Melenarus Wrasse Broken Jaw and Lethargic with Spot

[JustinMN18]

Hello,

I have a Melenarus wrasse that unfortunately broke it's jaw (or something) about 7/8 months ago. He can't close his mouth at all, and has basically lived just accepting he doesn't really have a job to do, but he has always been an active swimmer. He breathes hard. Constantly. I imagine it has something to do with the mouth. But it never seemed like an issue.

When this happened, I began feeding frozen twice a day, instead of frozen in the morning and only pellets in the evening, because he can't eat the pellets. He has been great this whole time. Yesterday I noticed he was very lethargic on the sand bed, and chilling up next to my overflow. He didn't dig into the sand last night, just went from totally flat in the sand, to upright on the sand.

This morning he didn't eat again, and I noticed this spot on its side. Here's what I'm wondering.

1) Is this just the end? Do I just let it die?

2) Could this spot be a treatable infection that might be causing issues? I can setup QT very quickly today and I have metroplex and kanaplex, along with the general QT stuff like copper and prazipro.

If this spot could be causing the problems, I can definitely do my best to treat. Everyone else seems fine.

Thanks,
Justin

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hello,

I have a Melenarus wrasse that unfortunately broke it's jaw (or something) about 7/8 months ago. He can't close his mouth at all, and has basically lived just accepting he doesn't really have a job to do, but he has always been an active swimmer. He breathes hard. Constantly. I imagine it has something to do with the mouth. But it never seemed like an issue.

When this happened, I began feeding frozen twice a day, instead of frozen in the morning and only pellets in the evening, because he can't eat the pellets. He has been great this whole time. Yesterday I noticed he was very lethargic on the sand bed, and chilling up next to my overflow. He didn't dig into the sand last night, just went from totally flat in the sand, to upright on the sand.

This morning he didn't eat again, and I noticed this spot on its side. Here's what I'm wondering.

1) Is this just the end? Do I just let it die?

2) Could this spot be a treatable infection that might be causing issues? I can setup QT very quickly today and I have metroplex and kanaplex, along with the general QT stuff like copper and prazipro.

If this spot could be causing the problems, I can definitely do my best to treat. Everyone else seems fine.

Thanks,
Justin

That's a shame about the wrasse's mouth - it obviously impairs breathing and feeding, that you've been able to keep it alive this long is great.

That spot seems superficial. I wonder if something else is going on that is making the wrasse lethargic? I can't tell you what it could be - one common issue with stressed fish is mycobacterium, fish tuberculosis, a bacteria that is found in every aquarium, but only affects compromised fish, it isn't treatable. However, I don't see symptoms of that: thinness, bulging eyes, tattered fins.

As far as euthanasia, I'd give it another day or so, in rare cases, I've seen fish rally back from this point.

Let me know if you need ways to euthanize it if it comes to t hat.

Jay

 

[JustinMN18]

That's a shame about the wrasse's mouth - it obviously impairs breathing and feeding, that you've been able to keep it alive this long is great.

That spot seems superficial. I wonder if something else is going on that is making the wrasse lethargic? I can't tell you what it could be - one common issue with stressed fish is mycobacterium, fish tuberculosis, a bacteria that is found in every aquarium, but only affects compromised fish, it isn't treatable. However, I don't see symptoms of that: thinness, bulging eyes, tattered fins.

As far as euthanasia, I'd give it another day or so, in rare cases, I've seen fish rally back from this point.

Let me know if you need ways to euthanize it if it comes to t hat.

Jay

Thanks a lot, Jay for the comment. Such a bummer to see a fish suffer like this. He's up against my overflow right now. When I walk up to the tank, it comes to the sandbed in front of me and just looks exhausted. I wish there was something I could do to treat him.

