I've been in this hobby for a year now and I just cant seem to make it work. I can you the communities advice, as I'm clearly doing something wrong.

[rennjidk]

I'm really struggling to keep corals alive, and though I've followed all the steps to success, everything seems to just slowly die. I'll post as much relevant information as I can starting with my reef journal:

The tank is 3 months old Nuvo 30L (30g) and started completely sterile with the exception of Ocean Direct sand and Aqua Forest reef mud. Salinity has been kept consistent at 34.5ppt using 2 different test methods and a Tunze ATO. Temperature is a constant 77.1F. PH is 7.9. The sump consists of filter floss pads, a chaeto fuge on 8 hours at night, Rox 0.8 carbon, and Purigen. Lighting is provided by 2 AI Primes running 11 hours a day (with 4 hours total ramp) at 8" off the water tuned to UV80/V80/RB72/B100/R10/G10/W10 which should be giving around 100 par based on other people's testing.

Dosing:
3ml All for Reef daily
3ml Cheato Gro weekly
2ml AB+ daily
5ml Microbactor 7 & Clean weekly
No3 and PO4 as needed

Feeding is a blend of Reef Frenzy Nano, Reef Roids, AB+, and Frozen Mysis in homemade cubes.

Source water is RODI with tested TDS 0.0 using 2 different meters. Salt is IO Reef Crystals. I do a 10% water change monthly.

Stocking: 2 Clowns, 1 Royal Gramma, 1 Lawnmower Blenny, 1 Yellow Watchman Goby and Tiger PIstol Shrimp, 1 Banngai Cardinal, 1 Peppermint shrimp, 10 Astrea Turbo, 30 Dwarf Ceriths, 4 Red Legs, 10 Blue legs, 1 Trochus, 10 Nassarius.

I'm positive I'm not introducing anything into the tank. I always wear gloves and keep my hands out as much as possible. So far I've had 1 hammer die, 3 others that are very unhappy, acans receding, zoas constantly stressed/changing color/partially open, and 4 dead gonies.

I've convinced myself that I need more flow despite running 900gph through the return with 1/2" RFG's. I've ordered 2 600gph powerheads to combat this and I also made a video of the normal flow here:



That's about all I can think to add at this point. Any Ideas?

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

I'd try adding some live rock to boost biodiversity and then starting out with soft and other easy corals...starting sterile may not have been the best idea even though many people do have thriving tanks that started that way...imo the microbiome is very important for the health of many organisms and establishment of a microbiome as close to natural as possible might help a good bit. Just my opinion.

 

[exnisstech]

I dosed absolutely nothing for over a year when I started. Currently I dose 2 part in one tank and kalk in another, nothing else and everything is growing. I'm not saying I never loose a coral or fish, anyone who says that is lying or hasn't been in the hobby long enough. I'm far from am expert but maybe stop adding stuff (chemicals) and let the tank mature?

 

[flashsmith]

Everything looks pretty good to me. Unfortunately in this hobby things die unexpectedly. We all lose corals and fish all the time. My advice would be to stay the course. I don't see anything that stands out here. Maybe up the water changes a bit? Don't overthink things and just know we all lose coral for unexplainable reasons. Trying to fix a problem that may or may not exist will cause you serious issues. Let it ride it will get better.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

sorry but once I saw "tank is 3 months old", it becomes obvious that impatience is the only real problem.

In 3 short months, the tank was cycled, 6 fish have been added, and your dosing 4 or 5 different things, thats a lot of changes for your tank to go through in 3 months. It's not a stable environement for corals, thats why a lot of people suggest waiting several months before adding corals.

It looks like your tank is just starting the ugly phase, so it will go through changes for a couple more months.

Stability takes time.

 

[DeniseAndy]

Biggest thing to get a tank off to a good start is properly mixed saltwater. Almost all salt on market can be used with water changes and not need to supplement.
Next, is your Chaeto growing? I find that I cannot run an algae scrubber or any nutrient pull out substance until the tank is almost a year old (unless I introduced a bad case of hair algae or briopsis). They will zap the tank of nutrients leading to none left for the corals.
Make sure your lighting is good and flow effective (do not count the flow through the return). Only count the flow from your powerheads. I will aim for about 40X tank volume for LPS of your nature (torch, hammer, frogspawn, etc.)
If you can get some, add some live rock. This will add a ton to your diversity.

