Stray voltage and is a grounding probe needed?

[vdubers]

Hi so I added a new automatic water changer and noticed when I put my hand in my tank I can feel a slight electrical charge. And if I have a cut then I can feel pain on the cut.

I have used a multimeter and I have around 22 volts in the water. If I turn off the water changer I don’t feel the tingle any more but still have around 16 volts in the water. If I turn off heaters this goes down to around 12 volts. Then periodically goes down while turning things off.

I can’t see any issues with any wires in the aquarium the only thing I can think is that the new water changer uses an optical float sensor and also a sensor on the discharge pump to detect low water.

Would a grounding probe be a good idea or a bad idea? Thanks

 

[Jamie814]

Would a grounding probe be a good idea or a bad idea?

Is everything on a GCFI outlet or inline GFCI breaker?

If not grounding probes are very dangerous.

 

[GlassMunky]

Yes I would find out what’s causing the voltage and replace that item

You shouldn’t have any stray voltage in the tank

 

[Doctorgori]

sideways sorta… but you feeling the “ tingle” with unbroken skin or does your hand have a cut? ( it does matter believe it or not)
…. btw, Has the ground probe ( or not) been fully settled ? I recall some lengthy debates on the topic

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi so I added a new automatic water changer and noticed when I put my hand in my tank I can feel a slight electrical charge. And if I have a cut then I can feel pain on the cut.

I have used a multimeter and I have around 22 volts in the water. If I turn off the water changer I don’t feel the tingle any more but still have around 16 volts in the water. If I turn off heaters this goes down to around 12 volts. Then periodically goes down while turning things off.

I can’t see any issues with any wires in the aquarium the only thing I can think is that the new water changer uses an optical float sensor and also a sensor on the discharge pump to detect low water.

Would a grounding probe be a good idea or a bad idea? Thanks

I run a grounding probe full time but its an alternative and not a solution. If you feel tingling, you have a voltage leakage and is often from a flow pump, heater or return pump.
Unplug a powerhead and see if the tingling stops. If not, go to next component such as return pump and see if it stops and so forth

 

[vdubers]

Is everything on a GCFI outlet or inline GFCI breaker?

If not grounding probes are very dangerous.

I am in the UK and the circuit that the tank is on is on an RCD which I think is the same as a GCFI.

sideways sorta… but you feeling the “ tingle” with unbroken skin or does your hand have a cut? ( it does matter believe it or not)
…. btw, Has the ground probe ( or not) been fully settled ? I recall some lengthy debates on the topic

I get the tingle with my little finger with no cuts and if I put my thumb in with a cut on I can feel it clearly on the cut

 

[vdubers]

Yes I would find out what’s causing the voltage and replace that item

You shouldn’t have any stray voltage in the tank

Thanks I know the tingle part of the voltage is coming from the new AWC I installed. Even when the pump isn’t in use but is plugged in. However everything in the tank will raise the voltage slightly as I turn it on so I will always be reading some volts it is just only the AWC that is causing the tingle.

I run a grounding probe full time but it’s an alternative and not a solution. If you feel tingling, you have a voltage leakage and is often from a flow pump, heater or return pump.
Unplug a powerhead and see if the tingling stops. If not, go to next component such as return pump and see if it stops and so forth

Thanks I know the tingle is from the AWC however it is brand new so not sure why it is doing it. Would the optical water level sensors be causing it?

 

[GlassMunky]

Thanks I know the tingle part of the voltage is coming from the new AWC I installed. Even when the pump isn’t in use but is plugged in. However everything in the tank will raise the voltage slightly as I turn it on so I will always be reading some volts it is just only the AWC that is causing the tingle.

Thanks I know the tingle is from the AWC however it is brand new so not sure why it is doing it. Would the optical water level sensors be causing it?

thats not normal. something is very wrong.
you shouldnt be getting stray voltage from every item plugged in on your tank.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Thanks I know the tingle part of the voltage is coming from the new AWC I installed. Even when the pump isn’t in use but is plugged in. However everything in the tank will raise the voltage slightly as I turn it on so I will always be reading some volts it is just only the AWC that is causing the tingle.

Thanks I know the tingle is from the AWC however it is brand new so not sure why it is doing it. Would the optical water level sensors be causing it?

Sensors I doubt and being new, I would reach out to manufacturer and even consider a different brand.

 

[vdubers]

thats not normal. something is very wrong.
you shouldnt be getting stray voltage from every item plugged in on your tank.

Ah really I thought a small amount was normal? In all fairness saying everything was an over exaggeration on my part. However I am getting around 6 volts from my dual 300w heaters plugged into an INKBIRD. Then another 3 from my back up 300w heater plugged into my second INKBIRD (when I force them all to be on) I would be surprised if they are all faulty and leaking 3 volts each?

Sensors I doubt and being new, I would reach out to manufacturer and even consider a different brand.

Yeah that’s a good shout. I have contacted the seller but they are Chinese and I am having a hard enough time trying to explain the issue without the language barrier

 

[theMeat]

A ground probe paired with gfci is the only way to go imo. A ground probe without a gfci is downright dangerous

 

[GlassMunky]

Ah really I thought a small amount was normal? In all fairness saying everything was an over exaggeration on my part. However I am getting around 6 volts from my dual 300w heaters plugged into an INKBIRD. Then another 3 from my back up 300w heater plugged into my second INKBIRD (when I force them all to be on) I would be surprised if they are all faulty and leaking 3 volts each?



