Ich in tanks

[Cole_Voeller]

Okay, well I thought my ich problem was dealt with, but I guess not. So as much as I hate the idea of taking all my fish out and keeping them out of my tank for months, it looks like I have no other option. Sort of a total pain being in an apartment though.
Anyway between the tanks, my fish are fangblennies, Biota dragonet, a neon goby, royal gramma, firefish, and a tribal blenny. For setting up two QT tanks, I have tanks I can use, just need heaters and filtration. I can use water from my tanks to help with bacteria, and bacteria starter before I start with copper, but all my other filtration from the two tanks is either carbon or rock. Is bacteria starter helpful? Or should I just do water changes often? I’m doing no rock, barebottom for the two. Going to get PVC pipe for them to hide. The only fish I am hesitant to use copper with is my baby dragonet. He has shown no signs of ich at all, but I know that all fish probably carry it. Is it safe to use copper on a little baby dragonet? The copper I have is CopperSafe, and that’s all that is around me locally.
Stepping away from the QT tanks, I want to ask about the main tanks as well. Leave them fishless for 76 days, correct? Is there anyway to speed this up? UV sterilizer, anything? Is it okay to leave hermits and snails in? Should I dose ammonia while it is empty? Change temperature?
Sorry to ask so many questions- I’m pretty new to saltwater, and simply because of the fact that I allowed ich into my tanks, I want to do everything in my power to make sure I don’t mess anything up and ensure all of my fish survive.
Thank you to anyone willing to help

 

[vetteguy53081]

Okay, well I thought my ich problem was dealt with, but I guess not. So as much as I hate the idea of taking all my fish out and keeping them out of my tank for months, it looks like I have no other option. Sort of a total pain being in an apartment though.
Anyway between the tanks, my fish are fangblennies, Biota dragonet, a neon goby, royal gramma, firefish, and a tribal blenny. For setting up two QT tanks, I have tanks I can use, just need heaters and filtration. I can use water from my tanks to help with bacteria, and bacteria starter before I start with copper, but all my other filtration from the two tanks is either carbon or rock. Is bacteria starter helpful? Or should I just do water changes often? I’m doing no rock, barebottom for the two. Going to get PVC pipe for them to hide. The only fish I am hesitant to use copper with is my baby dragonet. He has shown no signs of ich at all, but I know that all fish probably carry it. Is it safe to use copper on a little baby dragonet? The copper I have is CopperSafe, and that’s all that is around me locally.
Stepping away from the QT tanks, I want to ask about the main tanks as well. Leave them fishless for 76 days, correct? Is there anyway to speed this up? UV sterilizer, anything? Is it okay to leave hermits and snails in? Should I dose ammonia while it is empty? Change temperature?
Sorry to ask so many questions- I’m pretty new to saltwater, and simply because of the fact that I allowed ich into my tanks, I want to do everything in my power to make sure I don’t mess anything up and ensure all of my fish survive.
Thank you to anyone willing to help

In lieu of copper, go with copper power for full 30 days at level 2.25-2.5 and monitor this level with a reliable copper test kit such as Hanna- No api brand.
Add aeration via airstone and monitor ammonia levels again with reliable test kit. Feeding sparingly will keep ammonia down.
I MUST MENTION THAT YOU WILL WANT MANDARIN EATING FROZEN BABY BRINE OR ROTIFIERS BEFORE TREATING WITH COPPER AS THEIR DESIRED FOOD (COPEPODS) WILL NOT SURVIVE IN COPPER

 

[Uncle99]

Yes to 76 days at “normal” operating temps but you can do 45 days if you raise the temp. (I don’t increase the temp when I fallow) I just do the time.

The dragonet is a bit of a gamble, put him in QT (how to we feed), leave in DT, may fall victim to the parasite. I don’t find the dragnet family to be very ick prone, they excrete a mucus at night that likely protects from ick attaching itself.

Worst case scenario is loss of fish, and restarting fallow day count.

Me, I would take the risk and keep him in, buts your fish.

Ghost feed during fallow, but very super tiny amount.

Very little bacteria in water, you can transfer any mature media you want, but after treatment, it’s trash.

With no media, have new temp matched saltwater available and change some either daily or twice daily while watching ammonia levels.

Feed them as much as they take, but, vacum up the missed food and stuff on the bottom of the QT.

