After reading over and trying to understand here just how Palytoxin works and more importantly how it doesn't work...it seems to me that most of these horror stories we read about could not becaused by Palytoxin, but some other unknown checmical.
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surfn said:i know alot of people say they have had experience with palytoxin, and i will have to politely say (coming from a neurochemists point of view) that they are over reacting.
if someone were to have a reaction to palytoxin, they would know it. palytoxin does not interact at neuronal receptors that have anything to do with muscular pain or feeling such as botulinum toxin or tetradotoxin.
without getting one of my neuropathology books out for a reference, i know that palytoxin only interacts with the neuronal receptors in a certain type of neuron in cardiac muscle. and it basically shuts off the ability of the neuron to "communicate" with other neurons in that system. thus causing your heart to stop beating.
other symptoms in this would be temperature and blood pressure. but these variables can also be affected by the are synergistic effects b/w the sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous systems. (i.e. nervousness)
basically the right hemisphere of your brain starts to go crazy with fear, which has an direct control over your heart rate and blood pressure via the hypothalamus.
so basically, the true rule of thumb regarding a neurotoxin poisoning such as botulinum toxin, palytoxin, and tetradotoxin, is that if you aren't going into shock (whether cardiac shock for palytoxin, or tetradotoxin or botulinum toxin for muscular shock) in a couple minutes you will be ok.
Azurel said:I read some where in an article that the natives(lack of a better term at the moment) would use the toxin on the tips of their spears and arrows over in the pacific and Asia.....How true it is I'm not sure but I'm sure there are uses for it as most of the indigenous tribes seem to have found ways of using stuff like that....Take dart frogs for example.
jessiesgrrl said:And as for Botox... All the ladies currently using a derivative of botulinum toxin to freeze facial musclulature and 'get rid of' wrinkles atm are in for a nasty surprise in the long haul anyway, imo. FDA studies for it aren't longitudinal, or really more than 9 years out, if I remember correctly. This is basically what happened with Phen-Fen... short term studies seemed ok with the usual bad guy side effects, but when used in humans over the long haul we got cardiac problems. Humans abuse meds and mix them with other meds, rats and test subjects (hopefully) do not... and over time this is telling. JMHO
I ran across that reference maybe a couple of years ago. I think in that article they said that palytoxin was xx times more deadly than botulinum.surfn said:i've honestly never heard of pacific natives using palytoxin, but would absolutely LOVE to read about it if someone can provide a link or how i would go about getting it at a library.
Mr. Ugly said:I ran across that reference maybe a couple of years ago. I think in that article they said that palytoxin was xx times more deadly than botulinum.surfn said:i've honestly never heard of pacific natives using palytoxin, but would absolutely LOVE to read about it if someone can provide a link or how i would go about getting it at a library.
....
Ok, I think this might be the one I had read.
http://www.asanltr.com/newsletter/02-2/articles/Neurotoxins.htm