we know it. They just keep eating and doing what they did before but alone.
At this point removing the aggressor as suggested would probably be the best bet. Maybe even an acclimation box in the same tank.

 

[AliceInCloud]

Just be mindful of rescaping.

My 16+ year old mating clowns threw me for a loop last year. I pulled their rock out, I believe it did have eggs on it. Even with a new rock/coral in the same place the female got VERY aggressive with the male....like it was his fault. He got pushed to a far corner of the tank under rocks, beat up fins, wouldn't come out to eat. Always got chased when he came out. This was going on for about a week, but I was able to get some food in him and eventually the female started to take a liking to my frammer, eventually the male followed. I didn't have any issues when I broke their frammer apart BUT did replace most of the pieces in the same spot.

They are a happy couple again...whatever that means.

That both a sad and cute story lol. Happy endings are great I don't think it's possible for mine to lay eggs? The bigger is about as wide as a guys thumb and the smaller about a ladies thumb but fish thin lol hope that made some sense. They have both grown since I got them but not by much. That said i dont know their ages just that they were both very small when i got them and havent grown much. I wouldn't think that would be the reason but I'm not excluding anything right now.

 

[AliceInCloud]

Sorry I have never seperated a bonded pair. I have had one of a pair die. If female dies the male transitions to female. If a male dies I can't say if it bothers the female because they don't really show emotions as we know it. They just keep eating and doing what they did before but alone.
At this point removing the aggressor as suggested would probably be the best bet. Maybe even an acclimation box in the same tank.

That's reassuring. In the stores some only sell them as bonded if they have a pair already so I was scared of some unfortunate outcome. (Cant be worse then the one dying) But it sounds like there may not be much to worry about. Thanks for they help guys.

 

[exnisstech]

Let us know how it goes.

 

[Jekyl]

I will try this before completely switching the tanks of the two. Thank you for your suggestion I hadn't thought about mixing up the landscape. I had saw someone else on another thread suggestion to someone with a similar problem to get some more anemones to drink the aggressor clowns territory also could this possibly help?

Mine got more aggressive once hosted.