Frustrated Newbie

[punkieg0]

Hi All,
Since you all have been so helpful before I thought I would post here to get some thoughts.
Still new to the hobby, only getting into in January so many things are still new to me.
I set the tank up and let it cycle- didn't add my first fish until April.
Current stock list:
2- clownfish
2- pajama cardinals
1- diamond goby
1- aptasia eating filefish
lots of CUC

I have a 75 gallon Marlineland tank so no sump. I do have a Fluval Fx4 for filtration and Ice Cap 3k gyre. Also about 70ish lbs of rock. Running 1 Fluval Marine 3.0 light.
I do regular water changes and filter cleanings.

I have had some fish disappear - I am holding out hope they pop out some day but the bicolored blenny has been missing for a few months. I recently had 2 puffer fish and a lemonpeel angle die quite rapidly on me (within hours). I took my water into a local fish store to see if my testing was accurate- I have 0 for ammonia and nitrites and about 10-15 for nitrates. They also got the same in their testing.
I figured I must be missing something to have my fish die so quickly, yet my original fish still alive and swimming around.

I am at the point that I am ready to throw in the towel on this. I have had nothing but stress with this tank rather than any enjoyment. I would love to add some coral and some day an anemone.
I was thinking about getting an AIO so I could have the smaller sump area and see if a smaller but more manageable system might be a better fit. Something like the IM 40 or the Fluval M90.

Also, last night while I was inspecting the tank I noticed what I think to be a worm- I hear that can be beneficial depending on what kind. I haven't seen enough of it for long enough to ID it.

So there it is. I don't know if I am looking for advice or venting. I see beautiful tanks out there but feel like I can't achieve that with my own tank.

 

[flchamp89]

Probably just a bristle worm. With the fish mysteries..... Hard to say but I'd say your current list is plenty. I value a low bioload as it put things in our favor.

 

[motortrendz]

It could be how your acclimating the new fish or where and how the fish were originally collected...

Have you tried fish from a different LFS?

What is your process of acclimating?

 

[cancun]

Hi there! Good thoughts on the acclimating question....as well as what salinity does your LFS keep their fish as opposed to yours? Hang in there.....it will get better if you stick it out....I know this hobby can be both frustrating and rewarding at the same time. Over the years there were many times I wanted to throw in the towel. I used to be addicted to going to make the LFS rounds every weekend. I would come home with a new fish or coral, then I ended up with a over stocked tank etc. Now I rarely go to my LFS unless I need fish food. My tank is in great shape and I am finally able to sit and enjoy it. I think the hardest thing to overcome when no to the hobby is adding jut "one" more fish, or adding fish that are too big for your tank, or who are incompatible. You can't rely on the LFS to steer you in the right direction. That's what we are here for!

 

[Oldreefer44]

First requirement is patience. Lack thereof has been the ruin of many a reefer. Secondly, I lost many a fish mysteriously until I put a screen top on my tank. Thirdly, most of us would recommend not using any mechanical filtration other than a good skimmer. Cannister filters are traps for things that can cause dramatic fluctuations in harmful pollutants. Also, IMO a dwarf angels and puffers are at best iffy in a 75 gallon with no sump. Worm is probably beneficial. I have dozens in my system if not hundreds. Start by ensuring that your water quality is stable and consistently within parameters

 

[cancun]

First requirement is patience. Lack thereof has been the ruin of many a reefer. Secondly, I lost many a fish mysteriously until I put a screen top on my tank. Thirdly, most of us would recommend not using any mechanical filtration other than a good skimmer. Cannister filters are traps for things that can cause dramatic fluctuations in harmful pollutants. Also, IMO a dwarf angels and puffers are at best iffy in a 75 gallon with no sump. Worm is probably beneficial. I have dozens in my system if not hundreds. Start by ensuring that your water quality is stable and consistently within parameters

Excellent point for the OP! Patience, patience, patience!

 

[punkieg0]

For acclimation I use the float method for all my fish. Salinity I have been using 1.024 and the LFS is the same.
The 2 that died rapidly did come from the same place - what I thought of as the “better” place in town. We only have 2 (and I don’t count the petsmart/animart locations)

The worm creeps me out- but likely it has been there and I just now noticed it.