There is no data on the effect of UV versus fallow time, it would be a complete guess. Nit

 

[vetteguy53081]

Okay, well I thought my ich problem was dealt with, but I guess not. So as much as I hate the idea of taking all my fish out and keeping them out of my tank for months, it looks like I have no other option. Sort of a total pain being in an apartment though.
Anyway between the tanks, my fish are fangblennies, Biota dragonet, a neon goby, royal gramma, firefish, and a tribal blenny. For setting up two QT tanks, I have tanks I can use, just need heaters and filtration. I can use water from my tanks to help with bacteria, and bacteria starter before I start with copper, but all my other filtration from the two tanks is either carbon or rock. Is bacteria starter helpful? Or should I just do water changes often? I’m doing no rock, barebottom for the two. Going to get PVC pipe for them to hide. The only fish I am hesitant to use copper with is my baby dragonet. He has shown no signs of ich at all, but I know that all fish probably carry it. Is it safe to use copper on a little baby dragonet? The copper I have is CopperSafe, and that’s all that is around me locally.
Stepping away from the QT tanks, I want to ask about the main tanks as well. Leave them fishless for 76 days, correct? Is there anyway to speed this up? UV sterilizer, anything? Is it okay to leave hermits and snails in? Should I dose ammonia while it is empty? Change temperature?
Sorry to ask so many questions- I’m pretty new to saltwater, and simply because of the fact that I allowed ich into my tanks, I want to do everything in my power to make sure I don’t mess anything up and ensure all of my fish survive.
Thank you to anyone willing to help

No - fishless for 45 to 60 days if you had an outbreak and coppersafe is similar to copperpower
76 days was old rule and studies have shown lifecycle of ich is much shorter

 

[Cole_Voeller]

Happy to hear that. Thank you.

 

[Cole_Voeller]

No - fishless for 45 to 60 days if you had an outbreak and coppersafe is similar to copperpower
76 days was old rule and studies have shown lifecycle of ich is much shorter

Happy to hear that, thank you.

 

[Cole_Voeller]

In lieu of copper, go with copper power for full 30 days at level 2.25-2.5 and monitor this level with a reliable copper test kit such as Hanna- No api brand.
Add aeration via airstone and monitor ammonia levels again with reliable test kit. Feeding sparingly will keep ammonia down.
I MUST MENTION THAT YOU WILL WANT MANDARIN EATING FROZEN BABY BRINE OR ROTIFIERS BEFORE TREATING WITH COPPER AS THEIR DESIRED FOOD (COPEPODS) WILL NOT SURVIVE IN COPPER

I can’t get Copper Power anywhere around me unfortunately. No Hanna checker either. Is one required? I can order if need be. But I also can’t use that much money. College student.
I have an air pump, can do a sponge filter if that would work instead of HOB?
And mandarin will be fine for food. I already have him trained on pellets.

 

[Cole_Voeller]

Yes to 76 days at “normal” operating temps but you can do 45 days if you raise the temp. (I don’t increase the temp when I fallow) I just do the time.

The dragonet is a bit of a gamble, put him in QT (how to we feed), leave in DT, may fall victim to the parasite. I don’t find the dragnet family to be very ick prone, they excrete a mucus at night that likely protects from ick attaching itself.

Worst case scenario is loss of fish, and restarting fallow day count.

Me, I would take the risk and keep him in, buts your fish.

Ghost feed during fallow, but very super tiny amount.

Very little bacteria in water, you can transfer any mature media you want, but after treatment, it’s trash.

With no media, have new temp matched saltwater available and change some either daily or twice daily while watching ammonia levels.

Feed them as much as they take, but, vacum up the missed food and stuff on the bottom of the QT.

There is no data on the effect of UV versus fallow time, it would be a complete guess. Nit

What temp should I increase to to shorten to 45 days?
I have my dragonet trained on pellets already. My I could leave him in, but if there is any chance that the ich may infect him or stay in the tank because of him, I don’t want to take the risk. I just want to make sure the copper is okay for him.

 

[MnFish1]

What temp should I increase to to shorten to 45 days?
I have my dragonet trained on pellets already. My I could leave him in, but if there is any chance that the ich may infect him or stay in the tank because of him, I don’t want to take the risk. I just want to make sure the copper is okay for him.

Most of the equipment and chemicals can be ordered with overnight shipping from BRS - or Amazon. 81F is the normal temp if you're using the 45 day protocol (after removing inverts/coral)

 

[Cole_Voeller]

Most of the equipment and chemicals can be ordered with overnight shipping from BRS - or Amazon. 81F is the normal temp if you're using the 45 day protocol (after removing inverts/coral)