For instance, I just set up a 10g tank to house some extra corals from my grow out tank. I just filled it, put a filter (protein skimmer or just filter with floss/pad) on and added corals and my live rock. No issues. This is how I always set up tanks. Key is live/ mature rock!

I hope things will turn around soon. Sometimes we research so much and think we have to hit some number and it will drive us and the tank crazy. Let it mature, hold off on corals for a while until you begin to see some algae growth. Especially coralline.

 

[Kellie in CA]

I would stop all the dosing, except maybe the Microbacter7. I was able to rely on water changes only for the first few years.

Have you tested Phosphate?

 

[Pkunk35]

Think this question should be broken down more, I see many coral doing fine. Which corals are dying?

if euphyllia, then I’m def gonna point towards that “3 month old started with sterile rock”. Also some of those look like wall hammers which if freshly imported or cut, already have a largely reduced chance of success.

tank is pretty packed for 3 months old. I’m the same way in my 32g and my struggle was always phosphate or nutrient bottom out. Your pO4 looks pretty low so I’d start to peek at that a little more with euphyllia.

 

[Dave1993]

i can't keep coral either i can keep fish but not coral

 

[92Miata]

You're doing way, way too much and dosing way too many conflicting supplements.

Dosing:
3ml All for Reef daily (Alkalinity, Calcium, and carbon)
3ml Cheato Gro weekly (who knows? iron? nitrogen, phosphorus?)
2ml AB+ daily (again, who knows? nitrogen, phosphorus, who knows what else?)
5ml Microbactor 7 & Clean weekly (carbon, bacteria, who knows what else).
No3 and PO4 as needed

You're having to dose Nitrate and Phosphate because you're dosing multiple different carbon sources, you're using a carbon based alkalinity/calcium supplement in AFR that is going to be utilized at very different rates every time you screw with your nitrogen and phosphorus with the other products, and then you're dosing heterotrophic sewage processing bacteria because why? Why are you worried about growing chaeto when your nitrate and phosphate keep bottoming out? You're feeding multiple coral foods that are basically just phosphate paste despite having almost no coral mass in the tank.


Stop all of this. Simplify. Stabilize.


1.Go out and get simple alkalinity and calcium supplements. (I highly recommend Randy's 2 part recipes).
2.Test your alkalinity.
3.Dose up to 7.5 dkh. (dose the same amount of CA if using balanced supplement)
4.Test again at the same time the next day.
5.Calculate the difference.
6.Dose that amount each day for the next 7 days.
7.Test again, adjust the daily dose.

Do this for like 6 weeks. Keep the alkalinity stable. Feed the fish. Don't worry about feeding the corals. Dose phosphate if it drops below .04, nitrate below 5-10ppm. Don't dose any of the Clean or other carbon products. If you get a little hair algae, pull it out. Cyano, siphon it out.

Nothing you want to keep is going to do well with the alkalinity, phosphate, and nitrate yoyoing about like that.

 

[killer2001]

My tank is about 3 months old now and I started with all dry rock and sand. You really need to watch the phosphate because once you crank the lights on and algae builds up phosphate will deplete fast. I am feeding heavy and dosing phosphate just to keep it from bottoming out which has helped a ton. Also, I'm adding corals very slowly, (like one or two small frags every other week). So far this strategy has been working great for me.

 

[MichaelReefer]

Your tank is so new, dont really think you should be dosing anything at this stage.... You should give it a few more months before you start adding coral.

 

[tritonpower]

I have a 90 gallon and a 20 gallon. The 20 has taken a lot longer to mature than the 90 gallon. I think the lower water volume makes a difference. I do use all for reef in the 20 gallon with success.

I agree that all you should "dose" is all for reef and the microbacter7. I'd consider pulling the carbon and purigen. You may also want some copepods for biodiversity to help mature the tank. After adding copepods you would want to add phyto once a week. Water changes weekly for a while and if still not going well consider an ICP test to be sure nothing is way off/metal in the tank/etc. Then just be patient. It took my 20 gallon well over a year to start doing well with corals.

 

[rennjidk]

I have a 90 gallon and a 20 gallon. The 20 has taken a lot longer to mature than the 90 gallon. I think the lower water volume makes a difference. I do use all for reef in the 20 gallon with success.