Could you share some euthanasia options?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Here is a section from my book (in progress) about euthanasia:


Preferred methods for euthanasia

MS-222
Every aquarist should have a plan for specimen euthanasia before they need to employ it. An overdose of buffered Tricaine methane sulfonate (MS-222) is the preferred method for euthanizing fish. Dosing at a rate of greater than 300 mg/l MS-222 along with 300 mg/l sodium bicarbonate is effective for euthanizing fish within 30 minutes. However, MS-222 is expensive, and not readily available in smaller quantities to home aquarists. Removing the fish too soon from the solution may allow it to recover. It is therefore suggested to leave the fish in a small amount of the euthanizing solution, and freeze it for later disposal.

Clove oil (eugenol)
One product that aquarists can buy that is approved by at least some veterinarians and research biologists is clove oil, also called eugenol. A dose of 50 mg/l is usually sufficient in euthanizing fish. This equates to about 0.20 ml of eugenol in one gallon of aquarium water.

Because eugenol does not mix well with water, and because larger volumes are easier for hobbyists to measure out, it can be dosed using the following method:

1) Add 2 ml of eugenol to 100 ml of tank water in a sealed container and shake it vigorously.

2) Add 10 ml of this suspended solution to each gallon of water needed to euthanize the fish.

3) Place the fish in this solution and keep it covered to prevent it from jumping out and to help keep it calm.

4) Wait at least twenty minutes after it stops breathing, and then remove the fish from the solution and freeze it for later disposal.

Other methods
A variety of other methods have been proposed for the euthanasia of fishes, but none are fully accepted by veterinary experts. Still, home aquarists need more common tools to use, so those methods are listed here in roughly descending order of suitability:

Ethanol
Regular alcohol at a dose of 25 ml per liter will cause respiratory collapse and death in fishes within 30 minutes. The trouble is that alcohol is not available in pure form unless it has been “denatured” by the addition of distasteful chemicals such as turpentine. Vodka is about 40% alcohol by volume, so using it 62 ml per liter will give an effective dose.

Decapitation/pithing
Cutting a fish’s spinal cord, right behind the head, is a quick method of euthanasia that is approved for use in food fishes (where the use of chemicals would otherwise make the flesh unfit to eat). The issue is really that the method is distasteful for most people to do, so it is rarely used by aquarists. However, it is quick and effective.

Freezing
Placing the affected fish in a small amount of aquarium water in a sealed container and then placing the container in a freezer is a euthanasia technique used by some people. However, it is slow to work, so it is not considered humane. Its appeal as a method is that the fish is “out of sight” so people feel more detached from the process.

An option of last resort
The animals in your aquariums are completely reliant on you for proper care. It is your responsibility to see to it that their lives in captivity are humane as possible and that all of their needs are met. If you cannot meet their needs, please find someone who is more able. Euthanasia should be considered only for health reasons, not because it is no longer convenient to care for an animal.

So how can aquarists best utilize the information presented here? First, it is obvious that unless you constantly monitor the mortality rates of the animals under your care, you have no way of knowing if your husbandry skills are improving. Second, this information should serve to reinforce the idea that taking animals from the wild and holding them in captivity carries with it an important responsibility.
On a personal note, while much of what I’ve written here is rather dry and clinical, please do not misconstrue and think that I hold little empathy for aquarium animals. While it is true that I avoid anthropomorphizing any of the animals in my charge, (excepting house pets) I do feel a deep responsibility for them all. I am of course saddened when I lose a fish, but that sadness is not related to the cost or rarity of the animal, or my personal feelings about it, but rather my wondering if I might have been able to offer it better husbandry under my care. Mistakes can and do happen, and losses due to error make one feel all the worse. To sum it all up:

“If a captive fish shows no signs of chronic disease or abnormality, and it shows normal feeding and reproductive behaviors and most importantly, exhibits a normal lifespan compared to that of wild counterparts (minus the predation that wild fish incur), then there is no other metric we can use to determine if a certain suite of husbandry techniques are suitable or not.”


Jay

 

[jmichaelh7]

How is it eating still ?

 

[JustinMN18]

How is it eating still ?

It has typically just basically sucked it in. I always make sure the pieces I feed are big enough for him to suck a chunk down. Sometimes he has to spit it out and take it back in, but he will do that in a less crowded part of the tank.

