two rainbow BTA on the left and one black widow BTA that won't split on the right.
Mixing different bubble tip anemones
- Thread starter N11morales
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I am very confident that is a smart toxin that hurt one BTA and not affect another BTA is essentially impossible. BTA is not that complex of an animal. The ocean is such a huge place that the practice of releasing toxin to the water to hurt your neighbor is not going to be much of an offense strategy, especially if the toxin release would also hurt the animal that releasing it. It is kind of like blow up a bomb at your house to hurt the people live next door. Nature is never that dumb.
Direct sting when it come in contact with the other animals is another matter, which is the strategy of all the reef animals when it wants to hurt the animal next to it in a tuff war. We do not see BTA sting each other, so we can conclude that they will live fine with each other. Other things can cause demise of an anemone, include infection that it is immune by some and not others. If there is death of one/several in a group of anemones that is not due to shading or to tank conditions (fault of the reefer), this is it.
We see this when populations mixed all the time. Introducing an animal that carries a disease that it is immune to but wipe out the native population (or vice versa).
Direct sting when it come in contact with the other animals is another matter, which is the strategy of all the reef animals when it wants to hurt the animal next to it in a tuff war. We do not see BTA sting each other, so we can conclude that they will live fine with each other. Other things can cause demise of an anemone, include infection that it is immune by some and not others. If there is death of one/several in a group of anemones that is not due to shading or to tank conditions (fault of the reefer), this is it.
We see this when populations mixed all the time. Introducing an animal that carries a disease that it is immune to but wipe out the native population (or vice versa).
sfin52
So many pedestrians so little time
Usually a toxin that one release wouldn't hurt that organism since it's the one that produced it. Leathers can release toxins. In the wild your right not much but it can be a few inches thats all the space the coral needs. As it grows a few inches gives it more space to grow. Who's to say bta don't do the same thing.
As soon as I put a rose bta in my tank my thriving green bta started fading. Now all I have are roses and 2 black widows.
@sfin52
How can a toxin affect one BTA and not the other? Any toxin affect one animal will affect the same to another of the same species, because for all practical purpose they are the same. Even human with all out genetic knowledge cannot produce a toxin that affect one person not the other. This is only stuff of science fiction.
In order to be able to do this, the toxin need to be "smart" and differentiate anemone from the other.
We have cells in our body, not molecules, that recognize self vs non self. These immune cells would attack and neutralized cells in our body that it sees as "non-self". This is too much to pack into a molecule of toxin. Anemones have nematocysts that recognized non self and would fire them when it come in contact with other animals. Anemone does not sting itself because of this fail-safe mechanism. This in in direct contact, not release into the water.
How can a toxin affect one BTA and not the other? Any toxin affect one animal will affect the same to another of the same species, because for all practical purpose they are the same. Even human with all out genetic knowledge cannot produce a toxin that affect one person not the other. This is only stuff of science fiction.
In order to be able to do this, the toxin need to be "smart" and differentiate anemone from the other.
We have cells in our body, not molecules, that recognize self vs non self. These immune cells would attack and neutralized cells in our body that it sees as "non-self". This is too much to pack into a molecule of toxin. Anemones have nematocysts that recognized non self and would fire them when it come in contact with other animals. Anemone does not sting itself because of this fail-safe mechanism. This in in direct contact, not release into the water.
sfin52
So many pedestrians so little time
Because not all bta are the same species.
Humans are all the same species we are different ethnicities.
I'm telling you I had a thriving green bta. Nothing changed in the tank accept I added a rose bta. The decline of the green was as soon as the red entered the tank. They never touched. The only thing that changed was the red. There's plenty of people who have had the same experience.
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There are plenty of people with multiple green, red and different cultivar that live together.
The data we have are:
In some tank, various BTA clones live well together.
In some tank, some of the BTA clone died or not doing well.
There is no control in conditions of these tanks or how they are kept like feeding water change, light, current, tank mates, clownfish..... There is no control regarding various pathogens in these systems.
With these data and observation, it is illogical to conclude that these anemones that are not doing well or died as the result to chemical warfare, and not due to the numbers of variables.
Another piece of data that I have from experiences is that my anemones of various species are doing well in the same system. I even have Gigantea and Magnifica in the same rock for years.
