Help! Cycling with Microbe-Lift, without Ammonia??

[aztoza]

Hey all, I am prepping to get water and start my tank cycle! I was comfortable with the process of using Dr. Tim's and the included ammonia for a fishless cycle. Problem is, I can't get the Dr. Tim's products where I am (living abroad atm). And I cannot find suitable ammonia (it's all cleaning products and can't be sure it's pure). What we have here is Microbe-Lift, Special Blend and Nite-Out intended to use together, each with its own directions. But the "first step" in the directions is to add a fish...

Here is the advice I got at the fish store: 1. Dose products as says on the box, keep up with maintenance doses 2. Wait 1 month with tank empty 3. Add one fish and wait 3 weeks 4. Advanced store-test of the water. Will this actually work?? I really thought you needed an ammonia source...and we REALLY would like to add that clownfish last not first. Any advice is appreciated, thanks! Really tempted to just import the Dr. Tim's kit and get reliable ammonia *sigh*

 

[TX_REEF]

You can just toss in a raw shrimp or "ghost feed" with fish food and let it decompose as an ammonia source to establish the nitrifying bacteria.

 

[PharmrJohn]

You can just toss in a raw shrimp or "ghost feed" with fish food and let it decompose as an ammonia source to establish the nitrifying bacteria.

Yep.+1. One shrimp should do the trick. However, I would wait 2 months before adding the first fish and only when ammonia reads zero.. But this is just me.

 

[aztoza]

Yep.+1. One shrimp should do the trick. However, I would wait 2 months before adding the first fish and only when ammonia reads zero.. But this is just me.

Hmm ok, shrimp seemed like not a great method during our research, but guess we may not have a better option. Thanks!

 

[Dan_P]

Hey all, I am prepping to get water and start my tank cycle! I was comfortable with the process of using Dr. Tim's and the included ammonia for a fishless cycle. Problem is, I can't get the Dr. Tim's products where I am (living abroad atm). And I cannot find suitable ammonia (it's all cleaning products and can't be sure it's pure). What we have here is Microbe-Lift, Special Blend and Nite-Out intended to use together, each with its own directions. But the "first step" in the directions is to add a fish...

Here is the advice I got at the fish store: 1. Dose products as says on the box, keep up with maintenance doses 2. Wait 1 month with tank empty 3. Add one fish and wait 3 weeks 4. Advanced store-test of the water. Will this actually work?? I really thought you needed an ammonia source...and we REALLY would like to add that clownfish last not first. Any advice is appreciated, thanks! Really tempted to just import the Dr. Tim's kit and get reliable ammonia *sigh*

Can you find ammonium chloride or ammonium carbonate (used in baking and in smelling salts)?

 

[Dan_P]

Hey all, I am prepping to get water and start my tank cycle! I was comfortable with the process of using Dr. Tim's and the included ammonia for a fishless cycle. Problem is, I can't get the Dr. Tim's products where I am (living abroad atm). And I cannot find suitable ammonia (it's all cleaning products and can't be sure it's pure). What we have here is Microbe-Lift, Special Blend and Nite-Out intended to use together, each with its own directions. But the "first step" in the directions is to add a fish...

Here is the advice I got at the fish store: 1. Dose products as says on the box, keep up with maintenance doses 2. Wait 1 month with tank empty 3. Add one fish and wait 3 weeks 4. Advanced store-test of the water. Will this actually work?? I really thought you needed an ammonia source...and we REALLY would like to add that clownfish last not first. Any advice is appreciated, thanks! Really tempted to just import the Dr. Tim's kit and get reliable ammonia *sigh*

The Nite-Out product looks like the source of nitrifying bacteria. The other product you can live without unless you are thinking of rotting shrimp to generate ammonia instead just adding ammonia via ammonium chloride or ammonium carbonate.

 

[PharmrJohn]

Hmm ok, shrimp seemed like not a great method during our research, but guess we may not have a better option. Thanks!