Yeah that’s a good shout. I have contacted the seller but they are Chinese and I am having a hard enough time trying to explain the issue without the language barrier

heaters are usually the #1 culprit.

 

[vdubers]

In case anyone is interested here are all my readings with only that piece of equipment on.

0.5 with everything off
Xepta autobalance 1.3
Uv on 1.7
Return pump 1.2
AWC 3
Wave maker left 2
Algae return pump 2.3
Wave maker right 3.1
Skimmer 2.8
Back up heater 3.7
Fuge light 1.6
Dual heaters 4.7
led 1.5
T5 1.3



Everything on 22 volts

All my equipment can’t all be faulty? Very surprised other people don’t get similar results?


This is without a ground probe or titanium heaters as I have read that titanium heaters can act as a ground probe.

I’m thinking rather than it being the AWC that is the culprit it is a culmination of them all that makes me feel it? It just has to get to around 20 volts for me to be able to notice the sensation?

Also if I use a temporary ground probe I don’t feel the tingle at all and voltage drops. However isn’t a ground probe just masking it rather than actually changing it for the fish or corals?

 

[Freenow54]

Is everything on a GCFI outlet or inline GFCI breaker?

If not grounding probes are very dangerous.

It does not matter if there is a GFI it only checks voltage in and out of the equipment itself. This is stray voltage if not cords than the integrity of the seal on the equipment. They ie you will become the path to ground if they make a good one. I don't

know what is meant by ground probe. I have this. Yes the voltage is still there but has a path to ground. It plugs into a receptacle

 

[theMeat]

That’s a ground probe

 

[Jamie814]

It does not matter if there is a GFI it only checks voltage in and out of the equipment itself.

A GFCI does not check/monitor voltage, it monitors amps or milliamps to be exact.
It will not prevent stray voltage.

120 volts will not kill you; heck 50,000 volts will not kill you, most stun guns are at least 30,000 volts.

It's the amps behind the volts that kills you. Less than 1/2 amp can kill and most household outlets are 15-20 amps. Running a grounding probe without GFCI protection can kill you. Electricity is going to take any path it can to ground. A tank that becomes energized with electricity with a grounding probe will generally run fine unnoticed as the tank water becomes part of the circuit UNTIL you put your hand in the water. Now it has another path to the ground or neutral side of the circuit - through your body - very bad and deadly.

A tank with a grounding probe and GFCI will protect the user by immediately tripping when there becomes an imbalance in milliamps out and back into the outlet, cutting the power - protecting the user from electrocution.

 

[Freenow54]

A GFCI does not check/monitor voltage, it monitors amps or milliamps to be exact.
It will not prevent stray voltage.

120 volts will not kill you; heck 50,000 volts will not kill you, most stun guns are at least 30,000 volts.

It's the amps behind the volts that kills you. Less than 1/2 amp can kill and most household outlets are 15-20 amps. Running a grounding probe without GFCI protection can kill you. Electricity is going to take any path it can to ground. A tank that becomes energized with electricity with a grounding probe will generally run fine unnoticed as the tank water becomes part of the circuit UNTIL you put your hand in the water. Now it has another path to the ground or neutral side of the circuit - through your body - very bad and deadly.

A tank with a grounding probe and GFCI will protect the user by immediately tripping when there becomes an imbalance in milliamps out and back into the outlet, cutting the power - protecting the user from electrocution.

Absolutely beautiful explanation except voltage is the driver. Did not know it would trip the gfi. How would that happen as your body would not be in series, and hopefully would not rob ie run to ground If I remember correctly the amperage need to kill you is in the decimal places. You should explain the function of Arc protection and its importance. I almost lost my house because of that I had no drip leg on the power cords and water ran down on to my power bar GFI. It does not trip the GFI but the arcing melted the bar. I just happened to come home and smelled the ozone. The power bar had just started to melt. Don't know what would have actually happened

 

[TehBrainz]

I run a grounding probe full time but its an alternative and not a solution. If you feel tingling, you have a voltage leakage and is often from a flow pump, heater or return pump.
Unplug a powerhead and see if the tingling stops. If not, go to next component such as return pump and see if it stops and so forth

So, in your opinion, is it best to have a grounding probe in both the sump and the main display since we have electrical equipment in both sections (assuming most people have wavemakers in the DT)?

This has started to become more of a concern for me after I was shocked in my mixing tank from a wavemaker that "suddenly" leaked electricity into the bin.

 

[vetteguy53081]

So, in your opinion, is it best to have a grounding probe in both the sump and the main display since we have electrical equipment in both sections (assuming most people have wavemakers in the DT)?

This has started to become more of a concern for me after I was shocked in my mixing tank from a wavemaker that "suddenly" leaked electricity into the bin.

I have both as a safety

 

[theMeat]

Absolutely beautiful explanation except voltage is the driver. Did not know it would trip the gfi. How would that happen as your body would not be in series, and hopefully would not rob ie run to ground If I remember correctly the amperage need to kill you is in the decimal places. You should explain the function of Arc protection and its importance. I almost lost my house because of that I had no drip leg on the power cords and water ran down on to my power bar GFI. It does not trip the GFI but the arcing melted the bar. I just happened to come home and smelled the ozone. The power bar had just started to melt. Don't know what would have actually happened

Would guess your power bar gfi was faulty or not properly grounded. Would also recommend your ground probe gets plugged directly into a wall receptacle where the ground has been tested, and not into an extension cord of any kind, as it says just that on your package that you posted a pic of.
With that said afci are to help prevent fires.
Gfci are not to prevent fires, they are designed to protect you from electrocution.