Need anemone help! Will H2O2 fix what I can not see?

Todd Kellley · Aug 13, 2019

Well I made a post in "tank emergency" last night with one reply and that was by me! Hoping for some help before its too late. Basically my BTA's went from pic number one to the last two pics. Yes they have moved and yes even in this state they will eat if I feed them which I have done sparingly as to not stress them anymore then they are. I have a small outbreak of cyno and I am noticing these "threads" in the tank. Looks like human hair fell into it and crap stuck to it as they wave around in the flow. I had been pulling or siphoning them out but now I am thinking dino is what they are. Unfortunatly I have no pics of that but can take tonight if I need to. Coming off a piece of live rock and my wave makers. So my thought is are there way more in there then I can see causing toxic effects on my BTA's and will dosing H2O2 help? Keep in mind I have a carpet anemone that is thriving and growing like crazy. Was the size of a silver dollar 6 months ago and it about 7" in diameter now. The carpet is at the opposite end of the tank btw so no it has not stung or come into contact with the BTA's
Tank: 90 gallons
Canister filter
no sump, no skimmer

Humblefish · Aug 13, 2019

"Threads" sounds more like dinos, especially if air bubbles are attached to it. If you do have dinos and they are releasing toxins into the water, running carbon is your best option. The 3% H2O2 dosage rate for fighting cyano & dinos is 1 ml per 8 gals every 12 hours.

Good luck!

McFly · Aug 13, 2019

The BTAs will swell up and shrink during the day and it's normal. In all 3 pictures I do not see anything really wrong with your BTAs. I have had dinos twice and my BTA was the least affected. Run carbon, no need to feed them directly.

Todd Kellley · Aug 13, 2019

McFly said:
The BTAs will swell up and shrink during the day and it's normal. In all 3 pictures I do not see anything really wrong with your BTAs. I have had dinos twice and my BTA was the least affected. Run carbon, no need to feed them directly.

McFly thank you! They do get like this off and on and my wife panics so I tell her its just what they do, but having been in the shrunken state for about a month now I started to worry myself. Just needed someone to put my mind at ease. So no need to treat with peroxide? I never have and am weary about it so I wanted some advice before I do so for sure! I have always had fish only tanks so the anemones and corals are new to me. Fish seem to be not near as sensitive, but having a reef is just fascinating! Told my wife when the TV in the living room needs to be updated its getting tossed out and replaced with another tank. I could watch the life in there for hours at a time and never get bored.

Todd Kellley · Aug 13, 2019

Humblefish said:
"Threads" sounds more like dinos, especially if air bubbles are attached to it. If you do have dinos and they are releasing toxins into the water, running carbon is your best option. The 3% H2O2 dosage rate for fighting cyano & dinos is 1 ml per 8 gals every 12 hours.

Good luck!

Humblefish thank you as well, yep they are dino's then. I am running carbon in my canister filter, do you mean liquid carbon or like using vodka? Or do I need to just replace the carbon in my filter?

brandon429 · Aug 13, 2019

anemones are on the list of sensitives to peroxide so its not indicated here. well done on early intervention inquiry, usually people wait till 99% coverage. be removing the items via siphon till a fix is earned

its possible to use peroxide against dinos even with those anemones if you want, I cannot recall a total loss to one but they nearly always close up for a while in anger. they hate perox but its better than losing a tank to full invasion, you are acting early here I can't even see the target. well done pre work research

get a massive pond UV off amazon if possible/150$ insurance. don't have to run it forever, run it until you find something better.

DMG Reef · Aug 13, 2019

An anemone shrinking overnight is definitely normal. But shrinking for a month is not normal. I agree with Humblefish. You should run carbon at the very least with an outbreak of Dino's. There are different strains of Dino's and the toxic ones will affect an anemone. I lost 2 rbta's to Dino's last month. A UV sterilizer fixed my issue. Good luck.

Todd Kellley · Aug 13, 2019

brandon429 said:
anemones are on the list of sensitives to peroxide so its not indicated here. well done on early intervention inquiry, usually people wait till 99% coverage. be removing the items via siphon till a fix is earned

its possible to use peroxide against dinos even with those anemones if you want, I cannot recall a total loss to one but they nearly always close up for a while in anger. they hate perox but its better than losing a tank to full invasion, you are acting early here I can't even see the target. well done pre work research

get a massive pond UV off amazon if possible/150$ insurance. don't have to run it forever, run it until you find something better.

Thank you sir, I have noticed them closing randomly, at night, middle of the day, if I have my hands in there cleaning, etc. However they have been in this shrunken state for almost a month which is what caused concern. The RBTA has not had bubbles or tentacles longer then a quarter of an inch for that long. Granted the little guy is the diameter of a quarter but you can see in the first pic he used to swell up quite nicely. The GBTA still gets longer tentacles however no bubble and it will not open up anymore then what you see in that last pic. So from about 7 inches in diameter to maybe 2 now.