 

[cancun]

For acclimation I use the float method for all my fish. Salinity I have been using 1.024 and the LFS is the same.
The 2 that died rapidly did come from the same place - what I thought of as the “better” place in town. We only have 2 (and I don’t count the petsmart/animart locations)

The worm creeps me out- but likely it has been there and I just now noticed it.

As far as acclimation goes.....what I do is I only buy my fish from the two LFS I use, I buy the fish out of one of their coral tanks or display tank because the salinity matches mine a 1.025. Their other tanks are at 1.018 or lower salinity with low levels of copper. I then take them home a drip acclimate them for 45-60 minutes. Even though the salinity is the same I still drip acclimate.

 

[Salt & Peper]

drip acclimation is by far your best bet for saltwater fish. now floating dose work great for freshwater.

 

[Rscott]

Hang in there

What is your source of water?
Buying water? Rodi? Tap with conditioner?
Perhaps something is in the water that is not going well

 

[Marco S]

What are your other parameters? Such as Temp, PH and Phosphate? Salinity is not the only thing that you need to acclimate your fish to and PH and Temp are big. Drastic changes in either can kill a fish fast. Your initial stock list are pretty hardy fish and they are already used to your water parameters so they will likely survive, but the new fish may be more sensitive to PH and Temp swings even though the salinity is the same.

While I do not drip acclimate, I do test the salinity, PH and temp and slowly add water to the floating bag until they are the same, dumping water as needed to continue the process. Here are the instructions on acclimation that ships with LiveAquaria livestock to give you an example of what you should be doing...

"
Floating Method

1. Turn off aquarium lights.
   
   
2. Dim the lights in the room where the shipping box will be opened. Never open the box in bright light - severe stress or trauma may result from sudden exposure to bright light.
   
   
3. Float the sealed bag in the aquarium for 15 minutes (Fig. A). Never open the shipping bag at this time. This step allows the water in the shipping bag to adjust slowly to the temperature in the aquarium, while maintaining a high level of dissolved oxygen.
   
   
4. After floating the sealed shipping bag for 15 minutes, cut open the bag just under the metal clip (Fig. B) and roll the top edge of the bag down one inch to create an air pocket within the lip of the bag. This will enable the bag to float on the surface of the water (Fig. C). For heavy pieces of live coral that will submerge the shipping bag, place the bag containing the coral in a plastic bowl or specimen container.
   
   
5. Add 1/2 cup of aquarium water to the shipping bag (Fig. D).
   
   
6. Repeat step 5 every four minutes until the shipping bag is full.
   
   
7. Lift the shipping bag from the aquarium and discard half the water from the bag (Fig. E).
   
   
8. Float the shipping bag in the aquarium again and proceed to add 1/2 cup of aquarium water to the shipping bag every four minutes until the bag is full.
   
   
9. Net aquatic life from the shipping bag and release into the aquarium (Fig. F).
   
   
10. Remove the filled shipping bag from the aquarium and discard the water. Never release shipping water directly into the aquarium.

Drip Method
This method is considered more advanced. It is geared toward sensitive inhabitants such as corals, shrimp, sea stars, and wrasses. You will need airline tubing and must be willing to monitor the entire process. Gather a clean, 3 or 5-gallon bucket designated for aquarium use only. If acclimating both fish and invertebrates, use a separate bucket for each.

1. Start with Steps 1-3 of the floating method to acclimate water temperature.
   
   
2. Carefully empty the contents of the bags (including the water) into the buckets (Fig. G), making sure not to expose sensitive invertebrates to the air. Depending on the amount of water in each bag, this may require tilting the bucket at a 45 degree angle to make sure the animals are fully submerged (Fig. H). You may need a prop or wedge to help hold the bucket in this position until there is enough liquid in the bucket to put it back to a level position.
   
   
3. Using airline tubing, set up and run a siphon drip line from the main aquarium to each bucket. You’ll need separate airline tubing for each bucket used. Tie several loose knots in the airline tubing, or use a plastic or other non-metal airline control valve, (Fig. I), to regulate flow from the aquarium. It is also a good idea to secure the airline tubing in place with an airline holder. The Doctors Foster and Smith Acclimation Kit is a convenient alternative that simplifies the drip acclimation process.
   
