Pukani Rock and Phosphates

[jaws789832]

still don't understand why people recommend acid. You really want bleach to oxidize the organic

The acid dissolves the outermost layer of the rock therefore causing all the stuff that is stuck to the outermost layer to just fall off (which on Pukani rock is a lot of stuff). I tried bleaching a few pieces and it barely removed anything. I only let irt soak in the bleach for about an hour and nothing got removed that I could tell whereas the acid took it all off in half the time

 

[Mandrew]

I don't understand why anyone uses bleach or acid, sounds to me like you still have to wait weeks at a time for the rocks to soak anyways so why take the risk as well as "melt" some of your rocks? Throw it in a bucket of heated saltwater with good flow for a few weeks and then put it in your tank. Less work, same time period, safe.

 

[Idoc]

OK... I'm going to go ahead and order some Pukani Rock today. Need to find a container I can soak it in IN THE GARAGE !!! (Don't want that smell in the house). I will fill the container with just water and put a couple of pumps in there to create some flow and just leave it for 2 or 3 weeks.
* Is it OK if it is exposed to low (cold) temperatures in the garage ? It is still winter, and the garage gets a little chilly at night.

I recommend putting a heater in the tub with the rock and set the temp to around 82 degrees. I've read several places that the added heat also helps to speed up the decay process of the organics...some set the temp around 85 to increase this process.

 

[jaws789832]

I don't understand why anyone uses bleach or acid, sounds to me like you still have to wait weeks at a time for the rocks to soak anyways so why take the risk as well as "melt" some of your rocks? Throw it in a bucket of heated saltwater with good flow for a few weeks and then put it in your tank. Less work, same time period, safe.

If you have ever had BRS pukani before It will take way more than a few weeks. More like a few months of soaking Probably pushing 6 months to get it all out. It is just covered with dead sponges and what not. Mine arrived brown to black in color and in a few weeks after the acid wash it was pure white and ready to go in the tank with no phosphates and nitrates in the curing water. It doesn't have to be done but it sure does speed things up and eliminates all potential future problems of phosphates leaching. My tank has pretty much been algae free from day 1 and I am pretty sure it is because I took the extra steps to make sure my rock was phosphate free from the begining

 

[waxhawreefer]

I'm basically in the same boat as you! I purchased 50lb Pukani from BRS. I hand picked off all the dead/loose debri I could see with pliers and scrubbed the rocks with a stiff plastic bristles. I wasn't concerned with starting my bacterial cycle yet since I planned on aquascaping the rocks completely dry first, so I soaked my Pukani in dechlorinated freshwater in a Rubbermaid tub keeping the temperature around 82 degrees and using a couple of powerheads...I did this for about 6 weeks. During that time, I did several water changes...the first week it smelled rough while the debri decayed. I was testing the water routinely to see what was going on with the decay process...ammonia obviously went through the roof. It did start to leach a bunch of phosphates, so I put a bag of Phosguard in the stream path of one of the powerheads and that cleared out the phosphates pretty well when changing the Phosguard about every 4 days. I also regularly scrubbed the rocks with a plastic bristle brush before a water change just to break off any remaining surface junk. After about 6 weeks, the phosphates were leveling off and remaining very low...although still present...so I stopped the cure process and let the rock completely dry out. I'm in the process of playing with the aquascape now.

I think I would do this process again. Some said I could have put this directly into my tank and cured/cycled at the same time, but I'm glad I didn't. From everything I've read, there is going to be a fight with the algae during the cycle anyhow, so hopefully my process has reduced the phosphates present enough to keep that somewhat under control...I'll probably still keep a bag of Phosguard in the sump during the cycle to help control any additional phosphates present. I might as well...my LFS guy sold me a huge container of it...I think I got taken there a little, lol.

Basically did the same with about 55 of BRS pukani, u think u got everything off of it, but I don't, it's been in my display for close to two months, took 6 weeks to cycle, now going threw the diatoms, my phosphates were at .68, I used phosphate rx, now they are about .03, great stuff, its soak spray soak spray hopefully I can get my nitrates down!!