These observations, they are doing well together, proof that there are no unseen undetected aggressions between them. The opposite observation, they did not do well together, does not proof that there is aggression between them because anemones can do poorly and died due to a number of causes.
A much more logical reason can be that the Red BTA carries a pathogen that it is immune to, but the green one is not. The pathogen infected the green one and it got sick and either recover or died.
That is why we don't release aquarium animals, or pets back to the wild, even in the same geographical area.
Release animals back to the wild required extensive quarantine and observation and testing, to minimize the problem of introducing pathogen to the native population.
Here is my 8" Acid Rain next to my 8" Black Widow.
Also in the same tank are a Colorado, Nexus Burst, Rainbow and Ultra Rainbow.
I kept the Acid Rain in a 10g tank with a mix of Rainbows and Ultra Rainbows for 3 years.
Also in the same tank are a Colorado, Nexus Burst, Rainbow and Ultra Rainbow.
I kept the Acid Rain in a 10g tank with a mix of Rainbows and Ultra Rainbows for 3 years.
jormanvf
Community Member
Hello! Can I ask how do you run your system? Do you have carbon, UV Sterilizer?Here is my 8" Acid Rain next to my 8" Black Widow.
Also in the same tank are a Colorado, Nexus Burst, Rainbow and Ultra Rainbow.
I kept the Acid Rain in a 10g tank with a mix of Rainbows and Ultra Rainbows for 3 years.
For 3 years in the 10g, all I did was a 1g weekly water change and run carbon. That's it.
Now that I've upgraded the anemones into a tank with more space, I'll still be doing the weekly water changes, and still running carbon, but I'll also be adding a skimmer. Once I get a skimmer up and running, I might look into ozone as an eventual replacement for the carbon, but we'll see.
TheNemDude
New Member
Yes you can mix but be prepared with cipro. I currently have 3 Chicago's, 2 nexus, 1 purple passion, 2 random green bta with orange tips, and 4 regular rose anemones. All have been together for 3-4 years but I did have issues in the beginning. All of them are in a 25 gallon aquarium with only a refugium as filtration along with carbon here and there.
From all my reading the chemical warfare deal didn't sit well for me. Just doesn't make sense when most every other same species can be with the same. But what does make 100% percent sense is a bacterial infection. Let's face it, sunbursts are weak when it comes to the immune system. So when ya introduce a bacterial bomb via a regular anemone it can overwhelm what is essentially a "bubble boy" anemone.
All to often I see people taking out the infected anemone, treating it, then putting it back into the aquarium. That's solving one percent and leaving the 99 back in the aquarium. So just dose the whole aquarium and knock down the harmful bacteria. Anytime I add a new anemone I can count on it like clock work that my sunbursts are get hit within a couple of days. So I dose the whole tank with cipro and sure enough they bounce back. I do like to feed them on the regular too when dosing so they have extre energy to fend off the bacteria. Also do plan on doing a water change after each treatment cycle if ya don't have a good skimmer.
So yes you can mix but just be prepared before hand and expect that you are gonna have to take a deeper dive to remedy the problem that will arise.
Current photo after adding reef roids. Will add more when cleared.
From all my reading the chemical warfare deal didn't sit well for me. Just doesn't make sense when most every other same species can be with the same. But what does make 100% percent sense is a bacterial infection. Let's face it, sunbursts are weak when it comes to the immune system. So when ya introduce a bacterial bomb via a regular anemone it can overwhelm what is essentially a "bubble boy" anemone.
All to often I see people taking out the infected anemone, treating it, then putting it back into the aquarium. That's solving one percent and leaving the 99 back in the aquarium. So just dose the whole aquarium and knock down the harmful bacteria. Anytime I add a new anemone I can count on it like clock work that my sunbursts are get hit within a couple of days. So I dose the whole tank with cipro and sure enough they bounce back. I do like to feed them on the regular too when dosing so they have extre energy to fend off the bacteria. Also do plan on doing a water change after each treatment cycle if ya don't have a good skimmer.
So yes you can mix but just be prepared before hand and expect that you are gonna have to take a deeper dive to remedy the problem that will arise.
Current photo after adding reef roids. Will add more when cleared.
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aqua.family365
New Member
Well I’ve got a original sunburst and a rose bubble tip and they sit right next to eachother, the tentacles don’t touch and they’re doing fine
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