Montressor
New Member
In March of 2023, I created a 20 gallon Red Sea Nano coral tank. I spent a lot of time researching watching countless BRS videos, reading tons of forums etc. I live a pretty busy life, so I didn't go out and make reef friends. But learned who the local stores are figured out which ones had tolerable quarantine and then started to build out the tank.
Overall it's gone well for the coral and invert side. I'm dealing with excessive hair algae and that's going to be an ongoing hellish problem, but that's not the real issue. Over the last year I've had two mass fatality events with the fish. Mass is relative, as its a 20 gallon the number of fish has never been large intentionally. I'm going to repeat information that I posted here in case there is a new audience, plus I'll add details related to the tank setup. What I am looking for is possible next steps. I'm trying to create a stable tank in my office (where I spend a _lot_ of time), with fish. I would love diagnostic next steps, possible ideas for issues, what I can do to prevent more fish dying.
I'm new to this, but not completely hopeless. At the same time I setup up this tank I also setup a 50 gallon Red Sea for my father. Followed all of the same setup steps even built the rockwork using similar rock and techniques and that tank is thriving. Since he's in the Portland area and I'm in the Seattle area, we arranged for professional care, and I chat with that pro every once in a while, there are no significant differences in the care routine. That tank has an excessive (in my opinion) bio load and is absolutely thriving. Possibly the biggest difference is the water is provided by the LFS, and I RODI my own water and mix Red Sea Blue bucket since its such a small tank. I clean all supplies in RODI water carefully and let air dry. In complete transparency there are times that I might rinse an object in tap water and let dry though I try not to even do that.
Meanwhile my little tank is literally killing fish. Since this is a <1y tank I'll give the full history in hope that maybe something sticks out.
Established 3/19/23
Added Turbo Start on 4/6/23 with biological load to start the cycle
Watched the process go through the cycle with solid and repeating zero ammonia test on 4/22/23
I had personally quarantined fish which I purchased and quarantined in a separate tank during the cycle I was excited and added after the cycle but before the quarantine was fully finished, this was a mistake as we are about to see.
This stock had 2 Banggai Cardinals, a Watchman Goby with pistol shrimp, and a Royal Gramma
Looking back I believe that this Gramma had flukes, but I don't have a definitive answer. The fish died within 30 days of purchase and a week after adding to the display tank. I used drip acclimatization, following the protocol I found here, at the time I added him to the tank there was no reason to believe it had flukes. Once in the display he started flashing and panting. I am still learning a lot about fish at this point and wasn't sure what needed to happen (now I would add Prazipro and a bubbler as soon as I see flashing).
I ordered a new replacement Gramma from Dr Reef in the end of May time frame. They sent 2. Other than a tendency to send too many fish, I want to be clear that Dr. Reef has been an exceptional business to work with, I don't believe that any of these issues are in any way related to their procedures or protocol to the best of my limited knowledge. We boxed (I had to run to the LFS to buy a box) one of the Gramma's and the other was allowed to access the full tank, as I mentioned I don't have local reef friends we didn't want the grammas killing each other since they don't coexist well. All the fish were eating well.
June 4 we added a cleaning crew including snails, hermit, and a emerald crab and the first corals. I dipped the corals, I wish I would have peroxide dipped the Zoas, cause I'll be fighting hair algea from now on.
By July all the fish were dead. Originally after extensive research I had assumed that flukes had killed everything, but none of the other fish showed symptoms of flukes. They looked, fed, and behaved great until a couple of days before they died. I figured out what the appropriate fallow period would be and focused on keeping stable paramaters and making sure that enough detritus was added into the tank to keep the meat eating cucs alive. At the time I had a bumblebee snail, 2 Nassarius snails, Turbo snail, Astrea Snail, and a small number of Cerith Snails. I also had a pistol shrimp, an emerald crab and a hermit crab.
There were also three Zoas, a Clove and a Kenya tree.
I fallowed the tank for 90 days. In that time the pistol shrimp stopped making caves and I assume died after his goby died, and the emerald crab died. There was no bubble algae in the tank but lots of hair algae. The Cerith snails took the opportunity of the fallow period to breed. I now have a hundred cerith snails (well a lot anyway)
The Kenya tree also died. I know everyone just did a double take. It had two Zoa hitchhikers on its base that did extremely well, but the Kenya tree actually died, I finally gave up on the Kenya tree at the end of December and pulled it from the tank.
The Zoas in the tank struggled to establish in the beginning. I knocked the nutrients down after the fish deaths and the hair algae was eating the rest so I took on a full attack on the hair algae, to give them space and started feeding the coral, they have exploded. The clove are particularly vigorous to the surprise of no one.
Parameters have been stable, the last full test is basically the same as any test previously with the exception of nutrients added from feeding.