   
4. Begin a siphon by sucking on the end of the airline tubing you'll be placing into each of the buckets. When water begins flowing through the tubing, adjust the drip (by tightening one of the knots or adjusting the control valve) to a rate of about 2-4 drips per second (Fig. J).
   
   
5. When the water volume in the bucket doubles, discard half and begin the drip again until the volume doubles once more – about one hour.
   
   
6. At this point, the specimens can be transferred to the aquarium. Sponges, clams, and gorgonias should never be directly exposed to air. Gently scoop them out of the drip bucket with the specimen bag, making sure they’re fully covered in water. Submerge the bag underwater in the aquarium and gently remove the specimen from the bag. Next, seal off the bag underwater by twisting the opening, and remove it from the aquarium. Discard both the bag and the enclosed water. A tiny amount of the diluted water will escape into the aquarium; this is O.K. Also, to avoid damage, please remember never to touch the "fleshy" part of live coral when handling.

"

Hope that helps.

 

[John Hathaway]

The only thing I would add, set up a QT, follow Marco's advice for acclimatising, and monitor in QT for a couple of weeks before putting anywhere near your display tank. Make sure QT mirrors the parameters in your display obviously, or carry out the same acclimation routine again.

 

[mattybecks]

Hi there! Good thoughts on the acclimating question....as well as what salinity does your LFS keep their fish as opposed to yours? Hang in there.....it will get better if you stick it out....I know this hobby can be both frustrating and rewarding at the same time. Over the years there were many times I wanted to throw in the towel. I used to be addicted to going to make the LFS rounds every weekend. I would come home with a new fish or coral, then I ended up with a over stocked tank etc. Now I rarely go to my LFS unless I need fish food. My tank is in great shape and I am finally able to sit and enjoy it. I think the hardest thing to overcome when no to the hobby is adding jut "one" more fish, or adding fish that are too big for your tank, or who are incompatible. You can't rely on the LFS to steer you in the right direction. That's what we are here for!

haha this is so true...

 

[punkieg0]

What are your other parameters? Such as Temp, PH and Phosphate? Salinity is not the only thing that you need to acclimate your fish to and PH and Temp are big. Drastic changes in either can kill a fish fast. Your initial stock list are pretty hardy fish and they are already used to your water parameters so they will likely survive, but the new fish may be more sensitive to PH and Temp swings even though the salinity is the same.

While I do not drip acclimate, I do test the salinity, PH and temp and slowly add water to the floating bag until they are the same, dumping water as needed to continue the process. Here are the instructions on acclimation that ships with LiveAquaria livestock to give you an example of what you should be doing...

"
Floating Method

1. Turn off aquarium lights.
   
   
2. Dim the lights in the room where the shipping box will be opened. Never open the box in bright light - severe stress or trauma may result from sudden exposure to bright light.
   
   
3. Float the sealed bag in the aquarium for 15 minutes (Fig. A). Never open the shipping bag at this time. This step allows the water in the shipping bag to adjust slowly to the temperature in the aquarium, while maintaining a high level of dissolved oxygen.
   
   
4. After floating the sealed shipping bag for 15 minutes, cut open the bag just under the metal clip (Fig. B) and roll the top edge of the bag down one inch to create an air pocket within the lip of the bag. This will enable the bag to float on the surface of the water (Fig. C). For heavy pieces of live coral that will submerge the shipping bag, place the bag containing the coral in a plastic bowl or specimen container.
   
   
5. Add 1/2 cup of aquarium water to the shipping bag (Fig. D).
   
   
6. Repeat step 5 every four minutes until the shipping bag is full.
   
   
7. Lift the shipping bag from the aquarium and discard half the water from the bag (Fig. E).
   
   
8. Float the shipping bag in the aquarium again and proceed to add 1/2 cup of aquarium water to the shipping bag every four minutes until the bag is full.
   
   
9. Net aquatic life from the shipping bag and release into the aquarium (Fig. F).
   
   
10. Remove the filled shipping bag from the aquarium and discard the water. Never release shipping water directly into the aquarium.

Drip Method
This method is considered more advanced. It is geared toward sensitive inhabitants such as corals, shrimp, sea stars, and wrasses. You will need airline tubing and must be willing to monitor the entire process. Gather a clean, 3 or 5-gallon bucket designated for aquarium use only. If acclimating both fish and invertebrates, use a separate bucket for each.