Todd Kellley · Aug 13, 2019

Kattkrazie said:
An anemone shrinking overnight is definitely normal. But shrinking for a month is not normal. I agree with Humblefish. You should run carbon at the very least with an outbreak of Dino's. There are different strains of Dino's and the toxic ones will affect an anemone. I lost 2 rbta's to Dino's last month. A UV sterilizer fixed my issue. Good luck.

Thank you Katt, that was what I was trying to get across. I have had them long enough I know they can be erratic and shrink, no bubbles, bubbles etc but to stay in this state for this long has my concerned. I am assuming something in the water has them not wanting to suck it in in order to expand the way they do. I take it from your advice and Brandon my best bet is a UV sterilizer?

Todd Kellley · Aug 13, 2019

Todd Kellley said:
Thank you Katt, that was what I was trying to get across. I have had them long enough I know they can be erratic and shrink, no bubbles, bubbles etc but to stay in this state for this long has my concerned. I am assuming something in the water has them not wanting to suck it in in order to expand the way they do. I take it from your advice and Brandon my best bet is a UV sterilizer?

Liquid carbon or carbon in my filter?

DMG Reef · Aug 13, 2019

Todd Kellley said:
Liquid carbon or carbon in my filter?

I used Red Sea carbon in a bag and put it in a media cup in my sump. I assume you're referring to carbon dosing when you say liquid carbon. I wouldn't carbon dose at all with Dino's. They can be caused by an imbalance in nutrients and carbon dosing would most likely add fuel to the fire.

I would highly recommend you getting a UV sterilizer. I run mine continuously even after beating the Dino's.

Todd Kellley · Aug 15, 2019

Looks like a UV sterilizer it is! Thank you everyone!

Todd Kellley · Aug 28, 2019

brandon429 said:
anemones are on the list of sensitives to peroxide so its not indicated here. well done on early intervention inquiry, usually people wait till 99% coverage. be removing the items via siphon till a fix is earned

its possible to use peroxide against dinos even with those anemones if you want, I cannot recall a total loss to one but they nearly always close up for a while in anger. they hate perox but its better than losing a tank to full invasion, you are acting early here I can't even see the target. well done pre work research

get a massive pond UV off amazon if possible/150$ insurance. don't have to run it forever, run it until you find something better.

I just wanted to give you an update. Hooked my UV sterilizer up a week ago today. What amazing results! Nems are doing much better and you can literally see the algae fading off the back of the tank. I clean the front and sides at least once a week but the back gets it maybe every 2 weeks if not only once a month. The rear glass is almost completely clean and I have not had to clean the inside of the front or sides since I put it in. Is there a risk of running it too much and not having enough algae for snails? Just curios

brandon429 · Aug 28, 2019

they're omnivores in that they'll find other fare.

100% agreed in nature algae grows fine without bad params being the cause, its adapted. it should be on a reef.

but you are dealing in large tanking, inaccessibility... that alone precludes all algae its basically a disease risk as I see it for you, in no way extrapolated up to nature of course. just in the confines of things you want to run well and long term and not become planted.

*this does not slight anyone who can wield a big tank in that manner, in balance where some algae exists and then does not take over. They're sages. find a way to repeat that in 20 page work threads and you'll have gold, but in the meantime what works for the masses is farming corals that adhere to surfaces and then chipping, scraping, burning, cheating out algae that may otherwise take over, or not.

its the risk that is unacceptable to some. the hand guided tank cannot be invaded, work precludes it. only allowance causes tank takeover so you can tell I'm passionate about holding onto our lucky arrangement here and definitely burning out rocks that show regrowth.

this was likely dinos above, UV is helpful there work threads show. my next conern was GHA and other attached algae and the plan to keep those from spreading. that quality live rock shown in pics is likely to have some inclusions that can pop up at any time, planning ideally
B

Todd Kellley · Aug 29, 2019

brandon429 said:
they're omnivores in that they'll find other fare.

100% agreed in nature algae grows fine without bad params being the cause, its adapted. it should be on a reef.

but you are dealing in large tanking, inaccessibility... that alone precludes all algae its basically a disease risk as I see it for you, in no way extrapolated up to nature of course. just in the confines of things you want to run well and long term and not become planted.