78.2 +- a 1/10 a degree
35 ppm NaCL
7.8-8.1 Alkalinity. I'm in Seattle this is a hard number to drive higher here.
2ppm Nitrates (during fallow it was 0)
.02-.1 Phosphates (currently .06)
350-400 Calcium
1350-1440 Magnesium
After a 90 day fallow period I ordered a new set of fish and some more coral from Dr. Reef. 2 Banggai Cardinals, 1 Royal Gramma, 1 Midas Blenny, a cleaner shimp, another clove, 3 more zoas, a Duncan and a birds nest.
I was pretty stoked since I was getting them from a good quarantine, and reputable fish seller and had a lot of hope. Ordered on November 15, they arrived on December 20. That put the fallow period of the tank at around 120 days without fish.
The Clove never opened up, and the cleaner shrimp was dead within 2 days of shipping after following their acclimatization protocol. Dr Reef was just as great about this as everyone said they were, they have been super helpful throughout the entire process. All other coral did great. Dr Reef again had sent too many fish, but this time it was a Banggai Cardinal, so I now had 3 of those, a little much for a tiny tank when they were fully grown but fine at their shipped size.
Even better all of the fish were eating heartily everything looked fabulous and some of these were the best looking specimens I had seen.
Christmas eve we noticed that one of the Banggai cardinals stopped eating, but everything else was still eating. The day after Christmas the first Bangaai died. His buddy, stopped eating on December 26, by December 28, the second one died. Then on January 24 the Royal Gramma stopped eating (if you want to see the photos you can look at my first post.)
There were no symptoms other than stopping eating leading up to these deaths, Banggai being quiet in the water and still didn't show a lot of behavior changes. The gramma went through dramatic changes he was gregarious and outgoing and then started hiding and being timid suddenly. He was the bully and then he was not. He would come out and say hi when I walked in the room, and then he didn't Clearly this was a real issue.
I treated with Prazipro yesterday early in the morning, there was no change and he continued downhill. He was dead by this morning.
I still have one Banggai who has now stopped eating and a Midas Blenny who thinks this king of the rock is amazing and always comes out to meet me and ask for food now. The coral in the photo are a little closed up since I dosed with Prazipro, but they are super healthy and have been thriving. In particular, the birds nest and the Duncan are loving this tank. It may or may not matter, but I did a 60 day light acclimatization cycle to establish the corals.
So questions after this long story:
Should I run an ICP test and what is the most reputable one for the conditions that I have discussed here.
Is there anything that stands out? Can you see something that might be the cause.
Is there something I can and should do to rule causes out?
Overall it's gone well for the coral and invert side. I'm dealing with excessive hair algae and that's going to be an ongoing hellish problem, but that's not the real issue. Over the last year I've had two mass fatality events with the fish. Mass is relative, as its a 20 gallon the number of fish has never been large intentionally. I'm going to repeat information that I posted here in case there is a new audience, plus I'll add details related to the tank setup. What I am looking for is possible next steps. I'm trying to create a stable tank in my office (where I spend a _lot_ of time), with fish. I would love diagnostic next steps, possible ideas for issues, what I can do to prevent more fish dying.
I'm new to this, but not completely hopeless. At the same time I setup up this tank I also setup a 50 gallon Red Sea for my father. Followed all of the same setup steps even built the rockwork using similar rock and techniques and that tank is thriving. Since he's in the Portland area and I'm in the Seattle area, we arranged for professional care, and I chat with that pro every once in a while, there are no significant differences in the care routine. That tank has an excessive (in my opinion) bio load and is absolutely thriving. Possibly the biggest difference is the water is provided by the LFS, and I RODI my own water and mix Red Sea Blue bucket since its such a small tank. I clean all supplies in RODI water carefully and let air dry. In complete transparency there are times that I might rinse an object in tap water and let dry though I try not to even do that.
Meanwhile my little tank is literally killing fish. Since this is a <1y tank I'll give the full history in hope that maybe something sticks out.
Established 3/19/23
Added Turbo Start on 4/6/23 with biological load to start the cycle
Watched the process go through the cycle with solid and repeating zero ammonia test on 4/22/23
I had personally quarantined fish which I purchased and quarantined in a separate tank during the cycle I was excited and added after the cycle but before the quarantine was fully finished, this was a mistake as we are about to see.
This stock had 2 Banggai Cardinals, a Watchman Goby with pistol shrimp, and a Royal Gramma
Looking back I believe that this Gramma had flukes, but I don't have a definitive answer. The fish died within 30 days of purchase and a week after adding to the display tank. I used drip acclimatization, following the protocol I found here, at the time I added him to the tank there was no reason to believe it had flukes. Once in the display he started flashing and panting. I am still learning a lot about fish at this point and wasn't sure what needed to happen (now I would add Prazipro and a bubbler as soon as I see flashing).