1. Start with Steps 1-3 of the floating method to acclimate water temperature.
   
   
2. Carefully empty the contents of the bags (including the water) into the buckets (Fig. G), making sure not to expose sensitive invertebrates to the air. Depending on the amount of water in each bag, this may require tilting the bucket at a 45 degree angle to make sure the animals are fully submerged (Fig. H). You may need a prop or wedge to help hold the bucket in this position until there is enough liquid in the bucket to put it back to a level position.
   
   
3. Using airline tubing, set up and run a siphon drip line from the main aquarium to each bucket. You’ll need separate airline tubing for each bucket used. Tie several loose knots in the airline tubing, or use a plastic or other non-metal airline control valve, (Fig. I), to regulate flow from the aquarium. It is also a good idea to secure the airline tubing in place with an airline holder. The Doctors Foster and Smith Acclimation Kit is a convenient alternative that simplifies the drip acclimation process.
   
   
4. Begin a siphon by sucking on the end of the airline tubing you'll be placing into each of the buckets. When water begins flowing through the tubing, adjust the drip (by tightening one of the knots or adjusting the control valve) to a rate of about 2-4 drips per second (Fig. J).
   
   
5. When the water volume in the bucket doubles, discard half and begin the drip again until the volume doubles once more – about one hour.
   
   
6. At this point, the specimens can be transferred to the aquarium. Sponges, clams, and gorgonias should never be directly exposed to air. Gently scoop them out of the drip bucket with the specimen bag, making sure they’re fully covered in water. Submerge the bag underwater in the aquarium and gently remove the specimen from the bag. Next, seal off the bag underwater by twisting the opening, and remove it from the aquarium. Discard both the bag and the enclosed water. A tiny amount of the diluted water will escape into the aquarium; this is O.K. Also, to avoid damage, please remember never to touch the "fleshy" part of live coral when handling.

"

Hope that helps.

I will be testing again tonight but as I said everything was showing 0 for Ammonia and Nitrites, nitrates were 10-15.
I do follow the float from LiveAquaria since the majority of my livestock came from them.

 

[Jekyl]

I second the question on water source. Is it RODI? Tap? Could be adding chlorine or chloramine which could be a real issue.

 

[Rogued_Reefer]

Hi there ,

We have all been frustrated at one point or another and let me tell you not giving up is far more rewarding.
Like everyone has already said I think you might be rushing the process a little bit and stocking your tank too fast.

The most important thing for you should be to have stable parameters and good water quality. When I started I quickly learned a lesson... “sometimes things happen in your tank and you’ll never know why” that’s nature and we have a small piece of it in our homes. I had 2 fish die for no apparent reason and obviously like a noob I freaked out and started trying things until someone told me this exact words
“Chill the F out bro, let the tank settle and recover from the losses. Stop putting your hands in there for a couple of weeks and see the improvement.”

I did exactly that and while I let the tank settle I set up a quarantine tank to keep new fish in to look for any issues and keep em from stressing too much and voila no more deaths since then.

#305reefclub

 

[punkieg0]

I second the question on water source. Is it RODI? Tap? Could be adding chlorine or chloramine which could be a real issue.

I usually buy my water from the fish store so it is RODI or Saltwater when I need that.

 

[Danyal khan]

Try recalibration your refractometer and then test the water. It could also be that one of your fish is a bully and kills any new additions that haven't settled in.

 

[xiholdtruex]

I would let the tank settle if your losing fish. Second I would qt new fish to make sure they are good and don't infect your old tank inhabitants . I would recommend drip acclimation for new fish. I have done both and never any issues with just floating. Maybe they were sick from the get go, in a qt you can keep a close eye on them and see if anything goes wrong quickly and clearly.

Good luck and dont give up I have had many failure in the reef hobby and it is very rewarding. Have patience it will work out.

 

[Rogued_Reefer]

I would let the tank settle if your losing fish. Second I would qt new fish to make sure they are good and don't infect your old tank inhabitants . I would recommend drip acclimation for new fish. I have done both and never any issues with just floating. Maybe they were sick from the get go, in a qt you can keep a close eye on them and see if anything goes wrong quickly and clearly.

Good luck and dont give up I have had many failure in the reef hobby and it is very rewarding. Have patience it will work out.

Thanks for stopping by bro!