*this does not slight anyone who can wield a big tank in that manner, in balance where some algae exists and then does not take over. They're sages. find a way to repeat that in 20 page work threads and you'll have gold, but in the meantime what works for the masses is farming corals that adhere to surfaces and then chipping, scraping, burning, cheating out algae that may otherwise take over, or not.

its the risk that is unacceptable to some. the hand guided tank cannot be invaded, work precludes it. only allowance causes tank takeover so you can tell I'm passionate about holding onto our lucky arrangement here and definitely burning out rocks that show regrowth.

this was likely dinos above, UV is helpful there work threads show. my next conern was GHA and other attached algae and the plan to keep those from spreading. that quality live rock shown in pics is likely to have some inclusions that can pop up at any time, planning ideally
B

Yes I am getting what looks like GHA but it is growing in little bushy clumps like I have not seen before which has me wondering if that is what it is? Again, most of it seems to be growing at the base of my reef, on the fringes of rocks I can not remove without making a huge disturbance. Also growing on the back of one turbo snail making it look like a live chia pet! I will have to post a pic of this so you or someone can confirm what it is. I have not been able to match it to anything else I can find but my search verbiage may be wrong and not pulling anything similar. Everyone says it spreads like wildfire. So far these small patches have just gotten longer in length and thicker but not spreading throughout the tank or covering the rocks, snail it is on. Its like someone planted a little bush here, a little bush there and not ground cover that spreads and takes over.

Todd Kellley · Aug 29, 2019

brandon429 said:
they're omnivores in that they'll find other fare.

100% agreed in nature algae grows fine without bad params being the cause, its adapted. it should be on a reef.

but you are dealing in large tanking, inaccessibility... that alone precludes all algae its basically a disease risk as I see it for you, in no way extrapolated up to nature of course. just in the confines of things you want to run well and long term and not become planted.

*this does not slight anyone who can wield a big tank in that manner, in balance where some algae exists and then does not take over. They're sages. find a way to repeat that in 20 page work threads and you'll have gold, but in the meantime what works for the masses is farming corals that adhere to surfaces and then chipping, scraping, burning, cheating out algae that may otherwise take over, or not.

its the risk that is unacceptable to some. the hand guided tank cannot be invaded, work precludes it. only allowance causes tank takeover so you can tell I'm passionate about holding onto our lucky arrangement here and definitely burning out rocks that show regrowth.

this was likely dinos above, UV is helpful there work threads show. my next conern was GHA and other attached algae and the plan to keep those from spreading. that quality live rock shown in pics is likely to have some inclusions that can pop up at any time, planning ideally
B

Brandon429, I want to change gears here for just a minute and maybe this is not the thread for it but the other thread of yours on sand rinsing really caught my interest and this is the easiest place/way for me to get another question to you. I have had many successful tanks over the last 40 yrs. All have been fish only until my newest 90 we have been talking about. I "perfected" (for me) a quick cycle a long time ago that has never failed me but always used crushed coral. This time I wanted sand and went with Coral life live sand. I have always rinsed my aggregate before ever placing it in a tank and do so with tap water for convenience, pressure and heat. Not even thinking this time that the sand was "live" I rinsed it with tap water then placed it in my tank. A couple days later a light bulb went off in my head and I thought "on no! the chlorine in my tap water for sure killed the bacteria in my sand! What did I do!" Yet I continued with my normal "quick cycle" process and low and behold I had no lose, no clouds, no milky look when I stir the sand and the first 2 fish I added are still alive. Sadly. lol One is a blue damsel that can be a real dick! Usually those first fish become food for future tank mates because I like aggressive large carnivores, but they are not reef compatible.

So to my question. I notice the sand holds a lot of waste and bacteria. You can see it building up underneath through the sides and when I siphon there are layers on green turf growing. Once exposed it gets eaten or dies within a day or two but tells me enough debris in there stuff is growing like it is in topsoil! IS the only way to fix this to take all the sand out and clean it like that thread recommends or have I not read enough? Most of what I read was for starting a new tank. This is a 90 gallon tank so that is a lot of sand to take out, but I am worried as to how much is actually living there and using O2. I am in an area prone for power outages though I will have a generator before winter gets here. My concern is the meantime or if life changes prevent me from adding that generator. We all get surprises from time to time in life so preparing for both!

Nicholas Dushynsky · Aug 29, 2019

Todd Kellley said:
Well I made a post in "tank emergency" last night with one reply and that was by me! Hoping for some help before its too late. Basically my BTA's went from pic number one to the last two pics. Yes they have moved and yes even in this state they will eat if I feed them which I have done sparingly as to not stress them anymore then they are. I have a small outbreak of cyno and I am noticing these "threads" in the tank. Looks like human hair fell into it and crap stuck to it as they wave around in the flow. I had been pulling or siphoning them out but now I am thinking dino is what they are. Unfortunatly I have no pics of that but can take tonight if I need to. Coming off a piece of live rock and my wave makers. So my thought is are there way more in there then I can see causing toxic effects on my BTA's and will dosing H2O2 help? Keep in mind I have a carpet anemone that is thriving and growing like crazy. Was the size of a silver dollar 6 months ago and it about 7" in diameter now. The carpet is at the opposite end of the tank btw so no it has not stung or come into contact with the BTA's
Tank: 90 gallons
Canister filter
no sump, no skimmer

2 of the 4 nems I have have been sucked right in for a couple weeks now. Not sure why though. So this is my plan to try and get a uv and see how it goes.