Yeah, this method has been used for a long time. I did this myself 15 years ago. And I plan on a repeat performance. The WORST I've ever heard of are people who use urine to start a cycle! I've seen threads just recently on whether an OP should try this method. BTW, I recommend against it.

 

[TX_REEF]

Hmm ok, shrimp seemed like not a great method during our research, but guess we may not have a better option. Thanks!

it is potentially smelly, but you only have to deal with it once. You can run activated carbon to help deal with that

 

[Formulator]

This might be an unpopular opinion, but just add a single clownfish or damsel. It should be fine, and that’s why it is suggested on the bottle instructions… The whole point of Dr. Tims is to be able to cycle with fish since you don’t have to wait for bacteria to naturally inoculate your tank. One hardy fish like a damsel or clown is not going to generate more ammonia than the bottled bacteria can handle. And I’m not promoting fish homicide here, but if it did die for some reason, the body becomes your ammonia source to finish cycling.

If you are going to wait 2 months to add fish, why even bother with the bottled stuff?

 

[aztoza]

Yeah, this method has been used for a long time. I did this myself 15 years ago. And I plan on a repeat performance. The WORST I've ever heard of are people who use urine to start a cycle! I've seen threads just recently on whether an OP should try this method. BTW, I recommend against it.

Wow haha!!

 

[aztoza]

This might be an unpopular opinion, but just add a single clownfish or damsel. It should be fine, and that’s why it is suggested on the bottle instructions… The whole point of Dr. Tims is to be able to cycle with fish since you don’t have to wait for bacteria to naturally inoculate your tank. One hardy fish like a damsel or clown is not going to generate more ammonia than the bottled bacteria can handle. And I’m not promoting fish homicide here, but if it did die for some reason, the body becomes your ammonia source to finish cycling.

If you are going to wait 2 months to add fish, why even bother with the bottled stuff?

I might be open to that, except that the clowfish/damsels are so territorial and can bully anything else in the tank, and it is a small tank...goby needs to be first I'd think, and they're not as "hardy".

 

[BubbleBuddy]

it is potentially smelly, but you only have to deal with it once. You can run activated carbon to help deal with that

It can’t smell worse than the Microbe-lift. I use the Microbe-lift Special Blend once a month for bacteria diversity and it reeks. My wife makes me dose via a syringe that I fill outside because of the odor. No complaints on the product.

 

[Formulator]

I might be open to that, except that the clowfish/damsels are so territorial and can bully anything else in the tank, and it is a small tank...goby needs to be first I'd think, and they're not as "hardy".

I agree with you on the damsels, but I never had a problem with my clown fish. They were the first addition to my tank when I cycled many years ago and I’ve added many more fish since then. I did have to remove the damsel I added when I was first starting up and that’s always an option, i.e. remove damsel and return it to LFS after the cycle completes. Goby’s are pretty hardy too though. Or you could do a blue chromis. Just don’t go throwing a wrasse or anthia in there…

 

[aztoza]

The Nite-Out product looks like the source of nitrifying bacteria. The other product you can live without unless you are thinking of rotting shrimp to generate ammonia instead just adding ammonia via ammonium chloride or ammonium carbonate.

I can get 2lbs. of ammonium chloride, used to treat kidney stones in goats not sure we want that much lying about...but an option nonetheless.

 

[Formulator]

I can get 2lbs. of ammonium chloride, used to treat kidney stones in goats not sure we want that much lying about...but an option nonetheless.

Its a common component of fertilizers as well. Relatively safe as long as kept away from bleach and some other compounds that I highly doubt you have in your home.

If you do go that route just make sure you have a way to dispose of it. Not something you should throw into the trash for the land fill. Very environmentally toxic stuff.

 

[aztoza]

Thanks so much everyone! I think I'm starting to get a plan of what to do, and feel I can go get the water now =)

 

[PapaFishRocks]

Yeah, this method has been used for a long time. I did this myself 15 years ago. And I plan on a repeat performance. The WORST I've ever heard of are people who use urine to start a cycle! I've seen threads just recently on whether an OP should try this method. BTW, I recommend against it.

I tried this method, but fell off the ladder trying to wee into the tank.