 

[JustinMN18]

Here is a section from my book (in progress) about euthanasia:


Preferred methods for euthanasia

MS-222
Every aquarist should have a plan for specimen euthanasia before they need to employ it. An overdose of buffered Tricaine methane sulfonate (MS-222) is the preferred method for euthanizing fish. Dosing at a rate of greater than 300 mg/l MS-222 along with 300 mg/l sodium bicarbonate is effective for euthanizing fish within 30 minutes. However, MS-222 is expensive, and not readily available in smaller quantities to home aquarists. Removing the fish too soon from the solution may allow it to recover. It is therefore suggested to leave the fish in a small amount of the euthanizing solution, and freeze it for later disposal.

Clove oil (eugenol)
One product that aquarists can buy that is approved by at least some veterinarians and research biologists is clove oil, also called eugenol. A dose of 50 mg/l is usually sufficient in euthanizing fish. This equates to about 0.20 ml of eugenol in one gallon of aquarium water.

Because eugenol does not mix well with water, and because larger volumes are easier for hobbyists to measure out, it can be dosed using the following method:

1) Add 2 ml of eugenol to 100 ml of tank water in a sealed container and shake it vigorously.

2) Add 10 ml of this suspended solution to each gallon of water needed to euthanize the fish.

3) Place the fish in this solution and keep it covered to prevent it from jumping out and to help keep it calm.

4) Wait at least twenty minutes after it stops breathing, and then remove the fish from the solution and freeze it for later disposal.

Other methods
A variety of other methods have been proposed for the euthanasia of fishes, but none are fully accepted by veterinary experts. Still, home aquarists need more common tools to use, so those methods are listed here in roughly descending order of suitability:

Ethanol
Regular alcohol at a dose of 25 ml per liter will cause respiratory collapse and death in fishes within 30 minutes. The trouble is that alcohol is not available in pure form unless it has been “denatured” by the addition of distasteful chemicals such as turpentine. Vodka is about 40% alcohol by volume, so using it 62 ml per liter will give an effective dose.

Decapitation/pithing
Cutting a fish’s spinal cord, right behind the head, is a quick method of euthanasia that is approved for use in food fishes (where the use of chemicals would otherwise make the flesh unfit to eat). The issue is really that the method is distasteful for most people to do, so it is rarely used by aquarists. However, it is quick and effective.

Freezing
Placing the affected fish in a small amount of aquarium water in a sealed container and then placing the container in a freezer is a euthanasia technique used by some people. However, it is slow to work, so it is not considered humane. Its appeal as a method is that the fish is “out of sight” so people feel more detached from the process.

An option of last resort
The animals in your aquariums are completely reliant on you for proper care. It is your responsibility to see to it that their lives in captivity are humane as possible and that all of their needs are met. If you cannot meet their needs, please find someone who is more able. Euthanasia should be considered only for health reasons, not because it is no longer convenient to care for an animal.

So how can aquarists best utilize the information presented here? First, it is obvious that unless you constantly monitor the mortality rates of the animals under your care, you have no way of knowing if your husbandry skills are improving. Second, this information should serve to reinforce the idea that taking animals from the wild and holding them in captivity carries with it an important responsibility.
On a personal note, while much of what I’ve written here is rather dry and clinical, please do not misconstrue and think that I hold little empathy for aquarium animals. While it is true that I avoid anthropomorphizing any of the animals in my charge, (excepting house pets) I do feel a deep responsibility for them all. I am of course saddened when I lose a fish, but that sadness is not related to the cost or rarity of the animal, or my personal feelings about it, but rather my wondering if I might have been able to offer it better husbandry under my care. Mistakes can and do happen, and losses due to error make one feel all the worse. To sum it all up:

“If a captive fish shows no signs of chronic disease or abnormality, and it shows normal feeding and reproductive behaviors and most importantly, exhibits a normal lifespan compared to that of wild counterparts (minus the predation that wild fish incur), then there is no other metric we can use to determine if a certain suite of husbandry techniques are suitable or not.”


Jay

I will see about getting some of those ingredients.

