High Ca

[nickm]

I have a question about calcium being high in my reef tank. So, I started reef moonshiners' method and upon doing the ICP test both were high. Ca test 1 was at 812, test 2 is at 902. After the first ICP I did water a couple 20% water changes and calcium was reading high still. After second icp I have been testing every other day to see if it comes down with my Salifert test kit and is reading high. I stopped dosing A part of TM balling method due to it being high. What could keep it high like it is. This past week I did 3 10g water changes with fresh mixed water. With the salifert it was reading past 500 which is max for the tester. Monday morning, I will be sending out an ICP to see where it is at. the system is a 40-breeder display with a 40-breeder sump. 2-part I'm doing the Tropic Marin balling method with A and K trace elements. I use Red Sea carbon for water polishing.

KH- 8.3
Ca- 500 w /salifert
Sa- 1.026

 

[Miami Reef]

What salt are you using?

What 2 part system are you using? Is there any chance you made the calcium concentration too high?

What is the calcium testing in newly made saltwater?

Is the calcium 500ppm right now? 500ppm is fine, but I wouldn’t dose anymore calcium until it starts depleting.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

500 ppm is not the max you can read. Use a second syringe of titrant to get to the color endpoint, and add the values together.

I agree: test some new salt water.

 

[nickm]

What salt are you using?

Tropic Marin Pro

What 2 part system are you using? Is there any chance you made the calcium concentration too high?

Tropic Marin Balling method

What is the calcium testing in newly made saltwater?

The last time it was 420ppm

Is the calcium 500ppm right now? 500ppm is fine, but I wouldn’t dose anymore calcium until it starts depleting.

I’m not dosing calcium for at least a month and the last time icp was tested it was 902. I thought 500 is max result you could achieve with the salifert test kit.

 

[nickm]

500 ppm is not the max you can read. Use a second syringe of titrant to get to the color endpoint, and add the values together.

I agree: test some new salt water.

What could be causing it to be high without dosing any calcium? New salt water was tested at 420ppm. I did not know I could use a second syringe of titrant. I will try that next.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

What could be causing it to be high without dosing any calcium? New salt water was tested at 420ppm. I did not know I could use a second syringe of titrant. I will try that next.

Test error, most likely. Calcium cannot rise that much on its own.

 

[nickm]

Test error, most likely. Calcium cannot rise that much on its own.

Icp 2 different times?

 

[Miami Reef]

Icp 2 different times?

What ICP company did you use?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Icp 2 different times?

Which company?

Did you ever see it lower before that? How?

 

[bushdoc]

First-Salifert changed testing methodology few years ago.
Second, generally Ca hobby test kits also react to Mg, hence one of the steps in test kits is to precipitate Mg and then test for Ca. If your Mg is very high and if or you didn't precipitate whole Mg, your result is a sum of Ca and some Mg.

 

[nickm]

What ICP company did you use?

Which company?

Did you ever see it lower before that? How?

I used Reef Moonshiner's ICP-OES Test kit. Yes I have seen it lower. It was around the 25x to 3xx range up until October. I was using the Hanna checkers when it was that low. The icp is what raised concern. Then read that the Hanna checkers have been known to give bad readings. That’s what prompted me to use Salifert.

 

[nickm]

First-Salifert changed testing methodology few years ago.
Second, generally Ca hobby test kits also react to Mg, hence one of the steps in test kits is to precipitate Mg and then test for Ca. If your Mg is very high and if or you didn't precipitate whole Mg, your result is a sum of Ca and some Mg.

Yes so I was using Salifert’s new testing methodology. My mag is 13xx- low 14xx. The most recent test it was at 1369

 

[Miami Reef]

I think the calcium value is real if 2 ICP tests and hobby kits are matching.

But I’m not sure what’s causing it. Are you dosing any purple up etc?

 

[nickm]

I think the calcium value is real if 2 ICP tests and hobby kits are matching.

Yes but I don’t know why. I read on another thread that it could be sand and rock in dissolution. Then she started to dose kalk and all was well. So idk, I was going to dose Kalk for ph stability after I used up my co2 media.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Yes but I don’t know why. I read on another thread that it could be sand and rock in dissolution. Then she started to dose kalk and all was well. So idk, I was going to dose Kalk for ph stability after I used up my co2 media.

No, it cannot, unless you are adding mineral acids to the tank, constantly depleting the alkalinity.

Here's the reason, and why I stated that calcium does not just rise on its own by any amount like this.

If calcium carbonate rock and sand dissolves, as it typically will very slowly over time, you release a bit under 20 ppm of calcium for each 2.8 dKH of alk.

Thus, for calcium to rise by 500 ppm to 900+ ppm requires a release of 70+ dKH of alk.

There's just not any reasonable way to get rid of all that alk that does not also involve removing that amount of calcium again.

IF it is real, it is more likely you added it in a way that you do not realize (such as tap water for top off) or you used a salt mix that was a bad batch or a partial batch that was very inhomogeneous, and you used the part where most of the calcium ended up.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Have you tried that salifert kit on new salt water?

Can you post the entire ICP result?

 

[nickm]

Have you tried that salifert kit on new salt water?

Can you post the entire ICP result?

I just sent out another test this morning.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

What salt mix are you using?

The strontium is also very high, and very unusual.

@Christoph can you shed any light on the calcium values here?

 

[nickm]

What salt mix are you using?

The strontium is also very high, and very unusual.

@Christoph can you shed any light on the calcium values here?

I’m using Tropic Marin Pro salt. So that’s awhile ago. I just sent another sample off this morning. But im having growth with new nubs growing and great polyp extension as far as I can tell.

 

[Christoph]

What salt mix are you using?

The strontium is also very high, and very unusual.

@Christoph can you shed any light on the calcium values here?

Hi Randy, Hi Nick

just looked at the raw data, and can confirm a very high Calcium level.

However the measured level has a higher level of uncertainty, because we are already out of our calibrated range. Still if we are assuming a higher potential testing error (up to 10% is realistic in this case), the calcium level is way too high.

Both our methods used to measure calcium (in this case ICP-OES and Cation-IC) agree on the significantly elevated Calcium. So interferences etc can be ruled out 100%, since those methods use very different principles of measurement.

If you are using artificial rockwork/ceramics etc those might leach readily soluble forms of calcium, what could be the case here. Recommended would be water changes with a low Calcium salt (you can for example use Oceamo Corrector with zero Calcium, if you can obtain it at your location) and keeping a close eye on alkalinity.

best regards,
Christoph

EdIt: Since Sr is also so high i would think towards (accidental) overdosing of a Ca/Sr supplement