Self Level Mat or Shims?

[C4ctus99]

This may be the wrong forum for this, if so my b.

Getting a new 75g set up on a home made stand. Close to level, but one corner needs to come up about 1/8”. What is y’all’s experience with the self leveling mats vs shimming and what is the recommendation? It is a wooden stand, pine 2x4s and oak 1bys for finish

 

[bradreef]

Rimmed 75? If so. The top surface needs to be completely flat. Then level the stand with shims. I used a piece of granite for my top so i knew that was flat.

 

[C4ctus99]

Rimmed 75? If so. The top surface needs to be completely flat. Then level the stand with shims. I used a piece of granite for my top so i knew that was flat.

Yes, rimmed Aqueon 75. Shim bottom of stand so top is flat?

 

[Red_Beard]

I had a similar issue with the top of my stand being a little out of level. I used self leveling marine epoxy on the top. Looks wonderful and has held up very well, 75 gallon just like yours. Tank on stand and full now about 4 years.
Whatever route you go, either the mat under the tank or the shims under the stand make sure the whole tank rim is supported.

 

[bradreef]

Yes, rimmed Aqueon 75. Shim bottom of stand so top is flat?

Typical yes. Just ensure the entire rim is flat and especially the 4 corners dont have gaps. I use a business card or similar.

 

[C4ctus99]

I had a similar issue with the top of my stand being a little out of level. I used self leveling marine epoxy on the top. Looks wonderful and has held up very well, 75 gallon just like yours. Tank on stand and full now about 4 years.
Whatever route you go, either the mat under the tank or the shims under the stand make sure the whole tank rim is supported.

It has a certain amount of support around the rim, my understanding from perusing the forums was that the corners are the important part due to the rigidity of the glass compared to wood along the full rim. Most of the support for my stand is on the corners but I’ll double check the horizontal supports and make certain they’re good.

I like the marine epoxy idea! I’ll have to look into finding some and experimenting

 

[C4ctus99]

Has anyone tried using the self leveling mats?

 

[Red_Beard]

It has a certain amount of support around the rim, my understanding from perusing the forums was that the corners are the important part due to the rigidity of the glass compared to wood along the full rim. Most of the support for my stand is on the corners but I’ll double check the horizontal supports and make certain they’re good.

I like the marine epoxy idea! I’ll have to look into finding some and experimenting

Pro marine is what i used, if that helps. Some brands remain semi fluid and will dent after time, this hardens completely.

 

[PotatoPig]

If it’s a rimmed tank then make sure the corners are 100% supported.

These tanks span from one end to the other. If in doubt check out your LFS (if they have any large tanks on racks) - they’ll be supported on a solid bracket at each end only. There might be a small steel angle running along the sides but it isn’t doing anything - often you can see a gap between it and the tank the whole length.

Same deal with the metal stands these tank companies sell - many of them have an automatic gap along the length of the tank, because they’re designed for support at the corners.

 

[rtparty]

Mats don’t self level. You need to get the top totally flat

 

[malacoda]

You need to shim the leg of the stand ... or the corners of the rimmed tank.

Self-leveling mats won't make up for an out of level stand. They only used for rimless tanks to alleviate small pressure points that may be present on the stand surface due to imperfections in the surface.

For example, large grains of dirt trapped in any paint or wood finish ... or an unnoticed screw tip barely peaking through a cabinet top from the underside (extreme example) ... will create pressure points on the bottom glass panel of a rimless tank and could very likely cause the bottom panel to crack and fail. A self-leveling mat will compress around these small imperfections to 'absorb and distribute' them to alleviate the pressure point.

They actually have nothing to do with making a tank or waterline level with respect to the ground.

 

[C4ctus99]

You need to shim the leg of the stand ... or the corners of the rimmed tank.

Self-leveling mats won't make up for an out of level stand. They only used for rimless tanks to alleviate small pressure points that may be present on the stand surface due to imperfections in the surface.

For example, large grains of dirt trapped in any paint or wood finish ... or an unnoticed screw tip barely peaking through a cabinet top from the underside (extreme example) ... will create pressure points on the bottom glass panel of a rimless tank and could very likely cause the bottom panel to crack and fail. A self-leveling mat will compress around these small imperfections to 'absorb and distribute' them to alleviate the pressure point.

They actually have nothing to do with making a tank or waterline level with respect to the ground.

That makes sense, thanks! Going to move the stand to its final location and work on getting it properly shimmed and leveled this week

 

[Gtinnel]

The top of the stand needs to be flat. On my tank I used composite shims between the stand and the floor to level the stand.

 

[minorhero]

Do not put a mat (or Styrofoam or anything else) under a rimmed tank. The reason why is that the bottom pane of glass is not meant to touch anything other then the rim. If you put a mat underneath it, the rim will sink into the mat and potentially the mat will touch the bottom pane putting pressure there. That's when tanks crack explosively and not necessarily right away.

Shim the bottom of the stand so that the top is flat. Notice I said, 'flat' not level. Level just means the stand is perpendicular to earths gravity. What matters is that all parts of the stand are within the same plane. It needs to be flat.

If your stand can not be made flat with shims, it means you made a bad stand, and need to redo it.

 

[Gtinnel]

If your stand can not be made flat with shims, it means you made a bad stand, and need to redo it.

They could also plane or sand it down flat.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I use both. Recent 400g is shimmed at stand but also sits on 3/4" plywood with foam on top for level mat

 

[C4ctus99]

One corner sits 1/8" up over the other corners, so provided it is the same issue after I move it, just going to shave off the bottom of that leg.

@minorhero out of curiosity, I understand the whole "flat" vs "lvl" statement, but how does one verify that the top is perfectly flat, much less if it ends up on an uneven surface?

 

[minorhero]

One corner sits 1/8" up over the other corners, so provided it is the same issue after I move it, just going to shave off the bottom of that leg.

@minorhero out of curiosity, I understand the whole "flat" vs "lvl" statement, but how does one verify that the top is perfectly flat, much less if it ends up on an uneven surface?

You need a straight edge to see if something is flat. Preferably a straight edge that is long enough to stretch between the two farthest corners, but you can sort of get by with one that is a little shorter. To further confuse the difference, most people's straight edge is..... a level. In order to see if the top of the tank is flat when you have a solid topped tank, you put your straight edge down on the surface and move it around. A dead flat top will have no light showing between the straight edge and the top. If your stand is not the kind with a solid top, you would need to temporarily create a solid by putting down some plywood and seeing if the straight edge touches the sides/corners as you move it around. If one or more side/corner is not being touched by the straight edge as you move it around, you will know that those areas are lower then the opposing side.

 

[Dro127]

Im facing the same issue. There so many 50/50 Ideas against foam or mat or shims. This is a Aqueon 210 rimmed. Left front corner has a gap but the tank over all is level. So from reading, this should be shimmed at the stand? Or at the the bottom of the tank?

I've been through a tank crack from stress - trying to avoid that again.

 

[C4ctus99]

View attachment 3092529View attachment 3092532
Im facing the same issue. There so many 50/50 Ideas against foam or mat or shims. This is a Aqueon 210 rimmed. Left front corner has a gap but the tank over all is level. So from reading, this should be shimmed at the stand? Or at the the bottom of the tank?

I've been through a tank crack from stress - trying to avoid that again.

I would definitely do something, if it is only one corner, either shave off the other 3 or just shim that one. I’m going to move my stand to it’s final spot today, but I only have 1 corner too high so I’m just going to shave it down