I have my corals in a frag tank at the moment.
I need to remove inverts for 81°? What do I do with them? I can’t put them in the QT tanks can I?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Okay, well I thought my ich problem was dealt with, but I guess not. So as much as I hate the idea of taking all my fish out and keeping them out of my tank for months, it looks like I have no other option. Sort of a total pain being in an apartment though.
Anyway between the tanks, my fish are fangblennies, Biota dragonet, a neon goby, royal gramma, firefish, and a tribal blenny. For setting up two QT tanks, I have tanks I can use, just need heaters and filtration. I can use water from my tanks to help with bacteria, and bacteria starter before I start with copper, but all my other filtration from the two tanks is either carbon or rock. Is bacteria starter helpful? Or should I just do water changes often? I’m doing no rock, barebottom for the two. Going to get PVC pipe for them to hide. The only fish I am hesitant to use copper with is my baby dragonet. He has shown no signs of ich at all, but I know that all fish probably carry it. Is it safe to use copper on a little baby dragonet? The copper I have is CopperSafe, and that’s all that is around me locally.
Stepping away from the QT tanks, I want to ask about the main tanks as well. Leave them fishless for 76 days, correct? Is there anyway to speed this up? UV sterilizer, anything? Is it okay to leave hermits and snails in? Should I dose ammonia while it is empty? Change temperature?
Sorry to ask so many questions- I’m pretty new to saltwater, and simply because of the fact that I allowed ich into my tanks, I want to do everything in my power to make sure I don’t mess anything up and ensure all of my fish survive.
Thank you to anyone willing to help

Just a couple of observations - copper power and coppersafe are virtually identical in their action. As mentioned, the big issue with mandarins during copper is feeding them. Moving water over from your DT is fine, but don't count on it moving very many bacteria, certainly not enough to manage the ammonia in the new tanks. These beneficial bacterial live on surfaces, not in the water. One trick is to rub sand / coral rock into the water to try and get some of the bacteria off those surfaces. If your filter has non-calcium material in it, you can move that over. Otherwise, you will need to rely on beneficial bacteria in a bottle products.

You can reduce the fallow period a bit from 76 days, but that requires raising the water temperature to 81, and some invertebrates don't appreciate that.


Jay

 

[Cole_Voeller]

Good to know- Coppersafe is in my local store luckily.
Luckily I have my mandarin trained on Pellets.
All I have for filter media other than the rock and sand is carbon cartridges unfortunately. Ive had one in there for over 4 months though. Would that be okay to use? Or would the carbon still be effective!

 

[Cole_Voeller]

Also, how much reagent do I need to buy for the copper checker?

 

[MnFish1]

I have my corals in a frag tank at the moment.
I need to remove inverts for 81°? What do I do with them? I can’t put them in the QT tanks can I?

You would put them with your corals

 

[MnFish1]

I have my corals in a frag tank at the moment.
I need to remove inverts for 81°? What do I do with them? I can’t put them in the QT tanks can I?

I'm not sure I entirely understand your question - If you're saying - you have to keep certain things in the tank you're wanting to keep fallow - then do the usual temperature - at 78 degrees for 76 days

 

[52728299]

No - fishless for 45 to 60 days if you had an outbreak and coppersafe is similar to copperpower
76 days was old rule and studies have shown lifecycle of ich is much shorter

Im not the op sorry but I have a couple qt systems going right now. I've noticed leaving a little bit of rock in there helps tremendously with water quality. I know it absorbs the copper a bit and you have to keep it in check but I personally find the tradeoff kind of worth it. I find hob filters to be pretty useless. Am I dumb in thinking this way tho?

 

[Cole_Voeller]

Sure, That wouldn’t be an issue. I will he running that tank fishless as well since I used tools between tanks. I can throw some food in for them every once in a while.

 

[Cole_Voeller]

I'm not sure I entirely understand your question - If you're saying - you have to keep certain things in the tank you're wanting to keep fallow - then do the usual temperature - at 78 degrees for 76 days

Yeah I got confused. I’ll put inverts in frag and put DT to 81.

 

[Cole_Voeller]

Im not the op sorry but I have a couple qt systems going right now. I've noticed leaving a little bit of rock in there helps tremendously with water quality. I know it absorbs the copper a bit and you have to keep it in check but I personally find the tradeoff kind of worth it. I find hob filters to be pretty useless. Am I dumb in thinking this way tho?

I actually really like them. But I can understand where you’re coming from. Keeping up on the copper levels with the rock just seems pretty difficult, and then I can’t use that rock every again.

 

[MnFish1]

Im not the op sorry but I have a couple qt systems going right now. I've noticed leaving a little bit of rock in there helps tremendously with water quality. I know it absorbs the copper a bit and you have to keep it in check but I personally find the tradeoff kind of worth it. I find hob filters to be pretty useless. Am I dumb in thinking this way tho?

I think this is a mistake - Others will say it's not. Given the NARROW therapeutic index of copper (i.e. too low - not good - too high not good). If you find it's worth it - thats fine - But - IMHO - You are not dumb - but misguided - thinking this way. Some people are of the opinion that using plastic piping instead of rock hiding places is somehow more 'natural'. If that were the case, submarines, and oil rigs would not be the most diverse new reef habitats on the planet Right? Keep it simple. No rock - again IMHO

EDIT - I did not mean submarines - lol - I meant sunken ships