Here is a section from my book (in progress) about euthanasia:


Preferred methods for euthanasia

MS-222
Every aquarist should have a plan for specimen euthanasia before they need to employ it. An overdose of buffered Tricaine methane sulfonate (MS-222) is the preferred method for euthanizing fish. Dosing at a rate of greater than 300 mg/l MS-222 along with 300 mg/l sodium bicarbonate is effective for euthanizing fish within 30 minutes. However, MS-222 is expensive, and not readily available in smaller quantities to home aquarists. Removing the fish too soon from the solution may allow it to recover. It is therefore suggested to leave the fish in a small amount of the euthanizing solution, and freeze it for later disposal.

Clove oil (eugenol)
One product that aquarists can buy that is approved by at least some veterinarians and research biologists is clove oil, also called eugenol. A dose of 50 mg/l is usually sufficient in euthanizing fish. This equates to about 0.20 ml of eugenol in one gallon of aquarium water.

Because eugenol does not mix well with water, and because larger volumes are easier for hobbyists to measure out, it can be dosed using the following method:

1) Add 2 ml of eugenol to 100 ml of tank water in a sealed container and shake it vigorously.

2) Add 10 ml of this suspended solution to each gallon of water needed to euthanize the fish.

3) Place the fish in this solution and keep it covered to prevent it from jumping out and to help keep it calm.

4) Wait at least twenty minutes after it stops breathing, and then remove the fish from the solution and freeze it for later disposal.

Other methods
A variety of other methods have been proposed for the euthanasia of fishes, but none are fully accepted by veterinary experts. Still, home aquarists need more common tools to use, so those methods are listed here in roughly descending order of suitability:

Ethanol
Regular alcohol at a dose of 25 ml per liter will cause respiratory collapse and death in fishes within 30 minutes. The trouble is that alcohol is not available in pure form unless it has been “denatured” by the addition of distasteful chemicals such as turpentine. Vodka is about 40% alcohol by volume, so using it 62 ml per liter will give an effective dose.

Decapitation/pithing
Cutting a fish’s spinal cord, right behind the head, is a quick method of euthanasia that is approved for use in food fishes (where the use of chemicals would otherwise make the flesh unfit to eat). The issue is really that the method is distasteful for most people to do, so it is rarely used by aquarists. However, it is quick and effective.

Freezing
Placing the affected fish in a small amount of aquarium water in a sealed container and then placing the container in a freezer is a euthanasia technique used by some people. However, it is slow to work, so it is not considered humane. Its appeal as a method is that the fish is “out of sight” so people feel more detached from the process.

An option of last resort
The animals in your aquariums are completely reliant on you for proper care. It is your responsibility to see to it that their lives in captivity are humane as possible and that all of their needs are met. If you cannot meet their needs, please find someone who is more able. Euthanasia should be considered only for health reasons, not because it is no longer convenient to care for an animal.

So how can aquarists best utilize the information presented here? First, it is obvious that unless you constantly monitor the mortality rates of the animals under your care, you have no way of knowing if your husbandry skills are improving. Second, this information should serve to reinforce the idea that taking animals from the wild and holding them in captivity carries with it an important responsibility.
On a personal note, while much of what I’ve written here is rather dry and clinical, please do not misconstrue and think that I hold little empathy for aquarium animals. While it is true that I avoid anthropomorphizing any of the animals in my charge, (excepting house pets) I do feel a deep responsibility for them all. I am of course saddened when I lose a fish, but that sadness is not related to the cost or rarity of the animal, or my personal feelings about it, but rather my wondering if I might have been able to offer it better husbandry under my care. Mistakes can and do happen, and losses due to error make one feel all the worse. To sum it all up:

“If a captive fish shows no signs of chronic disease or abnormality, and it shows normal feeding and reproductive behaviors and most importantly, exhibits a normal lifespan compared to that of wild counterparts (minus the predation that wild fish incur), then there is no other metric we can use to determine if a certain suite of husbandry techniques are suitable or not.”


Jay

Awesome, I'll see what kind of approach I can take. I definitely will not be doing the head chop or freeze method haha.

As always, thanks a lot for your help.


Justin