 

[jeff williams]

Carribsea is dry rock that they have sort of painted or dipped in bacteria that gets activated once it's wet right ? I need to research more about the success of using this type of rock and whether or not it really works to seed the tank with bacteria, because this rock is kind of expensive. I don't mind paying extra if it really works, but I'd like to hear more from others who have used it as to what their experience with it was.

Caribsea life rock is the painted and has dormant bacteria on it. The Caribsea base rock is mined ancient ocean rock it comes clean and no need to cure. The bacteria they used to seed the rock if it's like the bacteria in there live sand it will start to cycle as soon as you add ammonia

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I don't understand why anyone uses bleach or acid, sounds to me like you still have to wait weeks at a time for the rocks to soak anyways so why take the risk as well as "melt" some of your rocks? Throw it in a bucket of heated saltwater with good flow for a few weeks and then put it in your tank. Less work, same time period, safe.

Same time? No.

You need not wait weeks. That's one reason. Days at most.

Bleaching doesn't remove any of the rock but does remove dead organism tissue.

Acid rapidily removes surface crud such as phosphate on the calcium carbonate surface.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

The acid dissolves the outermost layer of the rock therefore causing all the stuff that is stuck to the outermost layer to just fall off (which on Pukani rock is a lot of stuff). I tried bleaching a few pieces and it barely removed anything. I only let irt soak in the bleach for about an hour and nothing got removed that I could tell whereas the acid took it all off in half the time

1 h is not long enough to dissolve a large dead organism with bleach.

 

[esse]

stupid question.. but I couldn't find anything describing how to dispose of the bleach water after the soak
Are there any precautions that I should take in disposing of the water after soaking?

 

[jaws789832]

I just pour if on the ground in a sunny non planted area. I have heard that Sunshine (UV) breaks down bleach to basically salt. A drain will work as well if you have one handy.

 

[Kyle Rinker]

Not long ago I did a cure of Pukani for a new setup. It may take longer, but I would use the method described by BRS. It certainly worked well for me. Soak the rock in tubs (outdoors of course) in bleach water for 4 weeks with a power head running. Drain the water and then use a quality dechlorinater and run the tubs again with RODI water for 4 weeks. Change the water every week at this point and use a chlorine test kit to make sure you don't have chlorine issues. You should test phospoates at least weekly from day 1. When the phosphates stop rising, the dead organisms will essentially be removed but your rock will still need cycled. You can put them in your tank at this point. A little patience at first will save much frustration with chasing nutrients later. For what its worth, I would still use a phosphate removal method such as GFO.

 

[Kryssie]

This is the method I used with my Pukani for my Nuvo20 and also the method I will be using when I start my Reefer350 next month.

I’m buying my Pukani now so that as soon as I get it I can power wash it, soak it in bleach 2 weeks, then soak it in salt water 6 weeks.

While I’m babying my rocks in the garage, I’ll be building my tank in the house and setting up all my electronics and aesthetics. It seems like a lot of work, but it’s honestly the same amount of work as having to brush your rocks everyday when they grow hair algae. The less ugly in my tank now, the better.

 

[KJAG]

As for the Muratic Acid wash... I don't think I would recommend it with the Pukani. The reason...I just acid washed some rock that came with the tank I purchased from a guy. I only kept the rock in the Muratic acid (10:1 ratio) for approx 40 min and it really ate away quite a bit of the rock. The Pukani is such a beautiful rock, I would hate to see its surface destroyed from the acid...hence the reason I chose not to do it with my Pukani but rather follow the procedure I mentioned in the message above!

But if you do go the Muratic acid route...definitely use some gloves and eye protection...no matter how carefully you pour the acid into the water, it will still splash up a bit.

40 mins is way too long to do an MA dip. 15 mins max to remove (most) organics without stripping away the actual structure of the rock.

 

[Kryssie]

I’m not sure if this has been linked here before, but BRS had a good BRStv Investigates segment about the various methods of curing rock.