I agree that all you should "dose" is all for reef and the microbacter7. I'd consider pulling the carbon and purigen. You may also want some copepods for biodiversity to help mature the tank. After adding copepods you would want to add phyto once a week. Water changes weekly for a while and if still not going well consider an ICP test to be sure nothing is way off/metal in the tank/etc. Then just be patient. It took my 20 gallon well over a year to start doing well with corals.

I added 4 jars of Eco pods around week one to combat the diatom bloom, I just forgot to mention it. Why do you suggest pulling the carbon and purigen? I thought that carbon would be beneficial in combatting the chemical warfare of so many different corals (primarily zoas), and that purigen just helps to polish the water quality/clarity.

 

[rennjidk]

I'd try adding some live rock to boost biodiversity and then starting out with soft and other easy corals...starting sterile may not have been the best idea even though many people do have thriving tanks that started that way...imo the microbiome is very important for the health of many organisms and establishment of a microbiome as close to natural as possible might help a good bit. Just my opinion.

I agree with the importance of biodiversity, but I used live sand and reef mud directly from the ocean as my substrate. How much more biodiverse can you get?

 

[rennjidk]

I dosed absolutely nothing for over a year when I started. Currently I dose 2 part in one tank and kalk in another, nothing else and everything is growing. I'm not saying I never loose a coral or fish, anyone who says that is lying or hasn't been in the hobby long enough. I'm far from am expert but maybe stop adding stuff (chemicals) and let the tank mature?

I have to dose NO3 and PO4 or my levels would fall to zero due to my refugium. I need to have it as a nutrient export because I'm not equipped to make and store large volumes of rodi. AFR (for arguments sake) is basically just a 2 part with added magnesium and trace elements. AB+ is just amino acids and carbohydrates (ie food). The Microbactor products are beneficial bacteria products and used by a lot of reefers with great success, and the Chaeto Gro is just iron and trace elements that the chaeto would otherwise pull out of the tank if not replenished.

 

[tritonpower]

I agree with the importance of biodiversity, but I used live sand and reef mud directly from the ocean as my substrate. How much more biodiverse can you get?

You may be ok then. Just dose phyto once a week. I usually use carbon when I know there an issue otherwise I don't use it. A lot of people use it for water clarity but since I run UVs I have not needed it often. Purigen is probably fine. Test weekly. Keep parameters stable. Then lots of patience.

 

[exnisstech]

deleted

 

[Rick's Reviews]

I agree with the importance of biodiversity, but I used live sand and reef mud directly from the ocean as my substrate. How much more biodiverse can you get?

(My opinion only, as I'm no sciencetist)

You may of added great biodiversity but have you considered your filtrations system may be just taking all the good 'biodiversity' good bacteria out of this aquarium. Your filtration may to 'too good' ?? Some corals thrive in a dirty aquarium

Your aquarium is quite full and 'young' very new. So it's not really had chance to build up an eco system to host copepods, spirobids as an example

you will be getting various swings in readings as 'each' coral requires different balance of chemicals to grow.

be it calcium (example) as an individual coral might need more to grow but others require less.

(Only my thoughts)
I think your actions are faster then the bacteria growing in your aquarium, there's too much going off in a very short time scale, I would let everything settle in and adjust (lightly) until all parimiters stable

 

[ReefGeezer]

So, nothing looks bad. It is just new. Corals will die every once in a while for no good reason. Wait until you try SPS corals. They die if you look at them funny! I peer over the back of a couch so my SPS don't know I'm looking at them. I think the you may be simply adding too much, too soon though.... corals, fish, and dosing components.

I use AFR on my mature system. It works great. BUT...AFR requires biological processes that may not be present in your tank yet in order for its components to yield the proper alkalinity and calcium input. I can't see where the tank has much alkalinity/calcium demand. Topping off with kalkwasser in the ATO or manually dosing Randy's two-part may be a better answers.

The Cheato and the dosing required to maintain it are excessive. You have "Lack of N&P problems". I would stop dosing the Cheato Grow and the NO3 & PO4, reduce the Cheato, and reduce the light duration... or remove the Cheato all together until you see rising N & P. That should also let you stop feeding so many things that are phosphate heavy like the reef roids.

The rocks and surfaces look pretty sterile. I would stop the MB Clean.

I also use AB+. However, it very heavy in organic carbon. Your tank doesn't look like it needs that much carbon yet.