I ordered a new replacement Gramma from Dr Reef in the end of May time frame. They sent 2. Other than a tendency to send too many fish, I want to be clear that Dr. Reef has been an exceptional business to work with, I don't believe that any of these issues are in any way related to their procedures or protocol to the best of my limited knowledge. We boxed (I had to run to the LFS to buy a box) one of the Gramma's and the other was allowed to access the full tank, as I mentioned I don't have local reef friends we didn't want the grammas killing each other since they don't coexist well. All the fish were eating well.
June 4 we added a cleaning crew including snails, hermit, and a emerald crab and the first corals. I dipped the corals, I wish I would have peroxide dipped the Zoas, cause I'll be fighting hair algea from now on.
By July all the fish were dead. Originally after extensive research I had assumed that flukes had killed everything, but none of the other fish showed symptoms of flukes. They looked, fed, and behaved great until a couple of days before they died. I figured out what the appropriate fallow period would be and focused on keeping stable paramaters and making sure that enough detritus was added into the tank to keep the meat eating cucs alive. At the time I had a bumblebee snail, 2 Nassarius snails, Turbo snail, Astrea Snail, and a small number of Cerith Snails. I also had a pistol shrimp, an emerald crab and a hermit crab.
There were also three Zoas, a Clove and a Kenya tree.
I fallowed the tank for 90 days. In that time the pistol shrimp stopped making caves and I assume died after his goby died, and the emerald crab died. There was no bubble algae in the tank but lots of hair algae. The Cerith snails took the opportunity of the fallow period to breed. I now have a hundred cerith snails (well a lot anyway)
The Kenya tree also died. I know everyone just did a double take. It had two Zoa hitchhikers on its base that did extremely well, but the Kenya tree actually died, I finally gave up on the Kenya tree at the end of December and pulled it from the tank.
The Zoas in the tank struggled to establish in the beginning. I knocked the nutrients down after the fish deaths and the hair algae was eating the rest so I took on a full attack on the hair algae, to give them space and started feeding the coral, they have exploded. The clove are particularly vigorous to the surprise of no one.
Parameters have been stable, the last full test is basically the same as any test previously with the exception of nutrients added from feeding.
78.2 +- a 1/10 a degree
35 ppm NaCL
7.8-8.1 Alkalinity. I'm in Seattle this is a hard number to drive higher here.
2ppm Nitrates (during fallow it was 0)
.02-.1 Phosphates (currently .06)
350-400 Calcium
1350-1440 Magnesium
After a 90 day fallow period I ordered a new set of fish and some more coral from Dr. Reef. 2 Banggai Cardinals, 1 Royal Gramma, 1 Midas Blenny, a cleaner shimp, another clove, 3 more zoas, a Duncan and a birds nest.
I was pretty stoked since I was getting them from a good quarantine, and reputable fish seller and had a lot of hope. Ordered on November 15, they arrived on December 20. That put the fallow period of the tank at around 120 days without fish.
The Clove never opened up, and the cleaner shrimp was dead within 2 days of shipping after following their acclimatization protocol. Dr Reef was just as great about this as everyone said they were, they have been super helpful throughout the entire process. All other coral did great. Dr Reef again had sent too many fish, but this time it was a Banggai Cardinal, so I now had 3 of those, a little much for a tiny tank when they were fully grown but fine at their shipped size.
Even better all of the fish were eating heartily everything looked fabulous and some of these were the best looking specimens I had seen.
Christmas eve we noticed that one of the Banggai cardinals stopped eating, but everything else was still eating. The day after Christmas the first Bangaai died. His buddy, stopped eating on December 26, by December 28, the second one died. Then on January 24 the Royal Gramma stopped eating (if you want to see the photos you can look at my first post.)
There were no symptoms other than stopping eating leading up to these deaths, Banggai being quiet in the water and still didn't show a lot of behavior changes. The gramma went through dramatic changes he was gregarious and outgoing and then started hiding and being timid suddenly. He was the bully and then he was not. He would come out and say hi when I walked in the room, and then he didn't Clearly this was a real issue.
I treated with Prazipro yesterday early in the morning, there was no change and he continued downhill. He was dead by this morning.
I still have one Banggai who has now stopped eating and a Midas Blenny who thinks this king of the rock is amazing and always comes out to meet me and ask for food now. The coral in the photo are a little closed up since I dosed with Prazipro, but they are super healthy and have been thriving. In particular, the birds nest and the Duncan are loving this tank. It may or may not matter, but I did a 60 day light acclimatization cycle to establish the corals.
So questions after this long story:
Should I run an ICP test and what is the most reputable one for the conditions that I have discussed here.
Is there anything that stands out? Can you see something that might be the cause.
Is there something I can and should do to rule causes out?
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