 

[waxhawreefer]

This is the method I used with my Pukani for my Nuvo20 and also the method I will be using when I start my Reefer350 next month.

I’m buying my Pukani now so that as soon as I get it I can power wash it, soak it in bleach 2 weeks, then soak it in salt water 6 weeks.

While I’m babying my rocks in the garage, I’ll be building my tank in the house and setting up all my electronics and aesthetics. It seems like a lot of work, but it’s honestly the same amount of work as having to brush your rocks everyday when they grow hair algae. The less ugly in my tank now, the better.

How much rock?? 20-30lbs?? I have that **** rock, wouldn’t use it again, for that small tank Buy reef saver, Marco rock, when u go thru that much work , it isn’t worth it, my $.02

 

[Kryssie]

How much rock?? 20-30lbs?? I have that **** rock, wouldn’t use it again, for that small tank Buy reef saver, Marco rock, when u go thru that much work , it isn’t worth it, my $.02

I have 25lbs. I’ve already done it once, and it didn’t take any effort. With my Reefer350 I’m going to be slowly gathering equipment anyway, so I might as well do the bleach/ curing process with the (IMO) better looking, more porous rock while I’m waiting for all my equipment to get here. Then by the time I have everything, all I have to do is add water and sand and let it cycle.

 

[Idoc]

40 mins is way too long to do an MA dip. 15 mins max to remove (most) organics without stripping away the actual structure of the rock.

Actually, the rock I procured from someone was so heavily encrusted with thick algae that the first acid wash for 20 min still left deeply imbedded spots of algae...the second acid wash for 40 min cleared it all out to "new" looking dry rock. 15 min may work for minor organics embedded, but not all of them. Definitely always start with a lower time first, though...or you do risk the loss of some of the rock. I would never go 40 min with Pukani rock, though...that would leave just nubs of rock!

 

[KJAG]

Actually, the rock I procured from someone was so heavily encrusted with thick algae that the first acid wash for 20 min still left deeply imbedded spots of algae...the second acid wash for 40 min cleared it all out to "new" looking dry rock. 15 min may work for minor organics embedded, but not all of them. Definitely always start with a lower time first, though...or you do risk the loss of some of the rock. I would never go 40 min with Pukani rock, though...that would leave just nubs of rock!

Well yeah, certainly not applicable to all LR, but OP was talking about Pukani. And I spoke from experience. I previously did a 10:1 MA dip on pukani for 30 mins and lost a ton of surface area. And there was still organics left on the inner crevices. Not gonna strip everything, but I would never think of using Pukani without an acid bath. However on a giant, solid piece, I might consider a longer dip just to open the rock up a bit more. Medium to small pieces though: wouldn’t do more than 15 mins.

 

[waxhawreefer]

I have 25lbs. I’ve already done it once, and it didn’t take any effort. With my Reefer350 I’m going to be slowly gathering equipment anyway, so I might as well do the bleach/ curing process with the (IMO) better looking, more porous rock while I’m waiting for all my equipment to get here. Then by the time I have everything, all I have to do is add water and sand and let it cycle.

On my third tank, used Fiji rock the first two times, never a nitrate issue, this tank pukani rock cannot get nitrates below 12ppm, ever watch the BRS rock video?, it may look kool but once corals start to grow cannot even see it, I thought the same as u, I was wrong, just wish I had someone telling me how it really is before I used it!!good luck

 

[KJAG]

On my third tank, used Fiji rock the first two times, never a nitrate issue, this tank pukani rock cannot get nitrates below 12ppm, ever watch the BRS rock video?, it may look kool but once corals start to grow cannot even see it, I thought the same as u, I was wrong, just wish I had someone telling me how it really is before I used it!!good luck

"Cant even see it?" Not sure how thats secondary to pukani. Typical of any LR and seems like a good problem to have if you have that much growth. And theres plenty of info on Pukani and its issues. Best to research first before making any sort of decisions in this hobby. When stripped with MA, its arguably the best aquascaping medium available.